Ramirez Asks For Trade (merged)

[Cityofchampions33]

I hope he's saying lock for the 2007 rotation, which he very well may be, but i dont think he'll get that much trust in half a season, if he even comes up this year.

[YanksHater213]

Nice edit riverside

[Bostons_Finest]

then yall think of a trade im jsu throwing out ideas.

[Cityofchampions33]

think before u throw, think

[example1]

We are not getting Wright.

 

I have no interest whatsoever in Heilman. None. it seems like he projects as a #3 starter at best, he's already 27 and hasn't dominated ANYTHING. Cliff Floyd is decent, as a #5 or Six hitter. who hits 4th. Until that's clearly answered I'm not letting Manny go.

 

I would take Beltran or Delgado from the Mets, and Milledge sounds pretty good, but (as I've said in another thread) it is like willingly trading Hank Aaron or Yaz during his prime (if, indeed, .293 45 144 still counts as one's prime... I'm pretty sure it does). There is little chance that history will look back and care more about the person who was traded FOR manny. It will be another turn in the history of one of the greatest hitters ever. Perhaps Milledge will be a good, competent, solid professional baseball player. Maybe he'll even be as good and famous as Beltran or Andruw Jones. I'm not just being nostalgic, but in all seriousness Manny will go down as a considerably better player than Jones or Beltran, despite their defensive prowess and competent batwork.

 

I'm very, very skeptical about any Manny trade and hate the situation the Sox are in. If he would just stay they would have another tremendous team. Instead we're scrambling to try to trade someone who is guaranteed to not give us an equal return. Damn!

[Bostons_Finest]

Philles Get: Manny 2 prospects

Sox Get: Burrel n abreu

[riverside sluggers]

an opening day starter meaning as a part of the roster in 2007.

[YanksHater213]

Philles Get: Manny 2 prospects

Sox Get: Burrel n abreu

Just stop...

[schillingouttheks]

EDIT EDIT EDIT. Because apparently we love EDITING posts.

[schillingouttheks]

an opening day starter meaning as a part of the roster in 2007.

Well, that's pretty different from being a LOCK for the 2007 Opening Day.

[riverside sluggers]

dude wow sorry for not wording it right for you

[YanksHater213]

Yeah, you should be.

[schillingouttheks]

dude wow sorry for not wording it right for you

It's okay. I accept the apology. But lately I guess you've been saying sorry for "not wording things correctly" a lot.

[Cityofchampions33]

Thing is it'll be good to have some diversity in our rotation once Lester comes on up, so far all we have are power righties (meaning young pitcher such as Beckett, Papy)

[jimmycarter05]

Sox get: Miguel Cabera D-train

Marlins Get: Manny Pappelbon cash

 

 

ha ha, but aren't those the two players that the marlins want to build around for the future and aren't the cutting money, i don't think they would be willing to take on even 10 million a year

[example1]

So, back to the sox conversation...

 

I don't think there's much good speculating on potential trades toooo much. It is a fun thing to do, but it is nearly impossible to know what other teams are thinking, or the types of trades that are likely to go down.

 

I hear the rumors, and speculate about those but just thinking about great potential trades:

Manny Schilling and Beckett

Vlad K-Rod Colon and Molina

 

doesn't really do anyone any good.

 

Cabrera and D-Train for Manny and Papelbon? From a team that's trying to dump salary unlike any team since, well, the Marlins in the 90's? I don't think so. And why even throw Papelbon and D-Train in there? They are both very highly prized pitchers for both teams, both young. The teams wouldn't just randomly throw them in. They each fill each other's hole in the rotation with (seeing how Paps does this year) the same amount of success.

 

Anyway, it sucks that Manny wants to leave. It totally and utterly sucks.

[Cityofchampions33]

see the Manny wants to be traded thread, and youll see my response to that, this guy makes no sense, whatsoever

[ksushi]

Marlins get: Mayor Menino, Margret Papelbon (jons mother) and Dustin Pedroia

 

Sox Get: D-train, Create -a- Player with full stats, and cash and bat boys.

 

sounds like an awesome deal, if i were larry luchino i'd do that in a heart beat even though Ms. Papelbon throws gas and has a nasty corkscrew.

 

 

Sorry, but yeah, I think i have mentioned this once before and never really got a good response back or any at all, probably got lost in the shuffle, but what would you guys think about this.

 

The sox would send Manny to the Angels for Erstad and Ervin Santana. Erstad gives us a good glove at first and an O.K. bat. He reminds me a lot of Bill Mueller with alittle less consistency sometimes at the plate. Ervin Santana is a young stud.

 

2nd part, since I don't think that erstad and santana is quite enough to pry manny away from me, the Angels then send prospects to the DiamondBacks and they would send Javier Vasquez to the sox. The sox would also send Wells to the D-Backs who would be a valuable presence on a young team who could push for a playoff birth next year if they had a good offseason.

 

Eh? Eh?

[schillingouttheks]

Not to mention Erstad has some serious wheels for a 1B.

[Cityofchampions33]

Idk if I'd want vazquez but the rest sounds good, imagine that future rotation that would be nasty

 

Beckett

Lester

Papelbon

Santana

Fill in the Blank

 

I smile at the thought of that, 4 young guns destined for stardom in Boston, that is one hell of a rotation, like the A's Big 3 plus Santana.

[ahhchon]

Philles Get: Manny 2 prospects

Sox Get: Burrel n abreu

 

Sox get: Miguel Cabera D-train

Marlins Get: Manny Pappelbon cash

 

 

you are on crack... both those deals are absurd and will never happen.

 

john

[ksushi]

I think vazquez is underrated and hasn't reached his full potential, im not saying this guy is going to be great, but i think vazquez in the right place has the potential to be very consistent through out a season. I think there have been outstanding circumstances that have led to his decline in the 2nd half of the last two seasons. At the all star break he began to tire but nothing too bad and he had a conversation with a pitcher from another team who said something along the lines of when you tire pull off towards first base on your fastball to put alittle more on it. I remember the Baseball Tonight crew showing film of how that messed up his mechanics and made him go alittle wild. This second half it was supposedly his family being out of touch that rattled him. I'm not saying otherwise he would have pitched like Koufax, but I am saying that if he could fit into a rotation he could be a 15-18 game winner easily and a 3.20 - 3.90 ERA guy. From a five spot? Thats impressive. At least his second half declines didnt come from getting bopped off the coconut by a Carl Crawford line drive and there is some uncertaintly about his future or anything. *cough* clement. sorry if this stuff is incoherent, im really tired.

[yagmaster]

Another plus about have Erstad is he had one of the best defensive seasons at first base last year of all time. With Erstad, Pedroia (eventually), Renteria, and Lowell, we would have an excellent defensive infield to complement our great pitching. And with Manny out of the outfield, and the reigning AL Gold Glove winning catcher, the 2006 Red Sox could do something that they haven't in memory...have one of the better fielding teams in baseball. And, as they say, pitching and defense wins championships (see Chicago White Sox in 2005). I don't think losing Manny's offense would be as crippling as people (including me recently) might think. I think ksushi's proposed trade with Anaheim and Arizona is excellent.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

The sox would send Manny to the Angels for Erstad and Ervin Santana. Erstad gives us a good glove at first and an O.K. bat. He reminds me a lot of Bill Mueller with alittle less consistency sometimes at the plate. Ervin Santana is a young stud.

 

2nd part, since I don't think that erstad and santana is quite enough to pry manny away from me, the Angels then send prospects to the DiamondBacks and they would send Javier Vasquez to the sox. The sox would also send Wells to the D-Backs who would be a valuable presence on a young team who could push for a playoff birth next year if they had a good offseason.

 

Eh? Eh?

 

So the Red Sox would have Curt Schilling, Tim Wakefield, Josh Beckett, Matt Clement, Jonathan Papelbon, Ervin Santana, Bronson Arroyo, Javier Vazquez???

 

Well I certainly am a fan of Ervin Santana and think he will be very good. I don't mind Vazquez but we would have a numbers problem at that point and I'm not sure he is an upgrade over Clement or Arroyo. I would say the D-backs send us Troy Glaus and we can stick him at 1st base with Erstad in the OF. We still have a numbers problem but then we might be able to figure something out for Adam Dunn or perhaps Pat Burrell/Bobby Abreu.

 

We have so many possible deals running through our heads I wouldn't be shocked if NONE of them happen and this team stays the way it is.

[guapo34]

I've voiced my opinion on Erstad before. I can't believe people would want him as our starting first basemen. He has posted OPS's the last 5 seasons of .691, .702, .642, .746, and .696. He has been terrible. Plus he's making $8.5 million for the next 2 years. So for Manny people would be ok with Ervin Santana because he might become great and an overpaid first basement that hits worse than Alex Cora? Yes he is fast. Yes he plays good defense. Pokey Reese would play good defense at first base too.

[guapo34]

Big no on trading Papelbon away, this kid is projected to be a longtime Red Sox pitcher and he proved his worth this past season

 

 

You wouldn't trade Papelbon and Manny for Dontrelle Willis and Miguel Cabrera????? Considering the Marlins would do this is pretty pointless. Its obvious they wouldn't

[Cityofchampions33]

I've voiced my opinion on Erstad before. I can't believe people would want him as our starting first basemen. He has posted OPS's the last 5 seasons of .691, .702, .642, .746, and .696. He has been terrible. Plus he's making $8.5 million for the next 2 years. So for Manny people would be ok with Ervin Santana because he might become great and an overpaid first basement that hits worse than Alex Cora? Yes he is fast. Yes he plays good defense. Pokey Reese would play good defense at first base too.

 

See Yagmaster's post

[Cityofchampions33]

Yea, he sed it was something about throwing out ideas?

[ksushi]

I think that you would have to pay more for troy glaus other than just having the angels send prospects and sending wells. I personally would do that deal, ive heard similar deals thrown around in articles and to me I think this is the kind of thing that could get put together. And yeah, our rotation would fill out somehting like Schilling Beckett Papelbon Santana Vazquez with Wake and Arroyo in the pen, since both wake and arroyo are guys who have pitched out of the pen before and have expressed their willingness to do it again. Clement would be somewhat the odd man out, my bet is that he is sent somewhere else this offseason regardless of where ramirez goes or if he stays. I still think the odds of Ramirez staying are alittle bit more favorable than a trade, but the more I read into it, the more I start to think that this is alittle more real than i thought and he could be dealt.

[elsrbueno]

I think that you would have to pay more for troy glaus other than just having the angels send prospects and sending wells. I personally would do that deal, ive heard similar deals thrown around in articles and to me I think this is the kind of thing that could get put together. And yeah, our rotation would fill out somehting like Schilling Beckett Papelbon Santana Vazquez with Wake and Arroyo in the pen, since both wake and arroyo are guys who have pitched out of the pen before and have expressed their willingness to do it again. Clement would be somewhat the odd man out, my bet is that he is sent somewhere else this offseason regardless of where ramirez goes or if he stays. I still think the odds of Ramirez staying are alittle bit more favorable than a trade, but the more I read into it, the more I start to think that this is alittle more real than i thought and he could be dealt.

 

I really like your idea of this 3-way:

 

Anaheim gets:

Manny Ramirez

 

Arizona gets:

Prospects

 

Boston gets:

Erstad

Santana

Vazquez

 

 

I would like to compliment that by saying we then do the following: Trade Matt Clement to Texas for offense. If they're still willing to give up Blalock for pitching and Hank could play first I'd say do it. Otherwise Adrian Gonzalez + (Sorano maybe?) would be a nice package for Matt. OR trade Clement to Milwaukee for Overbay.

 

Then the rotation would be: Beckett, Schilling, Wakefield, Santana, Vazquez with Papelbon and Arroyo starting in the bullpen able to start in case of ineffectiveness or injury.

 

If a first baseman can be acquired for Clement, Erstad can play center (keep in mind he was also a gold glove centerfielder).

 

Also use the money savings to bring Johnny Damon back.

 

The lineup is most certainly weaker, but strong enough with a stacked pitching staff:

 

LF Damon

SS Renteria

DH Ortiz

3B Lowell

RF Nixon

C Varitek

1B Overbay/Gonzalez

CF Erstad

2B Pedroia/veteran (Soriano/Graffanino/Grudz)

 

I dislike how lefthanded it is, but with the pitching staff above-- it's certainly good enough to get us to the playoffs and beyond.