Red Sox going after Carlos Beltran?

[BoSox84]

This move would only make sense if we picked up Konerko in the off season. If you take out Mannys numbers and plug in Beltrans ans Konerko's our offense would increase obviously. We would have scored 979 runs and hit 210 HR's.

[Manny Goes Boom]

Do this trade, I love it.

 

Gee I wonder why?

 

This trade, ANY trade involving Manny is rediculous. Save money? We've never seemed to want to do this before, why start now? No hitter replaces him, Hammer is right. Konerko is NOT coming to Boston, people stop putting his name here. He LAUGHED at the thought of coming here. Huff is nice, but you really want to rely on a D-Ray to "protect" Ortiz.

 

Beltrans numbers were not Manny numbers, and not numbers to protect ANYONE:

 

Manny

 

.292 AVG 112 Runs 162 Hits 45 HR 144 RBI 80 BB .388 OBP .594 SLG OPS .982

 

Beltran

 

.266 AVG 83 Runs 155 Hits 16 HR 78 RBI 56 BB .330 OBP .414 SLG OPS .744

 

So who wants Carlos now? Even with Fenway, how much more would his numbers jump...29 HR's, I don't think so...66 RBI's, still have road games...29 Runs scored, not with what I see. Beltrans a very good player, but hes not making much less than Manny, but producing WAY less. This trade is beyond dumb, its not even close to even.

[Manny Goes Boom]

Would we be gaining or losing money if we made the trade? I would only do it if it would free up a little money.

 

Is $2 million enough? Beltran made $17.7 million last year and someone said his salary jumps up after some time.

[ORS]

I wouldn't mind trading Manny for Beltran if we can get Giles in the FA market. Giles (1.000 OPS outside of Petco Park) and Beltran circa 2002-2004 (.910 OPS) would be able to make up for Manny (career 1.000 OPS) and Damon (.784 career OPS). This would also be a defensive upgrade at two outfield positions. The Sox would save money on this scenario over the next 2-3 years (depending on Giles contract length) as well. Manny is due $19M over the next 3 years, and Johnny will command $10M per year in the FA market this year. Beltrans contract pays him an average of $17M over the next 6 years, and Giles can probably be had for $8-9M per year. That's letting $29M go and replacing it with $25-26M. The extra money could be spent on BP help.

 

EDIT: By saying "I wouldn't mind", I mean to say that I think we would be OK with this scenario in terms of relplacing value. I do not want to see Manny traded.

[Manny Goes Boom]

I wouldn't mind trading Manny for Beltran if we can get Giles in the FA market. Giles (1.000 OPS outside of Petco Park) and Beltran circa 2002-2004 (.910 OPS) would be able to make up for Manny (career 1.000 OPS) and Damon (.784 career OPS). This would also be a defensive upgrade at two outfield positions. The Sox would save money on this scenario over the next 2-3 years (depending on Giles contract length) as well. Manny is due $19M over the next 3 years, and Johnny will command $10M per year in the FA market this year. Beltrans contract pays him an average of $17M over the next 6 years, and Giles can probably be had for $8-9M per year. That's letting $29M go and replacing it with $25-26M. The extra money could be spent on BP help.

 

You're that convinced that Beltran will be as good as he was in the post-season last year huh? I'm not, and don't like the trade. I don't see good coming out of it from an offensive standpoint.

[ORS]

No, his postseason OPS was 1.558. I wouldn't expect that for a whole season from Barry Bonds pre-Balco investigation. I think his .744 OPS this year was a complete anomaly due to injury and pitcher friendly Shea stadium. I don't think it is any stretch of the imagination to suggest that he could produce a consistent .900 OPS playing half his games in Fenway.

[Calebvision]

I've been inactive for a while (I'm sure tons of posters on here probably appreciate that) but I'll chime in on this one.

 

First things first: Trading Manny for Beltran would NOT save us money, it is actually a larger financial commitment in the long run because Beltran is promised more money and later in his contract he's due $18 mil/yr.

 

Second: While I believe Carlos Beltran is a better player than he showed in New York last year, he is overpaid. $15-18 million/year is a TON of money. That having been said, when healthy he's as good as Johnny Damon as far as tracking down balls and has a much better arm. His offensive numbers would probably get a boost playing half his games at Fenway.

 

Third: I'm only interested in bringing Johnny Damon back as a left fielder. His arm is too weak to play center IMO (see Bernie Williams) and he's not getting any stronger. If he sticks to his demand of 5-6 years, he'll be playing somewhere else next season.

 

Finally, my thoughts on trading Manny Ramirez:

 

1. Keep in mind that trading him WILL hurt David Ortiz' production. He will receive FAR fewer hittable pitches without Manny's protection.

 

2. The main reason for trading Manny Ramirez would be to free up money to improve other areas of the ballclub (mainly pitching).

 

3. The Red Sox had the best offense in baseball the past 3 years, so I'm not particularly worried about replacing Manny Ramirez' offensive production exactly if trading him improves other areas of ballclub. Keep in mind what the ultimate objective is: To be competitive and ideally win the World Series each year, and it's a proven fact that being the best offensive team in baseball (2005 Yankees and Red Sox) can keep you competitive in the regular season, but doesn't get you very far in the playoffs. The 2004 Red Sox were not an exception to the rule. They won because of good performances from Pedro Martinez, Curt Schilling, and Derek Lowe in the playoffs.

 

Chicago rode a mediocre offense and 4 great pitchers to the AL crown.

 

Anyone who reads my posts knows I was all about trading Ramirez in 2003, again after last season, and at the trading deadline this year. I've probably even been quoted as saying "Let Manny be Manny somewhere else." But if the Red Sox DO trade Manny, they've got a lot of work to do ahead of them as far as improving other areas of the ballclub in the process.

 

Without Manny, this offense takes a nosedive and is nowhere near it's production of the last 3 years, period. Replacing Manny's production is impossible (short of bringing in Guerrero, Rodriguez, or Pujols... which is impossible), I'll admit that. But my point is that to be a competitive team you don't HAVE to replace Manny's production... but you do have to improve the team's weaknesses.

 

Manny and Ortiz ARE the "vaunted offense"! The others are largely mediocre, witht he exception of Damon at leadoff!

[BoSox84]

Looks like Beltran trade wont happen

 

If Ramirez does request to be traded, Genske says "his preference would be Anaheim. He also still loves Cleveland, and would go back there." Another possibility would be Arizona, if Boston would take some of the contracts the Diamondbacks are trying to move, including Troy Glaus and Luis Gonzalez. Texas was in play at the deadline.

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2199067

[User Name]

Hm. Well, it appears that my opinion will stay the same. I really don't want this trade. Beltran is overrated.

[thewarriorscode12]

Looks like Beltran trade wont happen

 

 

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2199067

Wow, I don't want any players from Arizona, Cleveland and I'm not sure who Anahiem would give.

[jimmycarter05]

Looks like Beltran trade wont happen

 

 

 

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2199067

 

 

i like clevelend alot...maybe we could get sizemore and crisp?hafner maybe?jake westbrook?cliff lee? i like a clevlend trade alot...they have alot of great young hitters...my ideal trade would be;

 

Red Sox Get;

 

Travis Hafner

Coco Crisp/Grady Sizemore(one of them)

 

Guardians Get:

 

Manny

 

thats a great trade right there...if this is pulled off(which it prolly won't be) the 2006 boston lineup would be

 

Crisp/Sizemore(whoever we get)Crisp would play LF, Sizemore is center

Renteria

Ortiz

Hafner

Tek

Nixon

Rondell White(CF)/Jacque Jones(LF)

Tony G

Youkilis

[Manny Goes Boom]

i like clevelend alot...maybe we could get sizemore and crisp?hafner maybe?jake westbrook?cliff lee? i like a clevlend trade alot...they have alot of great young hitters...my ideal trade would be;

 

Red Sox Get;

 

Travis Hafner

Coco Crisp/Grady Sizemore(one of them)

 

Guardians Get:

 

Manny

 

thats a great trade right there...if this is pulled off(which it prolly won't be) the 2006 boston lineup would be

 

Crisp/Sizemore(whoever we get)Crisp would play LF, Sizemore is center

Renteria

Ortiz

Hafner

Tek

Nixon

Rondell White(CF)/Jacque Jones(LF)

Tony G

Youkilis

 

OK DUDE. First off... If we did trade to the Guardians, we would have to get more than Sizemore and Hafner. Plain and simple. Add Cliff Lee and C.C. Sabathia and thats a better trade but still thats not happening and Manny is too valuable.

 

I also heard about the Diamondbacks trade rumors involving Manny Luis Gonzalez and Troy Glaus (On TV tonight). Boston in a Manny trade would want to either improve or get less money, and that kind of trade is awful. Glaus is injury prone, and Gonzalez is a nice hitter but his arm is awful, and we couldn't put him at DH because we have Ortiz. In this we would need a Brandon Webb and Jose Valverde on top of Gonzalez and Glaus, but I don't like us trading Manny to anyone.

 

OH, and that lineup is too left handed. Ortiz being protected by another lefty...??? Thats what makes Manny and Ortiz so great, their hitting ability and they are a righty-lefty combo.

[Mudvillemike]

amen..ozzie gullien's approach to baseball is simple and it gets you places..the white soxs didn't get runs, they manufactured them...

 

But they didn't manufacture all that many. The won because of great starting pitching, which is what we really need to worry about. Especially in the playoffs where the 1-2-3 guys start most of the games.

 

As for the topic subject, I would only consider this trade if I were 100% sure that last year was a fluke year for Beltran. I just don't see how this trade makes sense when one considers Beltran's gigantic salary. With Manny, we know have one of the greatest hitters ever.

[elsrbueno]

One Red Seat: How many runs did the OBP obsessed Red Sox score in the postseason? The way the Red Sox offense scores runs works out tremendously in the regular season, and can get them tons of runs against the Devil Rays and Royals of the world. And keep in mind that the Red Sox OUTSCORED the Yankees in head to head play but lost the season series. Overall runs scored numbers can be obscured by some laughers.

 

The bottom line is (and I've been saying this for years) is that waiting for the 3 run homer simply does not work in the postseason. It just doesn't happen. The Atlanta Braves of the 90s are a PERFECT example. They had a tremendous pitching staff and some sluggers, but couldn't manufacture a run to save their lives.

 

They made the playoffs every year, but couldn't score runs in the playoffs because the competition is better.

 

All the White Sox offense got them was the best record in the AL and a AL Pennant.

 

The Red Sox need to get back to what brought them glory (and what builds championship teams). FUNDAMENTALS. Pitching, defense, and playing good baseball. Not waiting for the other team to make 3 mistakes in one inning. How about forcing the other team to make mistakes by playing aggressively?

 

The point is not to trade Manny Ramirez to save money. Even if they trade Manny Ramirez the payroll will be about the same. Why? Because they can USE that money to improve the team.

 

I've said this 1000 times but I'll say it one more time: Superstars like Manny Ramirez do not win World Championships. It's the Bill Muellers and the Trot Nixons who know how to play the game the right way who do that. and isn't that the ultimate goal?

 

Get rid of Millar and Manny, get some people who can run the bases, play defense, and will hustle down the line on a groundball for crying out loud.

 

How many times has the best team in baseball also featured the game's best hitter? I'd be willing to bet it's less than half the time.

 

EDIT: I'm not saying necessarily trade him for Beltran, but if trading him improves other areas, I'd be thrilled for Manny Ramirez to be someone else's headache.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

It's the Bill Muellers and the Trot Nixons who know how to play the game the right way who do that. and isn't that the ultimate goal?

 

Get rid of Millar and Manny, get some people who can run the bases, play defense, and will hustle down the line on a groundball for crying out loud.

 

This is what I was saying....

 

If you look back at the season you will notice our production was way down position by position for the most part. Whoever was playing at 1B was not killing the ball by any means. Trot Nixon deffinitly had an offseason. Throughout the course of the year our 2B numbers were horrendous until Graffanino got here which was toward the end of the season. Edgar Renteria had the most amazing streak of hot/cold this year. Lets not even talk about the pitching...and this team won over 90 games?? That is simply incredible.

 

There are quite a few holes to fill and the best way to fill them is by trading. I've noticed David Wells wants to go back to San Diego so that might help somewhere but not likely. We have some other starters we could consider in a possible deal so this really brings us back to Manny. I saw Cleveland and Anaheim on the list of potential teams.....I also saw names like Grady Sizemore, Travis Hafner, Coco Crisp....Cleveland would be very stupid to move these guys for a $20 million player in his 30s. The Guardians impressed me more this season than the Chicago White Sox...look how young they are and how awesome they will be for years if they can lock these guys up. Johnny Peralta, Belliard, Sizemore, Hafner, Martinez....thats a fantastic core group of players and I would love to get my hands on any of them by giving up Manny. If you talk about Anaheim and mention names Jared Weaver, Casey Kotchman, Dallas McPherson, Brandon Wood....im drooling cause they are going to be awesome players....just so everyone knows Bobby Jenks was previously owned by the Angels and was just outside of there top 5 prospects not long ago....

 

THAT is the way to go....I want players like that over a player like Carlos Beltran. I know I know everyone wants someone protecting Ortiz. I think we put too much emphasis on that though. Ortiz will still put up huge numbers cause no matter how good he is....he will still hit 3/10 so pitchers want that out. There isn't a lot covering Derek Lee, Miguel Tejada, Pujols and who was covering Manny this year? The top hitters in the league will continue to hit so David Ortiz is the least of my worries on the Boston Red Sox. Fill the holes on this team with true "gamers" I like to call them and have top pitching. We will hit the ball just fine like we always do...we need to stop others from hitting the ball and we need to play with passion like we did last season.

[ORS]

While I do agree that some run manufacturing would be helpful at times, the idea that our offensive strategy failed is a bit overboard IMO. Manny and Papi combined for 5 of the 9 RBI for the Sox. There respective OPSs' were 1.317 and 1.083. The reason we didn't score that many runs is the guys in front of them didn't get on all that often. If the #1 and #2 guys aren't getting on base, you aren't scoring a lot of runs no matter what your offensive philosophy.

 

We lost because we got outpitched. The Angels held the White Sox to less than 3 ER in 5 of the 6 games they played. We do that and we probably win the series.

 

If I recall correctly, the Braves lost just as many postseason games because they had bullpens that couldn't hold a lead as they did because they couldn't hit the ball out of the yard.

[thewarriorscode12]

One Red Seat: How many runs did the OBP obsessed Red Sox score in the postseason? The way the Red Sox offense scores runs works out tremendously in the regular season, and can get them tons of runs against the Devil Rays and Royals of the world. And keep in mind that the Red Sox OUTSCORED the Yankees in head to head play but lost the season series. Overall runs scored numbers can be obscured by some laughers.

 

The bottom line is (and I've been saying this for years) is that waiting for the 3 run homer simply does not work in the postseason. It just doesn't happen. The Atlanta Braves of the 90s are a PERFECT example. They had a tremendous pitching staff and some sluggers, but couldn't manufacture a run to save their lives.

 

They made the playoffs every year, but couldn't score runs in the playoffs because the competition is better.

 

All the White Sox offense got them was the best record in the AL and a AL Pennant.

 

The Red Sox need to get back to what brought them glory (and what builds championship teams). FUNDAMENTALS. Pitching, defense, and playing good baseball. Not waiting for the other team to make 3 mistakes in one inning. How about forcing the other team to make mistakes by playing aggressively?

 

The point is not to trade Manny Ramirez to save money. Even if they trade Manny Ramirez the payroll will be about the same. Why? Because they can USE that money to improve the team.

 

I've said this 1000 times but I'll say it one more time: Superstars like Manny Ramirez do not win World Championships. It's the Bill Muellers and the Trot Nixons who know how to play the game the right way who do that. and isn't that the ultimate goal?

 

Get rid of Millar and Manny, get some people who can run the bases, play defense, and will hustle down the line on a groundball for crying out loud.

 

How many times has the best team in baseball also featured the game's best hitter? I'd be willing to bet it's less than half the time.

 

EDIT: I'm not saying necessarily trade him for Beltran, but if trading him improves other areas, I'd be thrilled for Manny Ramirez to be someone else's headache.

Dude, I'm pretty sure we won the World Series last year playing the same style of offensive ball we played this year. The only difference is, last year we had: Schilling, Martinez, Lowe, Wakefield, soild bullpen, a healthy Foulke. It's true that superstars don't win Championships, but Manny is far to key for our team to just trade him.

[thewarriorscode12]

While I do agree that some run manufacturing would be helpful at times, the idea that our offensive strategy failed is a bit overboard IMO. Manny and Papi combined for 5 of the 9 RBI for the Sox. There respective OPSs' were 1.317 and 1.083. The reason we didn't score that many runs is the guys in front of them didn't get on all that often. If the #1 and #2 guys aren't getting on base, you aren't scoring a lot of runs no matter what your offensive philosophy.

 

We lost because we got outpitched. The Angels held the White Sox to less than 3 ER in 5 of the 6 games they played. We do that and we probably win the series.

 

If I recall correctly, the Braves lost just as many postseason games because they had bullpens that couldn't hold a lead as they did because they couldn't hit the ball out of the yard.

Exactly, just think if Johnny Damon or Rent gets on board for either of Manny's two HR's in game 3, they suddenly become 2 or 3 run shots and do a lot of damage. Our philosophy didn't lose us the game, we just got outplayed.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

There are so few games in the playoffs anything can happen. You only have a possible 5 games to beat a team so its just a matter of getting there and rolling the dice. You hope everyone is hot and gets on a fast roll. Clearly the White Sox were on a roll going into the playoffs sweeping the Guardians and the Red Sox just had the AL East Division lead ripped away. Thats what happens but the trick is to get there every year and see what happens.

 

I wonder if there is a way Theo could construct some crazy deal to sneak Brandon Webb away from the Diamondbacks.

[MC Hammer]

OK DUDE. First off... If we did trade to the Guardians, we would have to get more than Sizemore and Hafner. Plain and simple. Add Cliff Lee and C.C. Sabathia and thats a better trade but still thats not happening and Manny is too valuable.

I think you're seriously underestimating the talent in Cleveland. Hafner and Seizmore and going to be all stars next year. I agree that it's not enough, but if you throw in any type of pitching I could see it as a deal that Theo would have to atleast consider.

 

I don't think Cleveland would even consider taking on Manny's contract though. They've built a very nice (cheap)team, a team that is young, and a team that will grow together. I don't see them wanting to trade 2-4 good to great young pieces for Manny.

[elsrbueno]

Exactly, just think if Johnny Damon or Rent gets on board for either of Manny's two HR's in game 3, they suddenly become 2 or 3 run shots and do a lot of damage. Our philosophy didn't lose us the game, we just got outplayed.

 

The Red Sox got outplayed because the team lacked solid fundamentals. If we can improve our defense by getting Manny the hell out of left field and getting an outfielder in left who can track down some balls, and also a center fielder who can throw, that'll go a long way towards improving the defense.

 

Yes, we need better pitchers, but ask any pitcher who has someone like Mike Cameron, Andruw Jones, or Torri Hunter behind them-- those guys save runs and win baseball games with their defensive ability.

 

My point is that we need to be able to win baseball games when we're not hitting homers. Being able to manufacture runs (instead of getting two guys on base and have three guys strike out trying to hit the 3-run homer) compliments your ability to hit the ball out of the yard.

 

I'll admit Manny Ramirez drives me crazy with his bad attitude and huge paycheck. Frankly, I think we're stuck with him because nobody else is stupid enough to take on that contract for a one-dimensional player.....

 

The Red Sox do not need Manny Ramirez to be a competitive team, plain and simple. Can they win WITH him? Absolutely, they proved it last year.... they just need to surround him with players who actually give a crap.

[JimBrown32]

Beltran freeing up money? Ha. Last I checked he's contract is still handled by Bora$$.

 

Highly doubt the Mets are going to jump off the Beltran train after just a year. Even with the whole Manny thing over the summer.

 

Manny costs about 22 million and Beltran is overpaid aswell, but at about 15 million, how is that NOT freeing up some bucks, that's about 7 million ya dumb ass, Beltran, if he goes into that form where he was at in the 2004 playoffs, the Red Sox would get the better end of the deal. But you know, everyone has a bad year, Manny's getting old, he had a good year, but toward the end he fell a part a bit, is it any coincidence he was falliong apart? He's old, it's a good move and they could still land 1 susperstar or two All Star's with that money, Soriano is 5 million and huff isn't 10 million, he's not worth it, come on it's a good move.

[MANNYHOF24]

With out Manny the redsox arnt a playoff team.

[MANNYHOF24]

Manny costs about 22 million and Beltran is overpaid aswell, but at about 15 million, how is that NOT freeing up some bucks, that's about 7 million ya dumb ass, Beltran, if he goes into that form where he was at in the 2004 playoffs, the Red Sox would get the better end of the deal. But you know, everyone has a bad year, Manny's getting old, he had a good year, but toward the end he fell a part a bit, is it any coincidence he was falliong apart? He's old, it's a good move and they could still land 1 susperstar or two All Star's with that money, Soriano is 5 million and huff isn't 10 million, he's not worth it, come on it's a good move.

 

So your saying Manny's Season fell apart at the end, what did you not watch the the month of the season when he carried the team and had his best offensive month of the season. He had like 11 Sept homers and like 25+ Rbis, maybe you should do some reseach before you make some stupid comment like that. And he was the only one to hit in the playoffs

[ORS]

Manny's getting old, he had a good year, but toward the end he fell a part a bit, is it any coincidence he was falliong apart?

For what it's worth, Manny's line from Sept. 1 looks like this:

 

110 AB, 20 R, 34 H, 12 HR, 29 RBI, .309/.418/.654/1.072

 

Then he did this in the playoffs:

 

10 AB, 2 R, 3 H, 2 HR, 2 RBI, .300/.417/.900/1.317

 

His slightly off-career numbers were due to his very cold May, where he did this:

 

94 AB, 11 R, 22 H, 4 HR, 16 RBI, .234/.321/.404/.725

 

EDIT: All in favor of trading Manny, I give you one key fact to consider. There are only 10 players in the history of the game with a minimum of 3000 plate appearances that have a career OPS of 1.000 or higher. Manny Ramirez is one of them, coming in at #10. Here's the list:

 

1. Babe Ruth - 1.1636

2. Ted Williams - 1.1155

3. Lou Gehrig - 1.0798

4. Barry Bonds - 1.0533

5. Todd Helton - 1.0404

6. Jimmie Foxx - 1.0376

7. Albert Pujols - 1.0372

8. Hank Greenberg - 1.0169

9. Rogers Hornsby - 1.0103

10. Manny Ramirez - 1.0076

 

source

 

I'm not in favor of trading away someone whose production cannot be replaced. Yes, Pujols and Helton could do that, but Albert's not getting traded and Helton's deal is worse than Manny's. He's getting less money, but his contract runs until 2011. Yikes!

[JimBrown32]

So your saying Manny's Season fell apart at the end, what did you not watch the the month of the season when he carried the team and had his best offensive month of the season. He had like 11 Sept homers and like 25+ Rbis, maybe you should do some reseach before you make some stupid comment like that. And he was the only one to hit in the playoffs

 

Are you retarded, he was nothing compareed to earlier in the year, he had a slump, so shut your mouth and stop talking. Are you an idiot, three high quality players is better than one overpaid prick. I believe YOU should do the research.

 

Edit: You can't f***ing blame s***** numbers on the cold, Minneapolis is way colder than Boston. Manny is getting older with each year, what is he, 33, some guys start falling apart by then, also, would you want a selfish childish prick on your team?

[Fenways Faithful]

Are you retarded, he was nothing compareed to earlier in the year, he had a slump, so shut your mouth and stop talking. Are you an idiot, three high quality players is better than one overpaid prick. I believe YOU should do the research.

 

Edit: You can't f***ing blame s***** numbers on the cold, Minneapolis is way colder than Boston. Manny is getting older with each year, what is he, 33, some guys start falling apart by then, also, would you want a selfish childish prick on your team?

 

are kidding me? manny is getting old? he's 33 and still had 45 HR's and 144's RBi's. Everyone has slumps. even your so called "high quality players" are going to go through slumps. Manny's presence in the lineup by ortiz and his numbers alone are better than any other players we could get. Besides Pujols or some other all star that we know we cant get.

[Fenways Faithful]

33, some guys start falling apart by then

you say some guys start falling apart by 33. Well i dont know if you have really followed Manny's career but he isnt just some guy since 1998 he has been hitting 30plus HR's and almost over 100 Rbi's every year. Find some other person that can do what manny does and than we can consider a trade. Beltran is nothing to Manny.

[JimBrown32]

are kidding me? manny is getting old? he's 33 and still had 45 HR's and 144's RBi's. Everyone has slumps. even your so called "high quality players" are going to go through slumps. Manny's presence in the lineup by ortiz and his numbers alone are better than any other players we could get. Besides Pujols or some other all star that we know we cant get.

 

What the hell are you talking about, Manny's not a good presence at all, he's a negative presence. Ortiz doesn't like him, they could get three high quality players like Beltran huff and Soriano for Manny and if we gave up possibly Damon, no, you think because he's good he's a good presence, but not in the locker room, or outside the diamond. He's an ass, he's dumb, he's selfish and he's childish, I can do this all day long if I wanted

[Fenways Faithful]

1. Babe Ruth - 1.1636

2. Ted Williams - 1.1155

3. Lou Gehrig - 1.0798

4. Barry Bonds - 1.0533

5. Todd Helton - 1.0404

6. Jimmie Foxx - 1.0376

7. Albert Pujols - 1.0372

8. Hank Greenberg - 1.0169

9. Rogers Hornsby - 1.0103

10. Manny Ramirez - 1.0076

 

If were getting anyone on this list or who can even come close to it than i think we should consider it. But its not likely.