What is more important ... winning a game or hitting AROD?

[Bellhorn04]

In the history of baseball?

 

It's quite possible.

[a700hitter]

The real treat would have been watching some baseball goon in the media (like Eckersley or Merloni) still defending it and calling Dempster a bulldog or something.

He's a hero! Seriously, what message was he trying to send and who was he sending it to? I don't think ARod gives a rat's ass if Dumpster doesn't like him.

[a700hitter]

It's quite possible.

It made no sense, none, zero, zilch, nada. I haven't heard or read a single plausible explanation for what Dummy Dumpster did last night.

[Bellhorn04]

Does not matter whether it "directly" cost the game or not. It did lead to runs being scored and it was moronic beyond belief. If it were not for the oblivious Ump, Dempster would have been and should have been tossed right then and there forcing the Sox to the pen in the 2nd inning of the game. That was nothing more than the Ump being thoughtless or taking pity on the idiot.

 

As just about everybody in baseball with a brain has said, he should have taken his one shot at hitting him, if he did fine...if he didn't get on with the game. It still would have been stupid because he would have put the lead runner on with nobody out. It at least would not have been moronic because he would not have risked being tossed from the game itself. But no, the idiot threw four straight at A-roid and left himself and his team at the mercy of the home plate ump in a game that they really had to have....FOR f***ING WHAT? There is no room for this horse s*** in a pennant race! But excuse me, this is not a baseball team in a pennant race. It is just a bunch of fun lovin' guys that can't get enough of each other for 162 days of the year.

 

On top of that, he left the skanks no choice but to man up in support of a teammate whether they disliked him or not...something that might have a lasting impact and might make it more likely that they continue to play better baseball than they have played all season long against a team they have six more against I think. In addition it is clearly already gaining A-roid some sympathy which he does not deserve and should not get. Turning A-roid into a sympathetic figure even by a little bit is pathetic.

 

Then there is the potential impact on the Sox players who will now be left answering endless media questions about what they knew and when they knew it and what they thought about it and on and on in the middle of a pennant race. The media is not going to be satisfied with Farrell's response. We now know by the way that for poker players, getting Farrell in a poker game would be a dream come true. Dempster put himself AND his team right in the eye of the storm and there will be no way to make this go away easily until the damned media has driven everybody crazy or gets answers they believe. Moronic does not even come close to describing this, one of the dumbest things I have ever seen in baseball. Casey Stengel is baseball's Einstein comparatively speaking.

 

Totally agree jung. As you are saying, this was stupid for MULTIPLE REASONS. That's what really makes it special.

[Bellhorn04]

It's such a nice ironic touch that Dempster can't even apologize or admit it was a bad move or say that if he to do it over, he wouldn't. Because he would be breaking the inviolable code of baseball just by admitting he was throwing at A-Rod. He has to take that with him to his grave like a Mafioso.

[RedSoxNC84]

-What if Dempster had been tossed from the game? This could easily have happened.

 

Then they probably would have won the game.

[RedSoxNC84]

I'm not going to defend what he did per se, but I won't lie and say I didn't enjoy it when it happened.

 

 

Also saying something like "which is more important" is stupid. Obviously they are both important.

Edited August 19, 2013 by RedSoxNC84

[Orange Juiced]

I always thought a great way to drill a guy would be this: he gets on base (single, walk, error). They you lob a throw over to first. He gets back. Then you snap a throw over. He dives back, and you drill him in the ribs as he's diving. It'll hurt more (that's part of the intent, right?), but nobody would see it as a beanball....it's just a bad throw. So there's plausible deniability. But oh man, you could create some pain that way, with the ribcage exposed as he dives.

 

Probably harder hitting a moving target, and there's a good chance for an error, but theoretically you'd only likely do it in a situation where the game isn't in the balance anyway.

[MJantomaso]

Hitting arod may have been pointless but was not the reason why the sox lost last night. We had a 6-3 lead following all of that. Arod could have homered his first at bat for all we know. At the end of the day, all it was was a lead off walk.

[a700hitter]

Hitting arod may have been pointless but was not the reason why the sox lost last night. We had a 6-3 lead following all of that. Arod could have homered his first at bat for all we know. At the end of the day, all it was was a lead off walk.

Pointless stupidity is never a good thing. Professional teams shouldn't engage in it. This was not about protecting your players or claiming the inside of the plate. It was pure stupidity.

[Bellhorn04]

Pointless stupidity is never a good thing. Professional teams shouldn't engage in it. This was not about protecting your players or claiming the inside of the plate. It was pure stupidity.

 

And some things take on a significance that is more than just the actual outcome of that inning or whatever. I can't help thinking that some of the Sox players were doing some second-guessing during the game as things turned around. We'll never know how much it 'inspired' the Yankees to score 7 runs off Dempster. But the possibility is there.

 

In 2004 a lot of people point to the moment when Varitek shoved A-Rod as a turning point for the team. Maybe that's ******** or maybe it isn't.

 

Let's just hope people aren't looking back at this play for the wrong reasons later in the season.

[MJantomaso]

Pointless stupidity is never a good thing. Professional teams shouldn't engage in it. This was not about protecting your players or claiming the inside of the plate. It was pure stupidity.

 

agreed, but to claim that was the reason why we lost the game is just plain dumb.

[Bellhorn04]

agreed, but to claim that was the reason why we lost the game is just plain dumb.

 

Empirically speaking, it was one of the reasons.

[MJantomaso]

Empirically speaking, it was one of the reasons.

 

I guess if you want to use the "dont wake a sleeping giant" principle.

[Bellhorn04]

I guess if you want to use the "dont wake a sleeping giant" principle.

 

No, even without that. Putting A-Rod on base led to a run.

[marklmw]

we then went up 6-3 after that. Hitting ARod did not hurt us. Dempster not being able to back his s*** up after hitting ARod is what made us lose. You cant hit someone intentionally and then go out and get shelled.

 

It really does not matter that we were up 6-3 ... the fact of the matter is Dempster hits a lead-off man in the 2nd inning ... the question is why? Was it because Arod used PED's ... the Red Sox have had our fair share of players using PED's

[SoxFanForsyth]

It really does not matter that we were up 6-3 ... the fact of the matter is Dempster hits a lead-off man in the 2nd inning ... the question is why? Was it because Arod used PED's ... the Red Sox have had our fair share of players using PED's

 

You're confusing the two. Should the Sox have thrown at ARod in that situation? No. Did it cause the Sox to lose? No.

[VA Sox Fan]

It really does not matter that we were up 6-3 ... the fact of the matter is Dempster hits a lead-off man in the 2nd inning ... the question is why? Was it because Arod used PED's ... the Red Sox have had our fair share of players using PED's

 

I would think it stems more from the report that he ratted out other players (Braun and Cervelli) not the use of PED's.

[marklmw]

You're confusing the two. Should the Sox have thrown at ARod in that situation? No. Did it cause the Sox to lose? No.

 

How about: Did hitting Arod help us to win the game? The answer is no.

[mvp 78]

How about: Did hitting Arod help us to win the game? The answer is no.

 

Ellsbury struck out with a runner in scoring position, again. Was that better for the Sox than beaning ARod?

[Bellhorn04]

How about: Did hitting Arod help us to win the game? The answer is no.

 

And the answer to: did it help us lose the game? is yes. We know it led to a run. We can't prove that 'firing up' the Yankees helped them win - you can never prove that stuff. But to completely dismiss it is wrong too. We know there are psychological factors in sports.

[Station 13]

Dempster sucking and being an airhead is the reason for the lost.

[marklmw]

I would think it stems more from the report that he ratted out other players (Braun and Cervelli) not the use of PED's.

 

Interesting

[marklmw]

Dempster sucking and being an airhead is the reason for the lost.

 

It is extremely painful to know that we are paying Dempster 13M+ next year as well. The Sox have 3 pitchers in the minors who I would rather see on the mound next year.

Workman comes to mind immediately. I wonder if the Sox could deal Dempster to a NL Team and eat half his salary?

[Bellhorn04]

It is extremely painful to know that we are paying Dempster 13M+ next year as well. The Sox have 3 pitchers in the minors who I would rather see on the mound next year.

Workman comes to mind immediately. I wonder if the Sox could deal Dempster to a NL Team and eat half his salary?

 

I think they would have a good shot at doing that this offseason.

[marklmw]

And the answer to: did it help us lose the game? is yes. We know it led to a run. We can't prove that 'firing up' the Yankees helped them win - you can never prove that stuff. But to completely dismiss it is wrong too. We know there are psychological factors in sports.

 

You know Bellhorn04 ... you have a good head on your shoulders ... A nice rack too!

[RedSoxNC84]

You know Bellhorn04 ... you have a good head on your shoulders ... A nice rack too!

 

I should hope there isn't a rack on bell's shoulders.. I dare say that's not a correct place to have one.

[marklmw]

It made no sense, none, zero, zilch, nada. I haven't heard or read a single plausible explanation for what Dummy Dumpster did last night.

This was the 13th game A-Rod has played in since his return. It was just stupid.

[RedSoxfanforlife305]

And the answer to: did it help us lose the game? is yes. We know it led to a run. We can't prove that 'firing up' the Yankees helped them win - you can never prove that stuff. But to completely dismiss it is wrong too. We know there are psychological factors in sports.

 

This post is kind of misleading, don't you think? You're saying hitting A-Rod helped us lose the game at first, followed by "we can't prove that 'firing up' the Yankees help them win. You answered you're own question. You can't prove it, so why does this all fall on A-Rod? A more realistic and reliable point would be he only scored 2 runs. Which wouldn't have been enough to get the win anyways. Imo, this discussion isn't even worth a thread. It was a bonehead move, but it didn't cost the Sox the game.

 

Dempster sucking and being an airhead is the reason for the lost.

 

This is pretty much the answer, but I would add Farrell into the mix. He shouldn't have been pitching in the 6th, but that's just me.

 

EDIT: Shouldn't have been pitching after A-Rod hit the HR in the 6th*

Edited August 19, 2013 by RedSoxfanforlife305

[Orange Juiced]

I think they would have a good shot at doing that this offseason.

 

I agree. A National League contender that would only have to pay him $7-8 million would be happy with that. I think he would still be a pretty useful pitcher for someone. But I hope it's not for the Red Sox.