Ortiz a Shoo-In for MVP

[YANKEESRULE]

Well they are tied for homeruns, A-Rod has a better OPS, the only advantage Ortiz has is RBI's. Plus A-Rod plays the field. I can see the argument for both sides, but they have both been clutch this year. Look at last night 2-run shot makes the Yanks lead by two and they never looked back. 1st game against the Sox in the 4 game set at Fenway against Schilling, boom Yanks go up by two and never look back. A-Rod has been consistent all year even when the Yanks were struggling and his defense was sub-par and he fixed that. He's only made 11 errors all year(he made 13 last year). Ortiz won't get it because of two things-1) he doesn't play defense 2) Manny will take some votes away from him. Let's face it if Manny wasn't playing for the Sox, Ortiz wouldn't be as good as he is. He sees good pitches to hit because you don't want him to get on base for Manny, who in my opinion is a much better offensive weapon for the Sox.

[fuckery]

Take that ARod nonsense elsewhere.

 

It's Ortizzzzzzle Bizzzzzle.

 

hands down.

[ARod2212]

he's just scared Arod wont get it, aww

Refute this post, or shut up.

http://www.talksox.com/forum/showpost.php?p=78006&postcount=267

 

Somebody, prove me wrong.

[riverside sluggers]

ooh im scared now, dude its just a useless post of yours, i got bored halfway through it. only thing that interested me was what the comments you posted from other Sox members. every post you have done in this thread has been "but um he he does defense, so Ortiz should never get a MVP award :sleep: " no matter how much you kick and scream about it we will not in your favor "shut up"

[ARod2212]

ooh im scared now, dude its just a useless post of yours, i got bored halfway through it. only thing that interested me was what the comments you posted from other Sox members. every post you have done in this thread has been "but um he he does defense, so Ortiz should never get a MVP award :sleep: " no matter how much you kick and scream about it we will not in your favor "shut up"

So what I get from this post is that you are ignorant and have the attention span of a flea. Way to go -30 respect points.

 

Anybody else want to go against what I said?

[Optimist]

Edit: Actually, never mind.

 

You know what would not surprise me? If someone from the Guardians won it, I mean if they stay on top of the wild card and with all that they've done this season.

[redsoxrules]

arod's defense aint that great BTW

Rodriguez isn't having a good season at third — he's second worst among AL regulars in range factor, which is putouts and assists divided by innings, and zone rating, which is the percentage of balls fielded in his typical defensive zone, according to STATS, Inc

wich is the reason he only has 11 errors! he would have way more otherwise

[greenplywoodstadium]

Alright keep dreaming. An MVP should know how to play the field.

[greenplywoodstadium]

So what I get from this post is that you are ignorant and have the attention span of a flea. Way to go -30 respect points.

 

Anybody else want to go against what I said?

 

I'll go with what you said.

[CrespoBlows]

I'll go with what you said.

 

A-Rod, I think this severely crippled your arguement right here.

[Optimist]

A-Rod, I think this severely crippled your arguement right here.

 

[HOFer51]

arod's defense aint that great BTW

Rodriguez isn't having a good season at third — he's second worst among AL regulars in range factor, which is putouts and assists divided by innings, and zone rating, which is the percentage of balls fielded in his typical defensive zone, according to STATS, Inc

wich is the reason he only has 11 errors! he would have way more otherwise

His game-saving play just spoke volumes about this amazingly biased post.

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

His game-saving play just spoke volumes about this amazingly biased post.

lmao yeah. That was a classic example of a "clutch" defensive play. Something Ortiz cant do.

[HOFer51]

lmao yeah. That was a classic example of a "clutch" defensive play. Something Ortiz cant do.

WTF?! Dont you remember Ortiz's clutch play last year with the bases loaded? You know, the one where he pulled a Buckner and allowed two runs to score?

[Optimist]

And there's why non-DH players have the upper hand in the MVP race...

 

A Rod didn't have a great offensive day, but his defense made up for it.

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

WTF?! Dont you remember Ortiz's clutch play last year with the bases loaded? You know, the one where he pulled a Buckner and allowed two runs to score?

lmao

[BronxBomber61]

And there's why non-DH players have the upper hand in the MVP race...

 

A Rod didn't have a great offensive day, but his defense made up for it.

 

Great post, I came here to say that but you beat me to it!

[CrespoBlows]

Great post, I came here to say that but you beat me to it!

 

Sorry to interupt your orgy, but two points:

 

1. You can't base a players defense, on one play. You seem to forget that A-Rod's FRAA (Fielding Runs Against Average) is -7. Compare that with:

 

Bill Mueller: 4

Corey Koskie: 5

Alex Gonzalez: -7

Melvin Mora: -4

 

He is tied for the worst defensive 3rd basemen in the AL East. You got to give Gonzalez credit, since this is his 1st year at 3rd, A-Rod has two under his belt.

 

2. As for Ortiz' clutch defense, I recall a play in Game 3 of the World Series. That perfect throw to nail Suppan.

[HOFer51]

Sorry to interupt your orgy, but two points:

 

1. You can't base a players defense, on one play. You seem to forget that A-Rod's FRAA (Fielding Runs Against Average) is -7. Compare that with:

 

Bill Mueller: 4

Corey Koskie: 5

Alex Gonzalez: -7

Melvin Mora: -4

 

He is tied for the worst defensive 3rd basemen in the AL East. You got to give Gonzalez credit, since this is his 1st year at 3rd, A-Rod has two under his belt.

 

2. As for Ortiz' clutch defense, I recall a play in Game 3 of the World Series. That perfect throw to nail Suppan.

 

1. His defensive slump in May is not representative of the season. If you can give me his FRAA over the past three months, I'd like that.

 

2. If you can name something from this year that would be greatly appreciated as well.

[CrespoBlows]

1. His defensive slump in May is not representative of the season. If you can give me his FRAA over the past three months, I'd like that.

 

2. If you can name something from this year that would be greatly appreciated as well.

 

You contridicted yourself. You stated you wanted A-Rod's stats from the past, but you threw out a clutch play by Ortiz. I'm kinda befuddled. Everyone knows Ortiz sucks at defense only a moron would object to that.

 

Anyway, A-Rod had a +5 FRAA at 3rd, last year, and 1 FRAA, at SS two years ago.

 

Ortiz, has a +1 FRAA this year at 1st base, meaning he hasn't been great, but he hasn't sucked ass.

[yankeessuck013]

1. His defensive slump in May is not representative of the season. If you can give me his FRAA over the past three months, I'd like that.

 

2. If you can name something from this year that would be greatly appreciated as well.

 

if you watched any of the sox games during interleague ortiz picked numerous balls out of the dirt to save runs.

[RedRuffing15]

OK, I'm just posting to give everyone stats that I just looked up

 

I'm not trying to repeat anyones post or prove anyone wrong or anything, so don't take it badly

 

since 1972, when the DH started, theres only been 2 guys to win the AL MVP with playing over 40 games at DH, Jime Rice and Don Baylor. Rice had 46 HRs, 139 RBIs and batted .315 in 1978 and played 49 games at DH. Baylor had 39 HRs, 139RBIs and batted .296 in 1979 and was DH 65 times.

 

I doubt Ortiz's numbers will be like Rice's, but Baylor possibly, and I also don't know how many games he played at DH, but I'm just letting everyone know this.

 

 

I don't know if anyone asked this, but I wanna know what everyone thinks. What if, A-Rod and Ortiz end the season with the exact same number of HRs, RBIs, and same batting avg., who do you think will win?

[HOFer51]

You contridicted yourself. You stated you wanted A-Rod's stats from the past, but you threw out a clutch play by Ortiz. I'm kinda befuddled. Everyone knows Ortiz sucks at defense only a moron would object to that.

 

Anyway, A-Rod had a +5 FRAA at 3rd, last year, and 1 FRAA, at SS two years ago.

 

Ortiz, has a +1 FRAA this year at 1st base, meaning he hasn't been great, but he hasn't sucked ass.

he hasnt played enough first base to make a valid judgement of that.

[HOFer51]

if you watched any of the sox games during interleague ortiz picked numerous balls out of the dirt to save runs.

Giambi can pick balls out of the dirt. Does that make him a great defensive first basemen?

[yankeessuck013]

Giambi can pick balls out of the dirt. Does that make him a great defensive first basemen?

 

gee-i'm- big plays first base day in and day out

 

and fyi giambi is one of the worst first basemen

[HOFer51]

gee-i'm- big plays first base day in and day out

 

and fyi giambi is one of the worst first basemen

where did I say he was even close to good?

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

OK, I'm just posting to give everyone stats that I just looked up

 

I'm not trying to repeat anyones post or prove anyone wrong or anything, so don't take it badly

 

since 1972, when the DH started, theres only been 2 guys to win the AL MVP with playing over 40 games at DH, Jime Rice and Don Baylor. Rice had 46 HRs, 139 RBIs and batted .315 in 1978 and played 49 games at DH. Baylor had 39 HRs, 139RBIs and batted .296 in 1979 and was DH 65 times.

 

I doubt Ortiz's numbers will be like Rice's, but Baylor possibly, and I also don't know how many games he played at DH, but I'm just letting everyone know this.

 

 

I don't know if anyone asked this, but I wanna know what everyone thinks. What if, A-Rod and Ortiz end the season with the exact same number of HRs, RBIs, and same batting avg., who do you think will win?

I think it has alot to do with which team makes the playoffs. If they both get in I think A-Rod will win it. It may very well come down to who has the bigger weekend when the Yankees play the Red Sox at Fenway.

[ORS]

I doubt Ortiz's numbers will be like Rice's, but Baylor possibly...

Ortiz: .298/43/131

 

Rice's numbers, minus about .015 BA, are the better estimate.

[RedRuffing15]

I gotta tell you, I forgot Ortiz's numbers were like that, He'll get his homers, but I don't think he'll get to Rices avg., and might tie or beat out his RBIs by 1

[AlexanderTheGreat13]

Intresting article on the AL MVP race:

 

http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/article/how-not-to-use-statistics-why-david-ortiz-shouldnt-be-mvp

 

the article was too long for me to post.