Will Red Sox pursue Japanese Ace - Masahiro Tanaka?

[sk7326]

If a team wants Tanaka, it needs to outbid everyone else and has no idea how much everyone else is bidding (according to the current rules).

 

I also think that Dice-k may have influenced the bidding on Darvish. That contract was such a huge failure that teams may have been hesitant to bid too high. Darvish has arguably been a big success.

 

The Yankees reportedly big 30 million and 15 million on Dice-k and Darvish respectively. I doubt they stay down that low if they really want Tanaka.

 

Not arguably - but Darvish was also much better than Matsuzaka stuff-wise. Of course Matsuzaka was great stuff wise too - that was not the problem. I am not sure how the new posting agreement will work, but I believe finishing in the Top 3 is what matters as Tanaka will have some sort of choice. At least that is what the reports indicate will be part of the new posting agreement.

[marklmw]

Not arguably - but Darvish was also much better than Matsuzaka stuff-wise. Of course Matsuzaka was great stuff wise too - that was not the problem. I am not sure how the new posting agreement will work, but I believe finishing in the Top 3 is what matters as Tanaka will have some sort of choice. At least that is what the reports indicate will be part of the new posting agreement.

Tanaka may choose which team with all things being equal. What club it going to allow Tanaka to take a lower offer ... that would be money that the club looses out on not Tanaka.

[User Name]

Their bid was very short, wasn't it?

 

Yeah, because the Red Sox blew everyone else out of the water by a large margin. The Yankees, iirc, even bid more than what was initially expected to be the price for Darvish.

 

Red Sox= Super Heavy Hitters.

[RedSoxNC84]

I might sound crazy, but I'd actually rather see Tim Hudson in a Sox uni than Tanaka in one.

[Dojji]

Don't see what Hudson provides that you couldn't get from Peavy.

 

We really don't need to be looking for middle to bottom of the rotation guy. Unless you're going right over the top or picking up a total innings horse to slot behind the first two guys, they should probably stand pat and let the youth percolate up to fill their remaining needs.

[Behindenemylines]

With the SP depth the Sox currently have I can't see them bidding for Tanaka. After the Sox signed Dice-K they had 100 million invested in him. Can't see them doing that again.

[marklmw]

I might sound crazy, but I'd actually rather see Tim Hudson in a Sox uni than Tanaka in one.

You are right ... that sounds crazy

[marklmw]

Don't see what Hudson provides that you couldn't get from Peavy.

 

We really don't need to be looking for middle to bottom of the rotation guy. Unless you're going right over the top or picking up a total innings horse to slot behind the first two guys, they should probably stand pat and let the youth percolate up to fill their remaining needs.

 

Agree ... if Boson cannot sign a legit #1 or #2 then why bother. Peavy is a solid 4 or 5.

[Bellhorn04]

Agree ... if Boson cannot sign a legit #1 or #2 then why bother. Peavy is a solid 4 or 5.

 

Peavy had #3 stats last year.

[marklmw]

Peavy had #3 stats last year.

I am putting Lester, Buchholz & Lackey ahead of Peavy

[seabeachfred]

I might sound crazy, but I'd actually rather see Tim Hudson in a Sox uni than Tanaka in one.

 

Not crazy at all NC84, just a feeling and an opinion. However, from where I sit we can get at least the same production and probably more from Lackey and Peavy. Then again, this is just my opinion.

[RedSoxNC84]

You are right ... that sounds crazy

 

Why? Proven track record with tons of MLB experience, durable, and he's not terrible either. Tanaka is a question mark no matter how you look at it.

[RedSoxNC84]

Don't see what Hudson provides that you couldn't get from Peavy.

 

We really don't need to be looking for middle to bottom of the rotation guy. Unless you're going right over the top or picking up a total innings horse to slot behind the first two guys, they should probably stand pat and let the youth percolate up to fill their remaining needs.

 

Hudson would make Dempster the odd man out though, not Peavy.

[redsoxfan3]

I honestly don't get the Hudson rumors. He would be nice to have, but does that mean we shop two of Doubront, Peavy, and Dempster? I do not want to shop Doubront. I think he has a great future in Boston. I would be all for shopping Dempster. I still want Peavy for next year. I highly doubt we sign Hudson and have both Dempster and Doubront in the pen. We do not need Dempster making 13.25M in the pen next year. I understand the idea of depth, and Hudson could be a solid signing if we only had four starters penciled in for next year, or even five, but we have six, plus Webster, RDLR, Workman, Ranaudo, Wright, and Barnes all knocking on the door. Of course Barnes, Ranaudo, etc. need more time in AAA, but we have an abundance of starting pitching depth and you can never really have too much, but signing Hudson does not make sense unless we get rid of Dempster.

 

I am still not sold on Tanaka. He is a question mark that is a 100M+ investment.

[dupree]

I dont understand the Tim Hudson rumors either. Why bring in another pitcher who had success in the NL but in my opinion not transfer to the AL given Hudson has experience in the AL but i just dont see why we need or want him. Too much pitching is never a bad thing but i think Dempster has to be out. If need be eat a lil of his salary and move him. I would rather throw Brandon Workman anyday than Dempster.

[marklmw]

Why? Proven track record with tons of MLB experience, durable, and he's not terrible either. Tanaka is a question mark no matter how you look at it.

 

Ok ... true ... Darish did not have any MLB experience either. Nor Dice K ... Dice K could have been much more successful if he trusted his stuff more ... he nibbled and nibbled ... I think he once loaded the based with walks and then pitched his way out of it allowing no runs. Dice K had the stuff ... not the mindset. What will it cost to bring Hudson in? Nice to have Hudson but at what cost never have I heard what the price tag will be.

[Bellhorn04]

I am putting Lester, Buchholz & Lackey ahead of Peavy

 

OK, if you mean Peavy would be #4 on the Sox I agree.

[sk7326]

I dont understand the Tim Hudson rumors either. Why bring in another pitcher who had success in the NL but in my opinion not transfer to the AL given Hudson has experience in the AL but i just dont see why we need or want him. Too much pitching is never a bad thing but i think Dempster has to be out. If need be eat a lil of his salary and move him. I would rather throw Brandon Workman anyday than Dempster.

 

Ummm ... Hudson was also successful in the AL ... as was Dan Haren ... Dempster should be moved, but if he isn't, that's OK. He is disposable on a playoff roster, but he is invaluable for the marathon. Also - he has a good contract, I would not eat salary without getting something of value coming back.

[Palodios]

Dempster 2013 ERA -- 4.57

 

I just want to point out some of the previous years that these guys have pitched.

 

Lackey 2011 ERA -- 6.41

Doubront 2012 -- 4.86

Lester 2012 ERA -- 4.82

Buchholz 2012 ERA -- 4.56

[Bellhorn04]

Ummm ... Hudson was also successful in the AL ... as was Dan Haren ... Dempster should be moved, but if he isn't, that's OK. He is disposable on a playoff roster, but he is invaluable for the marathon. Also - he has a good contract, I would not eat salary without getting something of value coming back.

 

I think they should make a serious effort to trade either Dempster or Peavy. It it's Dempster and they don't have to pay more a third of his salary, or if it's Peavy and they don't have to pay more than a couple million. Something like that. Then instead of $32 million they've got $40 million plus to spend.

 

I have a strong feeling Dempster or Peavy will be moved.

[Bellhorn04]

Dempster 2013 ERA -- 4.57

 

I just want to point out some of the previous years that these guys have pitched.

 

Lackey 2011 ERA -- 6.41

Doubront 2012 -- 4.86

Lester 2012 ERA -- 4.82

Buchholz 2012 ERA -- 4.56

 

That's true but Dempster's 4.57 was the one that was pretty close to what a lot of people expected.

[User Name]

I think they should make a serious effort to trade either Dempster or Peavy. It it's Dempster and they don't have to pay more a third of his salary, or if it's Peavy and they don't have to pay more than a couple million. Something like that. Then instead of $32 million they've got $40 million plus to spend.

 

I have a strong feeling Dempster or Peavy will be moved.

 

Why would they trade Peavy? He's an above average starting pitcher. I can't, for the life of me, understand the fascination with moving the guy.

[Bellhorn04]

Why would they trade Peavy? He's an above average starting pitcher. I can't, for the life of me, understand the fascination with moving the guy.

 

My preference would be Dempster. But if they can't move him maybe trade Peavy. Reasoning:

 

Both are signed for only one year.

Frees up $10 million or so for other needs.

2014 rotation still has Lester/Lackey/Buchholz/Doubront/Peavy or Dempster + prospects.

[User Name]

My preference would be Dempster. But if they can't move him maybe trade Peavy. Reasoning:

 

Both are signed for only one year.

Frees up $10 million or so for other needs.

2014 rotation still has Lester/Lackey/Buchholz/Doubront/Peavy or Dempster + prospects.

 

It doesn't make sense to downgrade the rotation to save money. If they can't move Dempster, there's no reason to move Peavy. It's not a need. They're not strapped for cash.

[Bellhorn04]

It doesn't make sense to downgrade the rotation to save money. If they can't move Dempster, there's no reason to move Peavy. It's not a need. They're not strapped for cash.

 

They may be a little strapped in the sense of staying under the $189 million. It all depends, of course, what they do about catcher/first base/shortstop.

[sk7326]

Ok ... true ... Darish did not have any MLB experience either. Nor Dice K ... Dice K could have been much more successful if he trusted his stuff more ... he nibbled and nibbled ... I think he once loaded the based with walks and then pitched his way out of it allowing no runs. Dice K had the stuff ... not the mindset. What will it cost to bring Hudson in? Nice to have Hudson but at what cost never have I heard what the price tag will be.

 

Darvish' WCB experience (which drove a lot of Matsuzaka's scouting too) gave a good look at his potential. His height and stuff were enough that if he wasn't a sure thing (and who is), his probability and upside were very very high.

[sk7326]

Ok ... true ... Darish did not have any MLB experience either. Nor Dice K ... Dice K could have been much more successful if he trusted his stuff more ... he nibbled and nibbled ... I think he once loaded the based with walks and then pitched his way out of it allowing no runs. Dice K had the stuff ... not the mindset. What will it cost to bring Hudson in? Nice to have Hudson but at what cost never have I heard what the price tag will be.

 

The cost in dollars is less of an issue than the years - why Hudson or Haren are attractive is that they might only require a 1-year deal, especially for a title contender. 1 year and something with incentives to get to $15M or so is not at all unreasonable for a team like Boston.

[Bellhorn04]

The cost in dollars is less of an issue than the years - why Hudson or Haren are attractive is that they might only require a 1-year deal, especially for a title contender. 1 year and something with incentives to get to $15M or so is not at all unreasonable for a team like Boston.

 

But they would certainly have to move Dempster or Peavy to have room for Hudson or Haren.

[User Name]

Yet neither of them has a very high possibility of being better than Peavy.

[Bellhorn04]

Yet neither of them has a very high possibility of being better than Peavy.

 

Agreed.