Yankees trade for Pineda

[Palodios]

Here's your rebuttal Debbie. 1.10WHIP' date=' 9K/9IP, and a 3BB/9IP doesn't equate to a 4.50ERA. That's just you choosing strawman stats for your strawman argument. What was his FIP?[/quote']

 

Have you seen his splits? He's 2.90 ERa in Seattle, and 4.40 ERA away. This is a case of the safecos. He's a quality #3, but he's no Felix Hernandez.

[Meh]

And jealous.

 

f*** jealous bitches. I hate them.

 

But seriously Pineda will get his sophomore jinx on and in 2013 put up ungodly numbers.

[RedSoxfanforlife305]

Yeah, we're super jealous. I mean everyone on this board wanted Pineda. Get over yourself. He made a prediction and we'll have to wait and see what happens.

[Palodios]

f*** jealous bitches. I hate them.

 

But seriously Pineda will get his sophomore jinx on and in 2013 put up ungodly numbers.

 

Pineda for Montero and Noesi? After all the Montero talk, I'm just glad he didn't fetch you guys a real #1/2. I am jealous of the Kuroda deal though... he was the real steal of this offseason.

[Emmz]

We're jelly because they got a guy was good at home, Safeco Field (aka where hitting talent goes to die) and sucked outside of there.

[italstallianion]

Don't forget about Campos either. He can be a real problem in a few years.

[Meh]

Don't forget about Campos either. He can be a real problem in a few years.

 

I was being sarcastic but no need to talk bad about campos, he's legit. Also about pineda... all of last year all I heard was how he was the greatest young pitcher in baseball, the new felix, the new man in town. Now he's on the yankees, he's a #4. this being a red sox forum im not surprised he's being mislabeled. Is he an ace? No. Is he a #1 starter? No. Is he a#2pitcher? Yes. That's what we needed, I hate giving up the package we did tho.

[italstallianion]

I was being sarcastic but no need to talk bad about campos' date=' he's legit. Also about pineda... all of last year all I heard was how he was the greatest young pitcher in baseball, the new felix, the new man in town. Now he's on the yankees, he's a #4. this being a red sox forum im not surprised he's being mislabeled. Is he an ace? No. Is he a #1 starter? No. Is he a#2pitcher? Yes. That's what we needed, I hate giving up the package we did tho.[/quote']

 

 

My apologies for my street lingo. Being a problem = a good thing.

 

IE Teixeira and A-rod are a real problem in the middle of the lineup. King Felix is a problem for opposing batters. I think Campos has a shot to be really good.

[italstallianion]

Btw it's like we're talking to two different Jacko's. The Jacko in this thread is much different than the Jacko in the thread where this trade was announced.

[Meh]

My apologies for my street lingo. Being a problem = a good thing.

 

IE Teixeira and A-rod are a real problem in the middle of the lineup. King Felix is a problem for opposing batters. I think Campos has a shot to be really good.

 

I figured you were being sarcastic, meh

[Palodios]

I was being sarcastic but no need to talk bad about campos' date=' he's legit. Also about pineda... all of last year all I heard was how he was the greatest young pitcher in baseball, the new felix, the new man in town. Now he's on the yankees, he's a #4. this being a red sox forum im not surprised he's being mislabeled. Is he an ace? No. Is he a #1 starter? No. Is he a#2pitcher? Yes. That's what we needed, I hate giving up the package we did tho.[/quote']

 

You probably heard those things before the All-star break. Pineda isn't a bad pitcher. I'd say he's probably a #3. He needs more than one season to prove that he's the real deal, a season outside of Safeco.

[italstallianion]

I figured you were being sarcastic' date=' meh[/quote']

 

 

Nah, real talk I keep it a hunnid b.

[User Name]

I cannot understand how some posters here are looking down on Pineda's talent. I'm not saying he couldn't bomb, because with pitchers you never know, but the stuff is definitely there.

[RedSoxNC84]

Either way Pineda is a huge upgrade over Burnett, and at least he won't be calling himself "nasty" when he's giving up four runs per start.

[iortiz]

I cannot understand how some posters here are looking down on Pineda's talent. I'm not saying he couldn't bomb' date=' because with pitchers you never know, but the stuff is definitely there.[/quote']

 

Sorry Red Sox fans but I have to agree with this.

 

Damn Yankees.

[jacksonianmarch]

You probably heard those things before the All-star break. Pineda isn't a bad pitcher. I'd say he's probably a #3. He needs more than one season to prove that he's the real deal' date=' a season outside of Safeco.[/quote']

 

A #3? Did u see his #'s? Really??

[jacksonianmarch]

And, Pineda's FIP was 4 tenths of a run lower than Lester's last yr. but, yep, he's a #3. Lol, just jealous sox fans

[Palodios]

A #3? Did u see his #'s? Really??

 

Last year was Pineda's rookie season. He started out well, and ended in mediocrity. He needs to prove himself, and he definitely has #2/#1 potential, but a 4.40 ERA outside of Safeco, a .258 BABIP would make me concerned if I were you.

[Palodios]

Seriously, if you don't believe me, take a look at this. Pineda has absolutely feasted on terrible offensive teams, and has gotten lit up by better teams. Bolded are the teams he has succeeded against, and the ones who have eaten him up are in italics.

 

------------ IP---ERA--WHIP-BAA--Offensive's rank

vs. BAL 13.0 2.77 1.15 .255 #14

vs. BOS 4.1 14.54 2.08 .381 #2

vs. CWS 13.0 2.77 0.85 .182 #18

vs. DET 11.1 5.56 1.41 .261 #4

vs. KC 14.0 2.57 0.93 .174 #10

vs. LAA 5.0 12.60 1.60 .286 #17

vs. MIN 11.0 1.64 1.00 .209 #25

vs. NYY 5.0 5.40 1.60 .167 #1

vs. OAK 18.0 2.00 1.00 .185 #20

vs. TB 12.1 2.19 0.89 .175 #15

vs. TEX 19.0 4.74 1.05 .239 #3

vs. TOR 18.2 5.30 1.39 .243 #6

vs. ATL 6.1 5.68 1.42 .182 #22

vs. PHI 6.0 1.50 0.83 .105 #13

vs. SD 7.0 0.00 0.43 .087 #28

vs. WAS 7.0 0.00 0.71 .160 #23

[Laser Show]

All of you know that if we pulled the trigger for Pineda, we'd be going on and on about how "this is the year", "we got an solid #2-3 starter", and "Pedro redux" and Jacko and the other Yanks fans would be telling us to prepare our anuses for Lackey 2.0.

 

Fact is, he hasn't proven himself outside of a pitchers park and he was just a rookie last year. His 103 ERA+ was average and he could easily regress this year under the microscope in NYC in a hitters park.

[SoxFanForsyth]

I cannot understand how some posters here are looking down on Pineda's talent. I'm not saying he couldn't bomb' date=' because with pitchers you never know, but the stuff is definitely there.[/quote']

 

Not looking down on his talent. Just saying for 2012, he's going to be a wash in terms of production with Colon in 2011. He's obviously a huge piece to their rotation going forward, but when comparing 11 to 12, I see very little improvement. In a 5 year outlook, it's a huge difference though.

[Meh]

All of you know that if we pulled the trigger for Pineda, we'd be going on and on about how "this is the year", "we got an solid #2-3 starter", and "Pedro redux" and Jacko and the other Yanks fans would be telling us to prepare our anuses for Lackey 2.0.

 

Fact is, he hasn't proven himself outside of a pitchers park and he was just a rookie last year. His 103 ERA+ was average and he could easily regress this year under the microscope in NYC in a hitters park.

 

The fact is if you got pineda all red sox fans would be creaming themsleves. There's so many stats you can find flaws with everyone. If we got felix red sox fans would be talking about his declining fastball velocity and never pitching well in pressure games and how he's a 3 at best and next year hell be a 4 cause his fb will be 91 tops.

[Laser Show]

The fact is if you got pineda all red sox fans would be creaming themsleves. There's so many stats you can find flaws with everyone. If we got felix red sox fans would be talking about his declining fastball velocity and never pitching well in pressure games and how he's a 3 at best and next year hell be a 4 cause his fb will be 91 tops.

 

That's pretty much what I meant. The only reason Sox fans are hating on the deal is because you got him and we didn't

[Palodios]

The fact is if you got pineda all red sox fans would be creaming themsleves. There's so many stats you can find flaws with everyone. If we got felix red sox fans would be talking about his declining fastball velocity and never pitching well in pressure games and how he's a 3 at best and next year hell be a 4 cause his fb will be 91 tops.

 

The facts are simple. Pineda is an excellent pitcher, who has five+ cheap cheap years in pinstripes to reach his prime. He cost Montero, perhaps the best hitting prospect in all of baseball, and Noesi, who seems to be a 6th/7th inning BP guy or maybe a #4/5/6 starter. When I heard this news, I actually was excited, because I figured it meant the starting pitcher market was wide open for the Red Sox to get Kuroda for themselves.... then, "oh s***".

 

That being said, I want you to look at what I posted earlier. He's really only pitched well against AAAA offenses. I agree with what you said earlier-- he'll be a much bigger force in 2013 than 2012.

[italstallianion]

I'm not hating on the deal. I think it was a good deal (albeit with some risks) for both teams. Now that I think about it, as crazy as it sounds, I think that dealing Felix Hernandez instead of Pineda might have been a better deal for the Mariners, and probably the Yankees too.

 

The reason why I say this is because Hernandez salary jumps from $10 million to $18-20 million for the next 3 years. It's highly unlikely in my opinion that Hernandez stays in Seattle after that, so I think that with more time under contract, the better of a package the Mariners can get for Hernandez. I think that his stock can only fall at this point.

 

Pineda, while obviously unproven and about 3 years younger, has many more years of cheap team control. In addition, the Yankees were said to be offering Montero/Betances/Banuelos and more for King Felix. Add in the fact that the Mariners would have kept Pineda/Campos AND likely gotten another piece from the Yankees (maybe someone like Noesi or a hitting prospect) and I think it looks like a better deal for both teams.

 

The Mariners shed a lot of payroll and get 3 top prospects with many years of team control (and keep Pineda/Campos) plus their pitcher's ballpark should be kind to Pineda/Betances/Banuelos. Not to mention that the Mariners would have a young core of Montero/Ackley/Smoak and could save a ton of money from the Felix contract to sign someone like Prince Fielder or a cheaper 1B/DH and then add someone like Edwin Jackson. (I'd go for Jackson's youth and durability in Seattle over Oswalt's probably better innings)

 

Not to mention that the Yankees would have to hire homeless people to squeegee the computers of Yankee fans from all of the misplaced semen that would arise from the Yankees getting King Felix and having a rotation of Sabathia/Felix/Kuroda

[User Name]

Not looking down on his talent. Just saying for 2012' date=' he's going to be a wash in terms of production with Colon in 2011. He's obviously a huge piece to their rotation going forward, but when comparing 11 to 12, I see very little improvement. In a 5 year outlook, it's a huge difference though.[/quote']

 

There's a difference between opinion and fact. You stated the opinion that he would regress as fact. I say it's a possibility and not written in stone. Be objective.

[iortiz]

All of you know that if we pulled the trigger for Pineda' date=' we'd be going on and on about how "this is the year", "we got an solid #2-3 starter", and "Pedro redux" and Jacko and the other Yanks fans would be telling us to prepare our anuses for Lackey 2.0. [/b']

 

Fact is, he hasn't proven himself outside of a pitchers park and he was just a rookie last year. His 103 ERA+ was average and he could easily regress this year under the microscope in NYC in a hitters park.

 

This.

 

Maybe I'm cynical saying this and let's be honest, I (and a lot around here) would have been in that band wagon.

[User Name]

However, to rain on Yankee fans' parades (as Jacksonian seems to be so adept at doing against the Red Sox)

 

Pineda could indeed regress in the AL East to the point where he's a marginal upgrade over what Colon gave them last year, Garcia survived on moxie and could implode any second, Nova is not nearly as good as Jacksonian pimps him out to be, no one knows how Kuroda will react to NYS and the AL East, and Burnett and Hughes are both wildcards.

 

Lots of possibility for suckage there.

[diony]

It's an amazing deal, low risk for both teams and HUGE rewards.

 

Young elite pitcher for a young elite hitter. A lot of talent.

 

I think Noesi is the big loss here, he'll probably have better numbers than Pineda next year and people will bash the trade.

 

But Pineda has ace potential and he's still a work in progress.

[User Name]

How does he have "ace potential" if he's elite?

 

He has ace potential but he's not elite by any means.