Jose Iglesias

[SCM33]

.....is not the future at SS.

[redsoxbeatz]

I have not watched him play. I haven't had Internet in two weeks so no chance to watch.

 

Why not?? No avg??

[jung]

I suspect the thing that has been a bit of a surprise is that so far he has not even shown that he can even handle a bat at this level. So far he is being completely overpowered at the plate. Not many games yet and the Sox have run into some pretty tough rotations of late. I would reserve judgement about this until he has come to the plate against a wider range of pitchers. However it is like watching a young boy up there trying to hit against these guys. He has so far, been completely overmatched. It is like watching a weak hitting pitcher up there.

 

I would want the Sox to keep him here to see if he can catch up to these guys during these next 30 games. If he can he can and if he can't he can't. Not sure it is more complicated than that.

 

He deserves the chance though. There is nothing better to do with the time anyway. Based on what we have seen so far, if he just end up looking like he can handle a bat at this level that would be encouraging. He is is exactly were he is today 30 games from today, I think that will be hard to ignore.

[SoxSport]

Looks like the talent evaluators have made up their minds on Iggy after a couple of games. LOL.

 

 

Keep in mind that Iggy has been a victim of Red Sox politics this year. He looked good enough to stick in ST, then got hurt trying to steal home, of all things. He goes to Pawtucket, starts slowly, and has recently shown improvement in his hitting--so said his manager. Now he might be struggling a bit hitting. No surprise since all the FO talk has been negative about his hitting. He isn't getting a fair shake.The focus should be on his defense--his strength--not his hitting. He's playing a defensive position. Think positive. Build the kid's confidence.

 

The same goes at catcher. Forget the HRs. The Red Sox have gone with Salty all season, a weak defensive catcher, and Aviles, a so-so SS. Both these guys hit HRs , but their OBPs suck--below .300--which negates those HRs. Too many outs, and not enough defense.

 

The Sox have weak pitching, and should be placing more emphasis on defense at key positions--SS and catcher--to improve their pitching. They need more balance in their lineup.

[BornToRun]

It's early. The kid still needs time and no one here wants him on the team for his bat. If he can hold down the 9 hole with a .320 or so OBP and play GG defense, I'll be happy.

[jung]

As good as he might be defensively he cannot be the equivalent of a weak hitting pitcher in a league that does not even allow pitchers to hit. He has to be able to at least handle a bat and so far he has not shown an ability to even handle a bat at this level. He is being completely overpowered so far. I have not given up hope on him but if he cannot improve at all from here as I said earlier I don't see how one could ignore that.

 

If that is the case it almost does not matter what any of us thinks. Under no circumstances that I can envision would the Sox allow a player that cannot even handle a bat at this level be their everyday SS. It just won't happen. He is so overmatched, he cannot even lay down a bunt....can't get a ball out of the infield even. I am sorry but that is just to far off the charts on the bottom end even for me and I have wanted him here to this point.

 

We should see where he is after these 30 or so games. He should play at short every single game in an effort to see if he can catch up at least to the point where he looks like he can handle at bat at this level. He needs the 30 games as well just so that we can see the result against a wide range of pitchers than he has faced so far. Not even sure how many LH pitchers he has faced so far...mostly Righties I think and the last few series have been against some tough teams looking for victories because they are in the hunt. But even at that if he cannot handle a bat at all against any of the guys he sees in 30 games, I will be more convinced than ever that the Sox will end up trading him somewhere. That is the problem if there is one. So far at least in these few at bats he has not even exhibited an ability to handle a bat at all.

 

I am going to be totally pissed if I see anybody but Iggy penciled into SS for the remainder of the season.

[DocHolliday]

As good as he might be defensively he cannot be the equivalent of a weak hitting pitcher in a league that does not even allow pitchers to hit. He has to be able to at least handle a bat and so far he has not shown an ability to even handle a bat at this level. He is being completely overpowered so far. I have not given up hope on him but if he cannot improve at all from here as I said earlier I don't see how one could ignore that.

 

If that is the case it almost does not matter what any of us thinks. Under no circumstances that I can envision would the Sox allow a player that cannot even handle a bat at this level be their everyday SS. It just won't happen. He is so overmatched, he cannot even lay down a bunt....can't get a ball out of the infield even. I am sorry but that is just to far off the charts on the bottom end even for me and I have wanted him here to this point.

 

We should see where he is after these 30 or so games. He should play at short every single game in an effort to see if he can catch up at least to the point where he looks like he can handle at bat at this level. He needs the 30 games as well just so that we can see the result against a wide range of pitchers than he has faced so far. Not even sure how many LH pitchers he has faced so far...mostly Righties I think and the last few series have been against some tough teams looking for victories because they are in the hunt. But even at that if he cannot handle a bat at all against any of the guys he sees in 30 games, I will be more convinced than ever that the Sox will end up trading him somewhere. That is the problem if there is one. So far at least in these few at bats he has not even exhibited an ability to handle a bat at all.

 

I am going to be totally pissed if I see anybody but Iggy penciled into SS for the remainder of the season.

 

Through a handful of games so far this season, we can all agree Iglesias has had difficultly at the plate to the point that he has not been able to get his first hit. There's no question that he has issues with the bat that he will have to work out to stick.

 

On the other hand, here are the pitchers he has faced in the handful of games he's played:

 

- Jered Weaver

- CJ Wilson

- Zach Grienke

- Brandon McCarthy

 

Again, not saying his current approach will cut it at the ML level, but let's give him some more time to see ML pitching for a longer period of time. There's a big difference between the pitching at AAA and ML - particularly with the upper group of pitchers he has faced so far.

[jung]

They have already posted the lineup today and Aviles is penciled into SS. Why? What the hell do we have to learn from having Aviles play SS tonight?

[Thunder]

Iglesias can't hit at the Major League level. I've been saying this for a year or so now. If he can work on it in Spring Training, then he might be the future. Might.

[wyo-sox]

I personally do not see that much in Iggy to get excited about. He is not the answer. He may make plays look smoother than others and once every few games he may make a play someone else might not have, but he will cost you at the plate several times every game , and we won't ever get points for style.

 

But the real issue for me is that SS is not the problem. Has anyone ever at any point felt like we were just a good ss away from turning things around?

 

Unless Iggy gets great control on a fastball and develops a curve and change up, I don't think he will have much impact. I mean, did you notice we got beat 20-2 last night? Its nothing but pitching, and its become laughably obvious.

[SCM33]

Looks like the talent evaluators have made up their minds on Iggy after a couple of games. LOL.

 

 

Keep in mind that Iggy has been a victim of Red Sox politics this year. He looked good enough to stick in ST, then got hurt trying to steal home, of all things. He goes to Pawtucket, starts slowly, and has recently shown improvement in his hitting--so said his manager. Now he might be struggling a bit hitting. No surprise since all the FO talk has been negative about his hitting. He isn't getting a fair shake.The focus should be on his defense--his strength--not his hitting. He's playing a defensive position. Think positive. Build the kid's confidence.

 

The same goes at catcher. Forget the HRs. The Red Sox have gone with Salty all season, a weak defensive catcher, and Aviles, a so-so SS. Both these guys hit HRs , but their OBPs suck--below .300--which negates those HRs. Too many outs, and not enough defense.

 

The Sox have weak pitching, and should be placing more emphasis on defense at key positions--SS and catcher--to improve their pitching. They need more balance in their lineup.

 

Hes awful.

 

His numbers in the minors show that he almost has zero chance or any kind of success at the major league level. I already said it.....but his OPS somehow manages to be below his slugging. He has zero pop in his bat. MLB pitchers are more productive than his minor league numbers.

 

Salty sucks, you know my stance on this. He needs to be replaced. They need a REAL catcher. I dont care if he hits .230 like Salty, but he HAS to be able to call and work a game.

[Behindenemylines]

We are losing now with Aviles at SS and he is not the future, we might well see if Iglesias has anything at all. Playing him one game and sitting him the next is not doing anyone any good. Need to continue evaluating for 2013 because 2012 was done weeks ago. When do pitchers and catchers report?

[a700hitter]

We are losing now with Aviles at SS and he is not the future, we might well see if Iglesias has anything at all. Playing him one game and sitting him the next is not doing anyone any good. Need to continue evaluating for 2013 because 2012 was done weeks ago. When do pitchers and catchers report?

Maybe they are afraid to expose him. Sometimes prospects lose all their value when it becomes obvious that they can't hack it in the big leagues. I am just not seeing anything so special about this guy on either side of the ball.

[SoxSport]

I think you have to give the kid a chance to sink or swim. That hasn't happened yet.

[jacksonianmarch]

It's 12 ABs, so it isnt like he will hit .000 for a season. But if you are looking for his lumber to justify anything, then you are grasping at straws

[jung]

He has to be at least able to handle a bat at this level. I would take him being able to handle a bat like a average pitcher. Right now, based on what I have seen he has not given any indication that he can handle a bat better than a weak hitting pitcher. That is just to far down the scale.

 

However not investing the time in these last few games to find out is just stupid.....since they have done every stupid thing you can think of in the space of one year, I guess that would be in keeping with the spirit of things. Play him every day against a variety of different pitchers and see if the guy can at least not be completely overpowered every at bat. As I said earlier, so far he can't lay down a bunt, can't even hit a seeing eye single cause he ball comes off the bat so weakly that he cannot even get it out of the infield. That won't fly if he can't do better.

[wyo-sox]

We are losing now with Aviles at SS and he is not the future, we might well see if Iglesias has anything at all. Playing him one game and sitting him the next is not doing anyone any good. Need to continue evaluating for 2013 because 2012 was done weeks ago. When do pitchers and catchers report?

 

Yes we are loosing with Aviles at short- and when Iggy has played short, we have lost. We are also loosing with Pedroia at 2nd. All irrelevant, its the starting pitching.

[SoxSport]

The team has stopped playing for Bobby. And Bobby doesn't give a damn.

 

It's time to replace him. Everybody can see that. Even Henry.

 

You want that front office, Henry? Well you better let them pick their manager.

[Behindenemylines]

The starting pitching problem can not be fixed until the off season. If you are using the rest of the season to see what the young guys can do, then do it. Most of the season the starting pitching has been a mess and I think everyone agrees with that. If we are going to lose we might as well lose by looking at the future (Iglesias if he has one) not Aviles who will not be the future SS. He is what we would call a bridge SS. If Iglesias doesn't get the reps at SS you still don't know what you have. Everyone knows it was the starting pitching that ruin 2012. You still have to field everyday players next season so avaluate what you have.

[Orange Juiced]

Agreed. Why in the world Cook and Dice-K are pitching games for the Boston Red Sox is a complete mystery.

[MJantomaso]

This guy is no better than a John McDonald. He is not a 5 tool player. I don't know how you guys have been blowing him for years now. He has never been able to hit....ever. He has wheels and a glove and not much else. He will always be one of those player that makes a living with minor league affiliated teams.

[jopete19]

What do you guys think about Aviles... I think he has does a really good job this year at SS. A nice surprise!

[jung]

Mike Aviles is horrible. If he is here next year he will likely split time with Ciriaco. But the fact that he is here at all is more evidence for a clueless FO. The only thing as scary as Aviles at SS is Ross in RF. Ross needs to play in left as he is a circus act in Right. Fenway's left field is Ross's savior both at the plate and in the field.

[jopete19]

Aviles is not horrible. Iglesias is horrible. He has hidden power and has the ability to drive in runs. I like him at short. I agree with you that Ross looks like a clown in right.

[jung]

Mike Aviles is a butcher at SS. He has no range going to his right almost falling over trying to make his first crossover going that way and takes forever to make plays regardless of direction which is why we miss so many DP's. He simply takes to long to get to, corral and then release the baseball. He is not at all graceful around the position and even Ciriaco makes him look like a stickman at SS. Aviles error totals are acceptable because you are not dinged in errors for missing DP's and you are not dinged for balls you can't get to.

 

Aviles has at least twice this year come very close to ambushing his teammates in left field and at 3rd running with reckless abandon after pop flies in the outfield only avoiding monster crashes because they other guys pulled up before he careened into them full bore.

 

Mike Aviles is a utility infielder and a utility infielder has no business playing the most important defensive position on the field everyday especially with a weak pitching staff.

[mvp 78]

Jung, how do you feel about Reyes or Andrus? Defensive metrics show Aviles has had a better 2012 than either of those guys. Also, he has the 5th best range at SS this year.

[Brennan]

Mike Aviles is a butcher at SS. He has no range going to his right almost falling over trying to make his first crossover going that way and takes forever to make plays regardless of direction which is why we miss so many DP's. He simply takes to long to get to, corral and then release the baseball. He is not at all graceful around the position and even Ciriaco makes him look like a stickman at SS. Aviles error totals are acceptable because you are not dinged in errors for missing DP's and you are not dinged for balls you can't get to.

 

Aviles has at least twice this year come very close to ambushing his teammates in left field and at 3rd running with reckless abandon after pop flies in the outfield only avoiding monster crashes because they other guys pulled up before he careened into them full bore.

 

Mike Aviles is a utility infielder and a utility infielder has no business playing the most important defensive position on the field everyday especially with a weak pitching staff.

 

 

 

 

I think he has Salty syndrome Jung. People find a few things about him that look good and ride with it like RBIs or Salty's HR's. They don't take into account hitting with RISP, K-rates etc. I saw a few posts recently praising Punto and stating that his play for us was understated and will be missed. For what? A few good defensive plays in one series vs. the yank offs? You know what really stands out for me about Aviles? The countless times he comes to the plate with two outs when we could really use a hit badly and he fails like clockwork or as you mentioned, range or no range, how many run of the mill DP's have we watched him butcher so far?

[wyo-sox]

I think Aviles has been adequate, certainly we could find someone better, but my eyes do not see him butchering defensive plays or doing a bad job. If nobody comes in from the outside Pedro would be my first choice at ss and Aviles as an infield utility guy.

[redsoxfan3]

I think Aviles has been adequate, certainly we could find someone better, but my eyes do not see him butchering defensive plays or doing a bad job. If nobody comes in from the outside Pedro would be my first choice at ss and Aviles as an infield utility guy.

 

I agree here. Iglesias has an unproven bat and I don't see him becoming a great offensive hitter anytime soon. If we choose to stick with Iglesias, we need to have other offensive weapons that can produce. Iglesias will not be anything more than a nine hitter who is playing because of his defense. He is an offensive liability. Aviles has been adequate this year, but I do not think he will be our starting SS for the next few or even next couple years. If we stick with internal options, I would be fine with giving Ciriaco a shot and having Aviles as a utility IF. I would really like us to get a solid defensive SS, with at least a decent bat. In a perfect world, that is probably not going to happen because those are hard to come by. The free agent SS's are not anything great. Ciriaco might be the best option, unless we can manage to trade for someone.

[jimbob728]

If Iglesias is going to be the shortstop of the future they need to let the pitchers bat and DH his ass. Ciriaco had 3 three hit games in one week and at least 6 multi-hit games this year. Career .320.

 

Iglesias is 2 for 22 career .091. A major league stadium is not the place to learn how to hit.

 

As for fielding, Ciriaco ..971 fielding %. Iglesias .938.

 

I just don't get the love for Iggy. Kalish either for that matter.