2014 Offseason Thread

[mvp 78]

It's why I wrote "could" compete rather than "will." Buch and Masterson are both high variance options. I'm not sure both of them have to be on for the rotation to see success though. One could falter and the rotation could be just fine.

[a700hitter]

It's why I wrote "could" compete rather than "will." Buch and Masterson are both high variance options. I'm not sure both of them have to be on for the rotation to see success though. One could falter and the rotation could be just fine.

If Masterson or Buch fails, they could be okay if Miley or Kelly steps up his game to the next level. If they don't, and only Porcello and one of Buch or Masterson performs, there will be bumps along the way. I am not saying that we need both Buch and Masterson to succeed. If both perform, they will surely be successful. If only one does the job, it will be a bumpy ride.

[BSN07]

BSN and others have made a good point in that we could wait until the trade deadline to make a trade for pitching, but what if those pitchers are signed to extensions by their teams, or we are in deep s*** in the standings by August 1, or we can only rent a pitcher for two months? What does that do for us when Porcello and Masterson become FA after this season? You know if Porcello has a big year and wants big money Prune Face will not ante up for him anymore than he anted up for Lester, who was a much better pitcher. Sign Shields or trade for Hamels if the price is right. We need to build a staff that might stay together for more than one year. With Hamels and Shields we'd have two of them for four or five years.

 

It will just mean the Sox have spots to fill and money to burn. You never know who is going to be available year to year. We know the SP market looks deep next off season. Will all those guys make it to FA? No. But I bet a lot see the huge $ being thrown around and will be tempted to gamble. But regardless a decent amount of those guys will hit FA. You also don't know who will be available via trade. Some team will decide to rebuild, or someone will start getting too pricey via arbitration for some teams liking. Good SP will be available. Now whether or not that falls into the Sox price range $ or prospect wise, we will have to wait and see.

[Palodios]

The Red Sox FO made a big deal about how they depended too much on prospects in 2014, and it led to the downfall.

 

This year, they are depending too much on their pitching prospects. Most of their new signings have been very healthy, but Buchholz is always a disaster, and you never know when bad luck will strike.

[BSN07]

The Scherzer signing does give Boston another option for a starter that they didn't have before. They never were in on Scherzer in the first place. If they can pry either Zimmermann or Strasburg out of Washington then their rotation will be nothing to sneeze at. If they don't we can always see how the division shakes out. The ALE is so mediocre that the Sox are clearly contenders in a very weak field and could wait until the ASB before retooling for a playoff run.

 

What I fail to understand is why Washington signed Scherzer if they are only going to turn around and trade either Zimmermann or Strasburg. Of the three (Scherzer, Zim or Strasburg) I'd rather have Zimmermann in 2015 on my staff.

 

Zimmerman is due for free agency next off season and already turned down a large extension offer. Strasburg is a FA in 2 years and Boras is his agent so there is 0.01 chance of an extension and he will cost one of Boras's generational contracts to sign. They have a hole at 2B and a deep rotation they could trade from to fill it with a quality player. But needless to say it's no guarantee they will move anyone. I can totally see them keeping everyone and going all in this year. I think if they do move anyone it will be Zim to the Brewers.

[User Name]

How are they depending too much on their pitching prospects right now? Also, how do we know they won't add another pitcher (s)? Too many assumptions.

[BSN07]

It looks like right now the prospects are the depth, which seems pretty normal Pal. Maybe we are misunderstanding you.

[iortiz]

What "kool aid?" What "kool aid" has Cherington offered? No offense, but that is nonsense. Also, the rotation isn't a joke. It's average, which isn't good enough to be a surefire bet to compete, but the negative hyperbole is unnecesary. The reason "some will get angry" is that what you're saying is nonsense.

 

What kool aid? nonsense? haha come on man, I know you like Cherrys and all but your boy has been saying over and over again in all media that he feels comfortable and confident with the current rotation going forward, because he thinks it is oks and solid. Sorry but I do not buy that kool aid at all, It is pathetic; it is a bunch of #4s with injury prone issues.

 

Is it a PR strategy? IDK. Maybe they do not want the fans get panic or maybe they are just afraid about tickets or a bit concern about TV rating going forward. IDK. Again....I do not buy that kool aid at all.

[mvp 78]

Ben the boob "If we don't get a true ace this year, we're basically f***ed."

 

Why would he ever say something negative about the team? It's his job to promote the product.

[iortiz]

Israel, a pair of 4's and a pair of 5's and a 3 is not a good hand for a pitching rotation. I like Porcello, but he is not a #1 ace. If he were, Dombrowski certainly would have kept him and extended him knowing that he would lose Scherzer.

 

I do not like the "we'll be ok with a mediocre rotation since the ALE is mediocre" approach at all. Sorry but that is pathetic and L thinking.

 

As you said, Porcello is our No. 1 right now. It sounds scary to me. He won't match other teams' No 1s.

[cp176]

The Red Sox FO made a big deal about how they depended too much on prospects in 2014, and it led to the downfall.

 

This year, they are depending too much on their pitching prospects. Most of their new signings have been very healthy, but Buchholz is always a disaster, and you never know when bad luck will strike.

 

If you mean by prospects, their free agent signings, I agree with you. Will Porcello pitch like he did last year and possibly even get better? Has Masterson healed? Is he really ready to go? Miley - I think that he will be an innings eater but at what level? I hope this all turns out well but as is the case going into spring training there are many unanswered questions. If the rotation has been decided, lets hope for the best.

[User Name]

I do not like the "we'll be ok with a mediocre rotation since the ALE is mediocre" approach at all. Sorry but that is pathetic and L thinking.

 

As you said, Porcello is our No. 1 right now. It sounds scary to me. He won't match other teams' No 1s.

 

But that's an approach that absolutely no one on this site has said they are ok with. What has been said is they can start the year with what they have, and retool on the run during the season. Argue what is actually being said.

[iortiz]

Ben the boob "If we don't get a true ace this year, we're basically f***ed."

 

Why would he ever say something negative about the team? It's his job to promote the product.

 

yeah... but not all fans will drink that kool aid.

[iortiz]

But that's an approach that absolutely no one on this site has said they are ok with. What has been said is they can start the year with what they have, and retool on the run during the season. Argue what is actually being said.

 

haha I'm not arguing the big letters. Still I do not like the "they can start the year with what they have, and retool on the run during the season" since it could be too late at the time or maybe no one valuable could be available.

[User Name]

haha I'm not arguing the big letters. Still I do not like the "they can start the year with what they have, and retool on the run during the season" since it could be too late at the time or maybe no one valuable could be available.

 

I actually agree with you to some extent. What i'm saying is to stick to the actual argument.

[mvp 78]

yeah... but not all fans will drink that kool aid.

 

If you're buying tickets, you're drinking the Kool Aid imo

[iortiz]

The success of the rotation will depend on Buch and Masterson staying healthy, taking all of their starts and hopefully performing as they did when they had good seasons. That is a crap shoot. If one of them falters, the team will be in trouble. If both repeat last year's performance, the season will be a bust. If they stay healthy and perform well, the team will be competitive.

 

The whole rotation is a crap shoot, Ted. Geez They better land a No1. otherwise my trip to Boston won't worth it hahah.

[iortiz]

If you're buying tickets, you're drinking the Kool Aid imo

 

hahaha yeah! I really thought they were going to land at least a No. 1. There's still time, hopefully they get it done.

Edited January 20, 2015 by iortiz

[mvp 78]

The whole rotation is a crap shoot, Ted. Geez They better land a No1. otherwise my trip to Boston won't worth it hahah.

 

No matter what, the #1 won't be pitching at the first homestand anyway. You'll be getting some combination of guys 2-4.

[iortiz]

No matter what, the #1 won't be pitching at the first homestand anyway. You'll be getting some combination of guys 2-4.

 

really? dammit! haha. Porcello better perform as some are projecting.

[Palodios]

How are they depending too much on their pitching prospects right now? Also, how do we know they won't add another pitcher (s)? Too many assumptions.

It looks like right now the prospects are the depth, which seems pretty normal Pal. Maybe we are misunderstanding you.

 

My concern is that the #6 and #7 starters on the depth chart usually end up getting 15-20 starts. They haven't built a buffer between the starters and the prospects.

 

The Red Sox were very loud on most pitchers back in November, but haven't had their name thrown around at all lately-- it sounds like they are done.

[iortiz]

I actually agree with you to some extent. What i'm saying is to stick to the actual argument.

 

Not sure what the "actual argument" is, but It's pretty clear that the majority of the fan base think that we need an extra arm, no one has disputed that. Maybe very few think that we are 2 arms away. I'm in that group.

[User Name]

Not sure what the "actual argument" is, but It's pretty clear that the majority of the fan base think that we need an extra arm, no one has disputed that. Maybe very few think that we are 2 arms away. I'm in that group.

 

You're arguing something that people aren't actually saying. No one (maybe Kimmi but she's hopeful they'll add another starter iirc) has said they are content with the current rotation. When you throw the idea out there that people are advocating for an idea that doesn't exist, you are creating a type of argument that is usually known as a.....wait for it.....strawman argument.

Edited January 20, 2015 by User Name?

[iortiz]

You're arguing something that people aren't actually saying. No one (maybe Kimmi but she's hopeful they'll add another starter iirc) has said they are content with the current rotation. When you throw the idea out there that people are advocating for an idea that doesn't exist, you are creating a type of argument that is usually known as a.....wait for it.....strawman argument,

 

Again, I'm not arguing that.

[iortiz]

... On the other hand, there was a poll on ESPNBoston.com some weeks ago, about the current rotation; not sure if you checked it out but it showed a considerable percentage (40%+ or so) who said that the actual rotation is ok going forward.

[Dojji]

Well there's two questions to be asked here. First and humbler question, are you satisfied with the rotation, and I could see why someone might be satisfied. Second and more ambitious, is, are you excited by the rotation and... no?

 

I can't comment on that poll until I know exactly which of those two questions got asked.

[MJantomaso]

I think its safe to say that we have our 2015 starting rotation set in stone. The players we have are very capable of throwing quality innings but also run the risk of pitching like mongoloids. I suggest taking the optimistic route of believing that they will pitch well. It will help lower your blood pressure until they do indeed implode in the 2015 season.

[cp176]

I think its safe to say that we have our 2015 starting rotation set in stone. The players we have are very capable of throwing quality innings but also run the risk of pitching like mongoloids. I suggest taking the optimistic route of believing that they will pitch well. It will help lower your blood pressure until they do indeed implode in the 2015 season.

 

Good positive outlook for the short term anyway. i like it. Living day to day - might not even be here tomorrow. Of that I am positive.

[a700hitter]

Good positive outlook for the short term anyway. i like it. Living day to day - might not even be here tomorrow. Of that I am positive.

I thought that he was very anti-mongoloid.

[Elktonnick]

I thought that he was very anti-mongoloid.

 

Do the Ulan Bator Yaks have a front line starter? I know they are the class of the Siberian Winter League.