Ortiz a Shoo-In for MVP

[empirestrikesback26]

wait who missed a month this season?

Vlad, remember he missed a load of time with the separated shoulder? Plus he he's had 1 RBI in like a two weeks or something.

[empirestrikesback26]

ya

Yeah, I agree.

[ARod2212]

oh let me guess gay rod should get it

LOL GAY! IT RHYMES WITH A! IT'S A PLAY ON WORDS!!!

 

 

Alex Rodriguez is most the most qualified for AL MVP, and should win it. Great offensive player, and great defensive player at one of the most difficult positions on the field. (60 consecutive games w/o an error at third, tops in the bigs)

[ORS]

Vlad, remember he missed a load of time with the separated shoulder? Plus he he's had 1 RBI in like a two weeks or something.

Two weeks ago I thought Vlad was the most likely to contend for the award, but ARod is running away with it right now. That being said, the next month will weigh most heavily in the voters minds.

[Optimist]

LOL GAY! IT RHYMES WITH A! IT'S A PLAY ON WORDS!!!

 

[ksushi]

oh, i wasnt saying that vlad had a chance this year, i was just saying that he probably wasnt top candidate last year going into september

[ksushi]

Yeah, I agree.

 

I agree too.

 

Empire i just want you to know that your post right there made me happy inside. That was clutch, you should be an MVP of something for that. I thought i was the only one who saw that. You're the man.

[BigPapiEnFuego]

LOL GAY! IT RHYMES WITH A! IT'S A PLAY ON WORDS!!!

 

 

ROFL!!!! That has to be the funniest thing i ever read on this forum, or any other forum. I am still laughing out loud right now, at 2 in the morning.

 

Empire i just want you to know that your post right there made me happy inside. That was clutch, you should be an MVP of something for that. I thought i was the only one who saw that. You're the man.

 

That also was extremely funny. Thank you guys. You made my weekend right there.

[26 to 6]

Our love for the sox blinds us from seeing the real picture, yet you and all these yankee fans keep bitch and moaning alll the damn time about how bias ESPN is. Maybe your yankee love is keeping you from knowing that we don't give a s***, because after all this is a damn red sox forum. Half of you seem too stupid enough to realize that we did not care, we don't care now, and in the future we will not care. Give it up. You won't change our opinion. We think most of you are idiots, you think we are idiots. So what. f*** off already.

 

It's like obsessive christians going into a mosque and trying to convert muslims. It doesn't work, and if it goes on too long somoene is going to get a rock upside there head.

you guys think your idiots too

 

-------

on the ESPN subject, its ridiculous, the network itself doesnt present a bias, its the analysts, a lot of them are bias in favor of the Yankees and a lot of them are bias against the Yankees. They either love the Yankees or hate them...im so tired of hearing this ESPN s***, its irrelevent.

[redsoxrules]

well i wouldnt count out ortiz out yet , especially after hitting 5 homeruns last week, looks like hes heating abit more too now that its crunch time

[HOFer51]

well i wouldnt count out ortiz out yet , especially after hitting 5 homeruns last week, looks like hes heating abit more too now that its crunch time

And if A-Rod hits 5 homeruns next week....?

[redsoxrules]

And if A-Rod hits 5 homeruns next week....?

lol, im just saying that ortiz is hitting better as of late and if he continues he will have a great shot

[yankeessuck013]

First off I'd like to say that although I throughly have no respect for Arod, I can't hid the fact that I do respect his abilities and skills as a ball player. He truly is one of the top ball players of the last 10 years and deserves most of the praise shot in his direction. His #'s and production are all top notch but the reason I don't think he's the MVP this year is simple; he's not a clutch hitter. Here are his batting #'s w/ runners on base compared to Ramirez and Ortiz this season.

 

W/ runners on-base

A-Rod 17hr, 86rbi, .293 avg, 266ab

 

Papi 15hr, 101rbi, .311avg, 254ab

 

Manny 26hr, 113rbi, .337avg, 246ab

 

w/RISP

A-Rod 6hr, 63 rbi, .273avg, 161ab

 

Papi 7hr, 80rbi, .345avg, 142ab

 

Manny 17hr, 94rbi, .345avg 144ab

 

W/RISp +2 out

A-Rod 4hr, 31 rbi, .281avg, 71ab

 

Papi 5hr, 33rbi, .370avg, 54ab

 

Manny 5hr, 34rbi, .297avg, 64ab

 

MVP's hit when it counts most, MVP's drive in the runners on-base, MVP's come up big in big situations and if there's anybody who personifies those qualities it's Papi.

 

On a side note for all you Manny haters look at those #'s w/RISP, freggin sick, he's like a shark when blood's in the water with men on base.....but Ortiz still gets my vote over manny

[Optimist]

Interesting article, at least to me.

 

The man to beat

Tom Verducci, SI.com

 

Close MVP races are often decided in September, the month that matters most to voters. Just ask Chipper Jones (1999), Jason Giambi (2000), Miguel Tejada (2002) and Vladimir Guerrero (2004), all of whom won in recent years by coming up "clutch" in September. With three weeks to play, no such drama exists in the NL, where Albert Pujols is the best player in the league among contending teams and should finally win the award.

 

The AL race, however, leaves open the possibility that the final three weeks will decide the winner. Guerrero of the Angels, David Ortiz of the Red Sox and Alex Rodriguez of the Yankees -- born seven months apart -- are the leading candidates. Paul Konerko of the White Sox and Travis Hafner of the Guardians deserve consideration. Konerko, though, didn't hit early when the Sox were red hot and, like Andruw Jones, has failed too often with runners in scoring position. Hafner can't be found among the league leaders in RBIs or total bases, which is no way to win the MVP for a guy who doesn't play defense.

 

Is there time for Guerrero, Ortiz and Rodriguez to nail down the award with a handful of game-winning hits? Sure. Ortiz, in fact, added to his reputation as a monster clutch hitter with another game-winning jack to beat the Blue Jays on Monday. But understand this: the award is Rodriguez's to lose. As long as he doesn't go Tony Womack on the Yankees in their final 20 games, Rodriguez will become the franchise's first MVP since Don Mattingly in 1985. (A-Rod is off to a .324 start this month.)

 

How do I know this? There are at least half a dozen good reasons:

 

1. Rodriguez has had the best season statistically. He leads the league in runs, home runs, total bases and slugging, and is second to teammate Giambi in on-base percentage. He's been on base 15 more times than Ortiz and 40 more than Guerrero. He's started every game this year and hit 26 percent more home runs at Yankee Stadium (24) than any right-handed hitter in the history of the famed ballpark.

 

2. At such a late stage in the season his MVP does not hinge on whether the Yankees get into the postseason. New York may not make the playoffs, but it will play meaningful games probably to the final week of the season.

 

3. He's been good enough in the clutch. Ortiz is the gold standard for clutch hitters because of his knack for hitting home runs, not just singles, in big spots. But the idea that Rodriguez doesn't come through often enough in big spots is a myth. Let's look at how the Big Three have done entering this week in close-and-late situations (seventh inning or later in a tie or one-run game, or with the potential tying run at least on deck):

 

Rodriguez is just as tough an out in a big spot as Ortiz -- actually, a little tougher if you read on-base percentage as the percentage of time the batter wins the war against the pitcher. The numbers do show that Ortiz is better at delivering the big blow -- the best in the game, in fact. But don't discount Rodriguez's work in key spots.

 

4. Ortiz doesn't play defense. There is no way to understate this. The guy is half a player. He is a specialist. He can devote his entire energies to his at-bats. There is a good reason why no position player ever has won the MVP with fewer than 97 games played in the field (Don Baylor, 1979). A DH would have to be miles better than the next best player who actually contributes to his team in both halves of the game. Is Ortiz having that kind of a season over Rodriguez? No. Meanwhile, Rodriguez, after a shaky start, has provided Gold Glove quality defense at third base, once running off the longest errorless streak among all AL third basemen over the past seven years.

 

5. Rodriguez has been consistent. In his worst month -- July -- Rodriguez batted .281 with a .400 OBP. Ortiz has hit .264 since the All-Star break. Guerrero hit .224 in May and .208 in July.

 

6. Rodriguez has been better against the league's best teams. Take a look at how the Big Three have done against their five opponents still in the race for a playoff spot (from among Boston, New York, Chicago, Cleveland, Los Angeles and Oakland):

 

No, Rodriguez doesn't have the award locked up. After all, September (October included) historically is the worst month of his career (.264). And if Rodriguez slips and Ortiz keeps banging out late-game home runs or if Guerrero goes off the way he did last September, this could be another season in which the MVP Award is won late. But with three weeks to play, Rodriguez is the favorite.

 

Link

[Cityofchampions33]

Even though ARod has the better stats and leads the league in a lot of areas, those stats certainly stand out for me. He wins more games in tough situations than anyone I know, plus, AROd should be puttin up those stats, he makes 20 mill a year, where as Papi only makes 5 mill+, about 1/4 of ARod's salary, I'd most definately want 4 papi's over 1 ARod, to hit that is.

[yankeessuck013]

If A-rod gets another MVP, it should be when he is the main drive in getting his team to the playoffs and the World Series. He hasn't done that yet. Sheffield almost did it last year but he was juiced with the 'mystery' $30,000 cream he bought...I still can't figure how he got an MVP win when he was with the Rangers and they were in last place. How does that work??

 

If you go by the numbers but Ortiz has more big game/game winning HR's/Hits than Arod this year. + his over all #'s are a bit better. Now I know A-Rod has a higher avg and OB% and 41 jacks but 24 of those HR's are solos, which are nice but only 1 run. I'd rather a guy hit a 2b with risp than a solo hr any day. It's kinda like a high flying dunk in basketball, sure looks good but it counts the same as a layup and I'd rather have the guy drain a 3ptr.

[riverside sluggers]

Last 10 Games:

 

David Ortiz- 11 for 30 (.300 avg) 4 HRs, 8 RBIs, 7 Runs scored, 11 Walks (11 game streak of drawing at least 1 walk per game)

 

Alex Rodriguez- 12 for 37 (.295 avg) 1 Double, 1 HR, 5 RBIs, 7 Runs scored, 2 Walks

[Optimist]

Last 10 Games:

 

David Ortiz- 11 for 30 (.300 avg) 4 HRs, 8 RBIs, 7 Runs scored, 11 Walks (11 game streak of drawing at least 1 walk per game)

 

Alex Rodriguez- 12 for 37 (.295 avg) 1 Double, 1 HR, 5 RBIs, 7 Runs scored, 2 Walks

 

Good thing they judge by 162 games instead of 10.

 

Eh...neither right now is a 'shoo - in;' I think most of us can agree with that. This, like who will be making the post season, will be up in the air until we turn our calendars over to October.

[Sizzlin22]

Ortiz did push his chances higher with another clutch late inning home last night. Voters will definitly notice stuff life that.

[riverside sluggers]

Good thing they judge by 162 games instead of 10.

 

Eh...neither right now is a 'shoo - in;' I think most of us can agree with that. This, like who will be making the post season, will be up in the air until we turn our calendars over to October.

 

really I didnt f***ing know that, jeez besides what helps drive the vote getters is what is done in the last month of the season. Like Vlad last year in September carrying the team on his back with 12 HRs helped his cause to get the MVP

[Optimist]

really I didnt f***ing know that, jeez...

 

 

Enough hostility?

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

Ortiz has been great this year but IMO as long as Ortiz has had most of his AB's as a DH he should not win the MVP. Being the everyday DH is such an advantage I dont think some of you relize. During the game while his teamates are out in the field he could be in the cage hitting or watching video of an AB he just had and breaking down how the pitcher pitched to him. PLUS the major reason why a DH should never win the MVP is he doesnt play defense. When you dont have to play in the field it greatly diminishes the chance of you getting hurt. If you put Vlad and A-Rod at DH for the same amount of AB's I'll bet they would have better numbers then they have.

[yankeessuck013]

Ortiz has been great this year but IMO as long as Ortiz has had most of his AB's as a DH he should not win the MVP. Being the everyday DH is such an advantage I dont think some of you relize. During the game while his teamates are out in the field he could be in the cage hitting or watching video of an AB he just had and breaking down how the pitcher pitched to him. PLUS the major reason why a DH should never win the MVP is he doesnt play defense. When you dont have to play in the field it greatly diminishes the chance of you getting hurt. If you put Vlad and A-Rod at DH for the same amount of AB's I'll bet they would have better numbers then they have.

 

like I had said before, many yankee fans are calling for Mariano to win the Cy Young, its the same argument here.

 

And in The 80's Don Baylor as a DH, mind you, won the MVP for anaheim

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

like I had said before, many yankee fans are calling for Mariano to win the Cy Young, its the same argument here.

 

And in The 80's Don Baylor as a DH, mind you, won the MVP for anaheim

I'm not calling for Rivera to win the CY Young. They have an award for relievers. As for Don Baylor (who won the award in 1979) he played 97 games in the OF and 65 games at DH. Ortiz has only played 10 games at first. IMO thats a huge advantage. Once again I'm not diminishing what Ortiz has done but he has put up most of those #'s at DH and the numbers still arent better then A-Rod who has played almost all of his games at 3B.

[ARod2212]

Link

You win the internet!

 

If we are going to put DH's into the mix, why not some votes for Jason Giambi? He's #2 in OPS, the gold standard of judging hitters and #1 in OBP, easily the most important individual offensive stat in baseball. He's also #1 in Runs Created per game, for you sabermetrics guys.

 

Nobody seems to be appreciating just how good a year Giambi is having. Check this, Giambi has a 1.142 OPS since the ASG, 19 HRs and 42 RBIs. Just mind boggling numbers, and he's barely getting any dap.

[yankeessuck013]

Ortiz has been great this year but IMO as long as Ortiz has had most of his AB's as a DH he should not win the MVP. Being the everyday DH is such an advantage I dont think some of you relize. During the game while his teamates are out in the field he could be in the cage hitting or watching video of an AB he just had and breaking down how the pitcher pitched to him. PLUS the major reason why a DH should never win the MVP is he doesnt play defense. When you dont have to play in the field it greatly diminishes the chance of you getting hurt. If you put Vlad and A-Rod at DH for the same amount of AB's I'll bet they would have better numbers then they have.

 

let's examine what the term mvp means...... most valuble player. it says nothing about playing defense. is there anyone in mlb that would hurt a team more to be without than ortiz.

 

Guess what. Believe it or not the rules say that DH is a position so why shouldn't a DH be able to win MVP. A position is a position.

[ARod2212]

like I had said before, many yankee fans are calling for Mariano to win the Cy Young, its the same argument here.

 

And in The 80's Don Baylor as a DH, mind you, won the MVP for anaheim

The Cy Young is the best pitcher in the league, which can be a closer. The MVP is most valuable player. Unless a DH is putting up ridiculously better numbers than the entire field(ie. Bonds '01), it has to go to a player who brings defensive value over someone who doesn't. And considering the fact that Rodriguez has better numbers, I can't see how it's even a discussion.

[yankeessuck013]

The Cy Young is the best pitcher in the league, which can be a closer. The MVP is most valuable player. Unless a DH is putting up ridiculously better numbers than the entire field(ie. Bonds '01), it has to go to a player who brings defensive value over someone who doesn't. And considering the fact that Rodriguez has better numbers, I can't see how it's even a discussion.

 

Why do Yankee fans continually make the erroneous claim that Ortiz CAN'T play 1B? He can play the field just fine, and has. Francona has to put a DH in the lineup every game and Ortiz is very productive as a DH. It's a no-brainer. Some players need to play D to get "into the game" ...i'm sure if that were the case, he'd be out there and Millar would be DH.

 

If being MVP were important to Ortiz, he might actually demand to play defense so voters couldn't use this against him. Of course, Papi is perfectly happy to do what is best for the team, and he takes great pride in doing as much as he can with his bat for that reason. THAT is what the MVP is supposed to be about. Ortiz is so much more the MVP than Arod it's laughable. Arod is all about Arod and it has always been so. He doesn't elevate anyone or anything...the fact that his teams never wins make that fairly obvious.

[yankeessuck013]

Ortiz has been great this year but IMO as long as Ortiz has had most of his AB's as a DH he should not win the MVP. Being the everyday DH is such an advantage I dont think some of you relize. During the game while his teamates are out in the field he could be in the cage hitting or watching video of an AB he just had and breaking down how the pitcher pitched to him. PLUS the major reason why a DH should never win the MVP is he doesnt play defense. When you dont have to play in the field it greatly diminishes the chance of you getting hurt. If you put Vlad and A-Rod at DH for the same amount of AB's I'll bet they would have better numbers then they have.

 

Don't give me that bull about he doesn't play D!!!!! The MVP is about helping your team win. And nobody helps his team more than Big Papi. Where would the Yanks be without Arod? Probably where they are now! Where would the Sox be? 4th without Ortiz . The guy's so good in the clutch, he should have his own award!!!!!!!!!

 

We'll call it the "Mr. LIH Award"

Late Inning Heroics

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

let's examine what the term mvp means...... most valuble player. it says nothing about playing defense. is there anyone in mlb that would hurt a team more to be without than ortiz.

 

Guess what. Believe it or not the rules say that DH is a position so why shouldn't a DH be able to win MVP. A position is a position.

Are you telling me defense isnt valuable? The bottomline is Ortiz has a major advantage and he still doesnt have better numbers then A-Rod. You said that the rules say that DH is a position which is true but its simply an advantage. Plus your brought up the "MVP = Most valuable player" point. Well as long as Andre Dawson, Don Mattingly and A-Rod won the MVP with teams that didnt make the playoffs then I will interpet the "MVP" award as an award for the best player in each league.