Farrell

[a700hitter]

anything less then 4-2 on this homestand and i predict DD will fire JF.

I would hope that you would be right, but I don't share your confidence on this issue. Anyway, hopefully we pay well enough that it doesn't become an issue.

[cp176]

Are you under the impression that managers win and lose games and not players? I disagree. As someone else quoted from a former MLB manager, "the difference between a good manager and a bad one is a great bullpen."

 

You just complimented Francona's masterful handling of the Guardians bullpen, but I looked them up. They have basically used 7 relievers who have pitched in 21, 19, 18, 18, 16, 14, and 13 innings, respectively--Miller, FYI, has pitched in 18--and whose worst ERA is 3.57, 2d worst is 2.41, and other five ERA's are all under 2. Seems to me they come pretty close to being a great, healthy bullpen. You think Farrell couldn't use a bullpen like that?

 

Is it Farrell's fault the guys aren't hitting at anywhere near the level as last year when he was also the manager? Or 2013 for that matter?

 

Before this season we all thought the rotation would be great with Sale, Price, Porcello (Cy Young winner), ERod, Wright, and Pomeranz only if needed. Porcello is struggling except on gopher balls. ERod is good and Sale even better. But Price and Wright are on the DL. And Pomeranz right now is our #4 starter with a player to be named later as #5.

 

Ironically, I do hold Farrell accountable for wins and losses, but agree with the notion that maybe he stays because no one else worth using is available.

 

For the most part I agree with you Max. I'm really not a Farrell fan though. I find him to be too predictable for my liking. he seldom if ever strays from the path that most managers seem to be taking whether it has to do with on or off field managing. There is something wrong with respect to what is going on but I don't think that it can all be dumped on Farrell's shoulders. I think that a majority of the players on this team ore over rated and that people expect things from them that we aren't going to see.

[mvp 78]

Fire Farrell SOON!

DFA Buchholz KINDA!

Trade Pedroia

[Slasher9]

Are you under the impression that managers win and lose games and not players? I disagree. As someone else quoted from a former MLB manager, "the difference between a good manager and a bad one is a great bullpen."

 

You just complimented Francona's masterful handling of the Guardians bullpen, but I looked them up. They have basically used 7 relievers who have pitched in 21, 19, 18, 18, 16, 14, and 13 innings, respectively--Miller, FYI, has pitched in 18--and whose worst ERA is 3.57, 2d worst is 2.41, and other five ERA's are all under 2. Seems to me they come pretty close to being a great, healthy bullpen. You think Farrell couldn't use a bullpen like that?

 

Is it Farrell's fault the guys aren't hitting at anywhere near the level as last year when he was also the manager? Or 2013 for that matter?

 

Before this season we all thought the rotation would be great with Sale, Price, Porcello (Cy Young winner), ERod, Wright, and Pomeranz only if needed. Porcello is struggling except on gopher balls. ERod is good and Sale even better. But Price and Wright are on the DL. And Pomeranz right now is our #4 starter with a player to be named later as #5.

 

Ironically, I do hold Farrell accountable for wins and losses, but agree with the notion that maybe he stays because no one else worth using is available.

 

i dont disagree with any of what you said. but sometimes a manager's head has to roll. even if there is no "better option". and it might be that time......

[mvp 78]

The difference between a great manager and a s***** one is probably only about 5 wins a year. However, those would be a big five wins as it would mean a chance at the playoffs vs sitting at home.

 

#morganmagic

[cp176]

If a change is made, it likely starts with Farrell. I have heard the expression "panic moves" made more than once in here when the front office or the manager does something that someone disagrees with. IMO, even though maybe it should have been done before, changing the manager now might seem a little panicky.

[Maxbialystock]

For the most part I agree with you Max. I'm really not a Farrell fan though. I find him to be too predictable for my liking. he seldom if ever strays from the path that most managers seem to be taking whether it has to do with on or off field managing. There is something wrong with respect to what is going on but I don't think that it can all be dumped on Farrell's shoulders. I think that a majority of the players on this team ore over rated and that people expect things from them that we aren't going to see.

 

I'm not a Farrell fan. I just like to argue plus I honestly don't think managers have that big an effect--particularly in comparison to football and basketball coaches. Right now, though, I think Farrell maybe ain't helping and that what keeps him in Boston is the lack of a good alternative.

[a700hitter]

Farrell's job was saved by the cancer diagnosis in 2015. On his way to his second straight last place finish, his head was on the chopping block. When I heard that there was a big news story about Farrell, I just assumed that he had been fired. But for the cancer, I still believe that Farrell would have been terminated and Lovullo installed.

[cp176]

Farrell's job was saved by the cancer diagnosis in 2015. On his way to his second straight last place finish, his head was on the chopping block. When I heard that there was a big news story about Farrell, I just assumed that he had been fired. But for the cancer, I still believe that Farrell would have been terminated and Lovullo installed.

 

... so do I.

[moonslav59]

...so do I.

[Kimmi]

I'm not a Farrell fan. I just like to argue plus I honestly don't think managers have that big an effect--particularly in comparison to football and basketball coaches. Right now, though, I think Farrell maybe ain't helping and that what keeps him in Boston is the lack of a good alternative.

 

As far as in game decisions go, managers do not have as big an effect as most people think they do. I've always felt that the most important aspect of a manager's job is the management of the players and the clubhouse. IMO, the team's record fall mostly on the players, not Farrell and not Dombrowski.

 

Having said that, when a team underperforms like this one has, and I'm thinking mostly about the sloppy defense, it's fair to question what's going on with the coaching staff.

[Bellhorn04]

http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/trying-times-for-john-farrell-as-boston-red-sox-manager-052317

 

Bye Felicia!

 

This piece doesn't offer any great revelations but it does pretty much cover all the pertinent issues with Farrell.

[a700hitter]

As far as in game decisions go, managers do not have as big an effect as most people think they do. I've always felt that the most important aspect of a manager's job is the management of the players and the clubhouse. IMO, the team's record fall mostly on the players, not Farrell and not Dombrowski.

 

Having said that, when a team underperforms like this one has, and I'm thinking mostly about the sloppy defense, it's fair to question what's going on with the coaching staff.

I think a manager's impact on clubhouse chemistry is greatly overstated. If that is the biggest part of their job, just hire a Hall monitor, and fire all the managers. Lineups don't matter. In game management has very little to no impact. First and third base coaches have nothing to do with stupid base running or fielding as that is all learned at levels below the majors. Every team employs a Press Secretary, so we don't need a manager to interact with the press. Managers and coaching staffs are clearly unnecessary appendages -- anachronisms. Fire them and save a few million in salaries and benefits.

[Bellhorn04]

I think being a baseball manager is a fairly demanding job, myself, both on and off the field. I sure as hell wouldn't want to try it.

[Bellhorn04]

Even if the in-game stuff only matters to the tune of a couple of games a season, that's plenty. It can make the difference between playing in the World Series and playing golf. You need every possible edge you can get.

[a700hitter]

I think being a baseball manager is a fairly demanding job, myself, both on and off the field. I sure as hell wouldn't want to try it.

I agree, but there is this school of thought that lineups, game decisions and base running and fielding coaching don't matter. I think those things are important, but if they are right, I don't see managers having a huge impact on clubhouse chemistry. Also, the clubs have travel secretaries and press secretaries. Why would a manger be needed?

[Bellhorn04]

I think being a good manager is kind of a balancing act. In games you have to manage smart and make the right moves but not over-manage. With players you have to support them without letting them take advantage of you.

[mvp 78]

This piece doesn't offer any great revelations but it does pretty much cover all the pertinent issues with Farrell.

 

Ken Rosenthal should be hung by his bowtie. I only posted it as it was a big topic elsewhere.

[cp176]

I agree, but there is this school of thought that lineups, game decisions and base running and fielding coaching don't matter. I think those things are important, but if they are right, I don't see managers having a huge impact on clubhouse chemistry. Also, the clubs have travel secretaries and press secretaries. Why would a manger be needed?

 

You know that they are not right but it still is fun to the alternative thinkers though.

[a700hitter]

You know that they are not right but it still is fun to the alternative thinkers though.

LOL!! But do they realize what conclusion they are coming to when they take these positions?

[cp176]

LOL!! But do they realize what conclusion they are coming to when they take these positions?

 

No I actually do not think that they do. You really can't sterilize this game. Probably why i really enjoy listening to the thoughts of Remy, Eck, and the others who have done the job.

[a700hitter]

That said, FOX’s Ken Rosenthal penned a lengthy column of his own on Farrell’s job security today, noting that while the manager doesn’t necessarily appear to be at immediate risk, there are some Red Sox players that would like to see Farrell defend them more to the Boston media during the team’s struggles. Rosenthal points to the Manny Machado debacle and a more recent dugout altercation with Drew Pomeranz as two instances this season in which Farrell hasn’t looked his best.

I didn't think that Farrell's handling of the Pomeranz situation would sit well with the clubhouse.

[Jasonbay44]

Ken Rosenthal should be hung by his bowtie. I only posted it as it was a big topic elsewhere.

 

I remember when he wrote this gem:

http://www.talksox.com/forum/threads/10929-Ken-Rosenthal-quot-The-Red-Sox-look-very-white-quot

 

Dude is a moron

[Bellhorn04]

I agree, but there is this school of thought that lineups, game decisions and base running and fielding coaching don't matter. I think those things are important, but if they are right, I don't see managers having a huge impact on clubhouse chemistry. Also, the clubs have travel secretaries and press secretaries. Why would a manger be needed?

 

Here's what Kimmi said yesterday: "As far as in game decisions go, managers do not have as big an effect as most people think they do."

 

I'll have to let her elaborate on the exact meaning of that, but it does leaves some 'wiggle room'.

[Bellhorn04]

Ken Rosenthal should be hung by his bowtie. I only posted it as it was a big topic elsewhere.

 

LOL I thought you might react that way.

[Bellhorn04]

I remember when he wrote this gem:

http://www.talksox.com/forum/threads/10929-Ken-Rosenthal-quot-The-Red-Sox-look-very-white-quot

 

Dude is a moron

 

Can't believe he got away with that. If he wrote something like that now he'd be dismissed if not crucified.

[notin]

Can't believe he got away with that. If he wrote something like that now he'd be dismissed if not crucified.

 

Many people misinterpreted that article as condemnation that the Sox were a racist organization, but his point was that their lack of diversity would hurt them signing free agents, especially African American ones. He was pretty explicit about this in the article.

 

And it obviously struck home. The next few off-seasons, the Sox added Mike Cameron and Bill Hall and eventually Carl Crawford.

[S5Dewey]

No I actually do not think that they do. You really can't sterilize this game. Probably why i really enjoy listening to the thoughts of Remy, Eck, and the others who have done the job.

 

Of course, often times the insight from those guys is meaningless because their insight flies in the face of what the statistics say.

 

(Italics is the universally accepted way of indicating sarcasm, right?)

[Bellhorn04]

Many people misinterpreted that article as condemnation that the Sox were a racist organization, but his point was that their lack of diversity would hurt them signing free agents, especially African American ones. He was pretty explicit about this in the article.

 

And it obviously struck home. The next few off-seasons, the Sox added Mike Cameron and Bill Hall and eventually Carl Crawford.

 

You really think our front office started making personnel decisions with help from Ken Rosenthal? That's kind of a scary thought.

[cp176]

Of course, often times the insight from those guys is meaningless because their insight flies in the face of what the statistics say.

 

(Italics is the universally accepted way of indicating sarcasm, right?)

 

got me with the italics stuff SS. i still haven't figured out how to present anything in bold print just yet. lol