Bay vs. Holliday

[Dipre]

Instead of calling me biased' date=' debate my point. Go on, I am waiting[/quote']

 

You called Josh Reddick a "slower version of Jacoby Ellsbury".

 

I don't need to type in another word.

[Dojji]

He's got a point, Jacko. Even if you really meant Kalish that's a pretty ridiculous thing to say.

[jacksonianmarch]

What I meant to say was that Kalish projects as a CFer. His swing reminds me of Ellsbury's, but he does have more power and less speed. But I dont see him getting a starting gig in Boston. He doesnt hit well enough to be a big market corner OFer, especially with the sox as currently constructed (since they need a lot of now production from the LF spot). And he's blocked at the CF position. Dispute that.

[Dipre]

What I meant to say was that Kalish projects as a CFer. His swing reminds me of Ellsbury's' date=' but he does have more power and less speed. But I dont see him getting a starting gig in Boston. He doesnt hit well enough to be a big market corner OFer, especially with the sox as currently constructed (since they need a lot of now production from the LF spot). And he's blocked at the CF position. Dispute that.[/quote']

 

You didn't say Kalish. You said Reddick. Dispute that.

[Dipre]

Also' date=' if the sox "just go with Reddick" then they are flat out done as a top contender in the majors unless they make a MAJOR upgrade elsewhere. Losing 36 homers and 115RBI for a [i']slower clone of Ellsbury[/i] will be a MAJOR downgrade.

[Gom]

You guys are debating players who aren't even up here and probably won't be. It's like debating who'd be better than bed, Megan Fox or Jessica Biel. It's not like either of you would ever know.

[Dipre]

You guys are debating players who aren't even up here and probably won't be. It's like debating who'd be better than bed' date=' Megan Fox or Jessica Biel. It's not like either of you would ever know.[/quote']

 

No one was debating this.

 

It's simply one of Jacko's attempts at showing that "The Red Sox fail at everything"

[Gom]

No one was debating this.

 

It's simply one of Jacko's attempts at showing that "The Red Sox fail at everything"

 

They pretty much do, you must admit. 2 blips in 90+ years not-withstanding.

[Dipre]

They pretty much do' date=' you must admit. 2 blips in 90+ years not-withstanding.[/quote']

 

********.

 

I'm 24 years old and started watching the Sox when i was around 13, so that's 2 WS in 11 years for me. Not bad.

[Gom]

********.

 

I'm 24 years old and started watching the Sox when i was around 13, so that's 2 WS in 11 years for me. Not bad.

 

You had a TV 13 years ago? Really?

[Dipre]

You had a TV 13 years ago? Really?

 

Yup, and you were already picking up fares near the old Yankee Stadium, so what's the point?

[Divinity]

The Yankees will be another dark horse in the negotiations since they have both a DH spot and a LF spot up for grabs.

 

The Yankees have stated they don't want there DH spot to be clogged in the future by one specific player, hence why they certainly won't be bringing Matsui back. They want to be able to rotate guy like Posada and A-Rod from playing the field, along with the fact Jeter only has a few more years left at shortstop.

[Divinity]

I read a Bay vs Holliday article today that I thought was pretty interesting.

 

"Jason Bay in a word? Godsend.

 

Never forget that as this baseball season closes and baseball free agents everywhere take stock of what they think they are worth on baseball's open market. The public relations could very well get ugly for Boston's newest star left fielder, who isn't quite what the old left fielder was at the plate, but has nevertheless carved out a niche as one of the most productive players in baseball.

 

Think that's overblown? A quick look at American League statistics shows Bay among the league's top outfielders in home runs (36, first) , RBI (119, first), runs (103, second), walks (94, tied for second), slugging percentage (.537, first) OPS (.921, first) and on-base percentage (.384, sixth). And all that came despite a July slump in which he hit .192/.394/.295 with one home run and five RBI.

 

With that history -- and Bay's .392/.475/.686 2009 line against the Yankees -- there have plenty of choruses that the Red Sox "must" sign him in the offseason. Not doing so would be a step back for Boston, some fans argue, without considering how many years is a good investment.

 

I get those fears. I do. At times, Jay Ray Bay was an absolute monster in Boston's lineup -- especially early in the season, when he hit .301 with 13 home runs and 44 RBI in the season's first 41 games, posting a .433 on-base percentage, a .657 slugging mark and an eye-popping OPS of 1.090. With Mike Lowell and David Ortiz aging, there are only a few other sluggers like Bay in Boston's lineup, and losing him would be a blow.

 

Here's the thing, though: At what cost should they re-sign him?

 

If he's truly seeking the best offers, his recent production will merit at least $15 million per season, sources like WEEI's Alex Speier have pointed out repeatedly. As this salary breakdown shows, no one on the team made that in 2009, and the Red Sox also need to consider shoring up shortstop and finding a Grade A slugger in the Adrian Gonzalez mold, which Bay certainly isn't.

 

Say, for a minute, Bay realizes he has a good thing going in Boston and signs for four years and $60 million -- a large investment, but certainly not a backbreaker for the Sox. That would seem like a reasonable and shrewd move by the Sox that also doubles Bay's $7.8 million salary from 2009.

 

The more likely reality, however, is that Bay will be courted by several teams -- beginning with the Yankees.

 

ESPN'S Buster Olney suggested last week that the Yankees will not be all that interested, since they need to move the aging Derek Jeter to a new position in the next few years. I suppose that's worth considering, but who's to say the Yankees wouldn't keep Jeter at shortstop for another season with plans to split his time with Bay in left field and at DH in 2011? With Johnny Damon and Hideki Matsui both at the end of their contracts, there is certainly space to bring in Bay, whom the Yankees already reportedly expressed interest in last year, when the Pirates were dangling him as trade bait.

 

Other teams also will line up. The Cardinals, for one, could lose Matt Holliday through free agency, opening up a hole in their outfield. Olney also mentioned the Mariners and Giants as "primary competition" for Bay, with Bay potentially getting the chance to shore up a San Francisco offense that has been woeful since their last left fielder (a guy by the name of Bonds) "retired" following the 2007 season.

 

With all that in play, it's not hard to picture the Red Sox walking away from Bay, rather than signing him to a six-year deal they'd fear paying for on the tail end. This isn't to say I'm wishing for it, mind you. To the contrary, it just seems like there's enough writing on the wall to make his future in Boston unlikely.

 

That leaves a variety of other options in left field -- none of which are as promising. Let's take them in order, with a little help from Major League Trade Rumors:

 

Matt Holliday

Which Holliday is a free agent? The one who led the National League in batting average, RBI and total bases in 2007 while finishing second in MVP voting? Or the one who has yet to consistently hit American League pitching and saw his season end with a horrific error that has been immortalized for comedy's sake with this song?

 

It's a big gamble, especially when his agent (Scott Boras? Of course!) is comparing Holliday to the robot android assassin that is Mark Teixeira and no doubt angling for every last dollar possible.

 

In some ways, Holliday probably wouldn't be a bad fit in Boston. He's the kind of right-handed hitter who could pound the Green Monster with doubles and, at 30, is a year younger than Bay. However, do you see it likely that Theo Epstein and Co. will be comfortable with opening the checkbook to make him the highest paid player in a Boston uniform? Yeah, me neither."

[example1]

Matt Holliday

Which Holliday is a free agent? The one who led the National League in batting average, RBI and total bases in 2007 while finishing second in MVP voting? Or the one who has yet to consistently hit American League pitching and saw his season end with a horrific error that has been immortalized for comedy's sake with this song?

 

It's a big gamble, especially when his agent (Scott Boras? Of course!) is comparing Holliday to the robot android assassin that is Mark Teixeira and no doubt angling for every last dollar possible.

 

In some ways, Holliday probably wouldn't be a bad fit in Boston. He's the kind of right-handed hitter who could pound the Green Monster with doubles and, at 30, is a year younger than Bay. However, do you see it likely that Theo Epstein and Co. will be comfortable with opening the checkbook to make him the highest paid player in a Boston uniform? Yeah, me neither."

 

1. You should probably provide a citation for posted articles.

2. "Which Matt Holliday?" Inconsistent in the AL? Maybe...

 

However in his last 195 PAs in Oakland his line was .304/.390/.494/.884. That isn't bad. Certainly "good".

 

In his last 26 G (112 PA) his line was .330/.402/.536/.938. Also "good".

 

Again, his AL OBP was .378. Give the guy a break.

 

3. If JD Drew is the current highest paid player, Matt Holliday could take that throne without complaint from this Sox fan.

[TheKilo]

They pretty much do' date=' you must admit. 2 blips in 90+ years not-withstanding.[/quote']

 

 

Like you were f***ing alive in the 1950s

[Gom]

 

Like you were f***ing alive in the 1950s

 

Ok, in my lifetime, six. Which is 4 more than anyone here can claim. Your first which was the most tainted championship in baseball since the Black Sox.

[Lester82]

Like we were alive for the last 90 years

 

LMAO

 

OH.MY.GOD.

 

You're losing as a Yankee fan when you try that gimmick line

[Lester82]

Ok' date=' in my lifetime, six. Which is 4 more than anyone here can claim. Your first which was the most tainted championship in baseball since the Black Sox.[/quote']

 

AHAHAHAHAHA

 

Clemens/ Pettitte/ Knoblauch, etc. all say hello....

[Lester82]

And the 90's Yankees say hello and bring awesome gifts of HGH

 

don't forget "the cooler" in the 90's Yankee clubhouse that had what Clemens affectionately called "B-12" shots

 

pot.kettle.black meet Gom the Yankee fan........

 

 

 

 

 

 

And for one thing, I have no way of knowing that Arod has stopped using, or Mariano has stopped spitting

[Divinity]

And for one thing, I have no way of knowing that Arod has stopped using, or Mariano has stopped spitting

 

It's pretty disrespectful to try and tarnish possibly the greatest closer in baseball history even if he is a member of your arch rivals team.

 

Major League Baseball did their due diligence in the matter and, according to the New York Times, found photographic evidence that the spit passed his hand and the ball.

 

"From the available video and still photography we have, there is no evidence that Rivera spit on the ball," MLB vice president for public relations Patrick Courtney said, according to the newspaper."

 

http ://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/playoffs/2009/news/story?id=4580781

[BSN07]

Your first which was the most tainted championship in baseball since the Black Sox.

 

OMG Gom really?

[a700hitter]

Ok' date=' in my lifetime, six. Which is 4 more than anyone here can claim..[/quote']Come on Gom. How old were you in 1977 and 1978? I'll bet that you didn't have hair on your balls yet and you still had training wheels on your cab.

[yeszir]

It's pretty disrespectful to try and tarnish possibly the greatest closer in baseball history even if he is a member of your arch rivals team.

 

Is this a joke? Guys, we're getting lectured.

[ORS]

Ok' date=' in my lifetime, six. Which is 4 more than anyone here can [b']claim[/b]. Your first which was the most tainted championship in baseball since the Black Sox.

I'm pretty sure nobody here can claim anything, since nobody here was on the either team. I laugh when people boast on the accomplishments of others. If you didn't do it, I don't really care.

[Paradisecity]

I'm pretty sure nobody here can claim anything' date=' since nobody here was on the either team. I laugh when people boast on the accomplishments of others. If you didn't do it, I don't really care.[/quote']

 

 

But Gom did do it. He cheered, and of course most importantly, he watched the games.

[Gom]

I did cheer, and still do. I am the sole reason for Arod having a monster post-season. Ditto Brosius and Tino, Clemens nearly spearing Piazza, El Duque shutting down the Guardians, and Girardi's triple off of Maddux. This is common knowledge.

[TheKilo]

Come on Gom. How old were you in 1977 and 1978? I'll bet that you didn't have hair on your balls yet and you still had training wheels on your cab.

 

Ok, this is funny. Well done, that's how you repond to a troll post.

[yankees228]

I did cheer' date=' and still do. I am the sole reason for Arod having a monster post-season. Ditto Brosius and Tino, Clemens nearly spearing Piazza, El Duque shutting down the Guardians, and Girardi's triple off of Maddux. This is common knowledge.[/quote']

 

Leyritz hit the home run on his own, though?

[Paradisecity]

Yeah he didn't cheer for that f***er.

[Keeper]

It's pretty disrespectful to try and tarnish possibly the greatest closer in baseball history even if he is a member of your arch rivals team.

 

It's also kind of disrespectful for a newbie with 4 posts to pass judgment.