Hugh2

Actually no, what you're saying is like saying that. To come in here and say Chris Sale would have started every game that the Sox scored 5 or more runs is the same thing. I'm literally not saying that, I'm saying we don't know.

No one is arguing over that. I'm just not judging the trade at the moment, If Grissom came into the season healthy, had a normal spring training and had a .850+ ops right now and was playing a good second base as many predicted he could no one would be complaining. Results matter, and if Grissom doesn't ever put it together I'll call it a horrible trade, but I certainly won't know and given how this season is going I would have placed my bets on the prospect of improving my defense and offense too.

aren't they also only something like 4-5 million below the top threshold? that's where the really stiff penalties really kick in. That probably had a large influence on their decision.

Just because Sales WAR is 2 doesn't mean he definitively would of added 2 wins. If he started any of those bullpen games they easily could have been the 4 days the Sox scored 0-1 runs. We just don't know. Right now, offense and defense is a much bigger problem. Conversely to your point if you had two options. Option one. Pitch better offense/defense remain the same. Option two. Pitch the same offense/defense better. Which would you choose?

And we saw what happened there. We have him for 4 more years through his age 32 season, I'm comfortable riding those out.

That's not the argument I said, I'm saying right now improved defense and offense would make this team better than having another ACE. The former doesn't mean the latter also isn't true or I wouldn't like it.

No it's doesn't, but improving in the area you're most deficient in is going to go further in making you better, that's pretty simple logic and math too.

Sometimes I think some posters just love to hate whatever move the front office makes. Don't get me wrong, there are some real head scratchers in there, many worth the questions but for right or wrong I'll never judge something in hindsight, nor prematurely.

LOL man ya'll are funny. I'd rather have hitting right now than pitching. How are we doing with RISP again? what is a bigger problem on this team? Sure, Grissom doesn't look like a good pick up at the moment in hindsight but a RH hitting bat was one of our biggest needs in the offseason. We've lost almost 1/4 of all the games we've played by 3 runs or less. Maybe with Chris Sale we'd lose 0-3 instead of 0-7 that one time.

Domimic Smith .189/.232/.245 OPS: .477 That's below below average, and his defense is fringe average at best. 54 of his 56 plate apparences are against RHP, maybe because he's a lifetime .695 OPS vs. LHP. that .477 OPS is against all right handers and that's what he's supposed to be doing...HITTING RIGHT HANDERS!!!!! Kavadas OPS VS RHP 2024: 1.155 2023: .945 2022: 1.146 Kavadas is going to give more than what Smith does. Chipped in with a few hits here and there lol.

That cop was ready, dude came out quick like a DE.

How does anyone know we would be selling high on Duran? And if we are, why would anyone think their personal assesment of his value is superior to the professional scouting department of an entire MLB organization? You don't go trading away young talent, not when you desperately lack that. Now, in a few years when guys like Anthony have broken into the bigs and the outfield gets crowded it might make a lot more sense to trade Duran, or someone else?

Up and down the system and across baseball relief pitchers get TJS all the time, you don't hear about it as much because starting pitchers are more of a known commodity. There's every reason to believe that Whitlock would be just as injury prone in a full time reliever role. He has all the hallmarks of a starting pitcher and was his entire career before his first TJS, in todays age it's almost assumed every pitcher will have TJS at some point so it's pretty senseless to blame the sox for trying to develop him as a starter. With that said, I'm very open to him being moved to a bullpen, who knows.....perhaps he can stay healthier in that role. Everyone is built different.

Moves this team should take in the next week. Option Grissom. I love his potential, but he obviously needs time in the minors. It's very reasonable to assume a lack of spring training has hurt him and his timing is completley off, he's very young and perhaps after a month or two will be ready for the show again. He very well can work these things out at the big league level, but why not burn the option and put the team in a position to win now. DFA: Chase Anderson, he's your low leverage multi inning guy, give the role to Mata who has to be on the big leauge club or will be lost. If all else fails Winckowski is waiting in the wings and a better option than both those guys. DFA: Dominic Smith, call up Kavadas. I don't think Kavadas has a long term future here. He's pretty much a bat first platoon first baseman, and I think he could fit that role much better than Smith is right now. Let him Platoon with Cooper at 1B until Casas is back. Recall Valdez, let him spell Hamilton at 2nd and DH.

The Sox are 12th in runs scored, 2nd in ER allowed and 2nd in ERA. The truth is, up until now, we haven't needed Sale, we've needed hitting. The Sale trade hasn't hurt us. Let's dig deeper. Chris Sale is good, very good when he's healthy, aside from a couple duds he was lights out for us last year......for 20 games. The most he has pitched since 2019, he's up to 9 this year. Chris Sale was gone after this year, and the Sox cashed him in for 6 years of a Vaugh Grissom, 22 at the time, who hit at every level with a lifetime .863 OPS in the minors reaching the bigs at 21. Now, you can't argue with the results, Grissom sucks. Did he just completely turn into a bust the day he was traded to the Sox? or could it be that he's young, pressing, and after being injured and having no spring training his timing is completely off? Given the small sample size I'm perfectly happy throwing my hat in the ring on that later statement. It's very fair to say that as of right now the trade doesn't look great, but there's every reason to still like it long term, and there's plenty of time for Grissom to return more value than Sale will in 2024. He was 5 years of team control left after this year. With that said, it's time to send him down to the minors. He obviously needs more time to get his timing back, work on some adjustments, and do it in an enviroment where he's not hurting the big league club.

Sox have promoted guys without the sexiest stat lines because of how the underlying metrics looked E.G. Roman Anthony. Still, given his time missed, I don't think they will press to rush him in his first full season. I think he will get promoted this year, but I would guess he'd be a later summer promotion rather than an early one.

Is it his swing? or his timing just messed up? Could be one in the same, not having a spring training and timing being off may be making him "press" and trying to switch things up. Sometimes you need to tweak with things, other times you just need to be patient.

Man, I like all those guys, but Crawfords delivery really scares me. He won't be a free agent until his age 33 season, I'm good with riding out his team control years.

and by plenty of options I mean he has one, this is his last option year. Use it.

With that said Grissom should be sent to Worcester. Kid might still have a very bright future, he's the youngest player on this team, was rushed to the majors but has plenty of options. He very well may of had a fine 2024 but he got injured and had no spring training. It's obvious that it effected his timing, Valdez can platoon on 2nd, and hold it down for a month or two until Grissom has his groove back.

Oh yeah, that's the argument right there. Grissom might not every be a long term piece here. But the conversation surrounding him is a perfect example of how some fans, fans like you, can't see the forrest for the trees.

Well we know he’s a horrible runner and not a great defender, I highly doubt that gets better in the majors. He also has a lot of swing and miss, that’s only going to get worse at the big league level He also has serious platoon concerns but hasn’t been terrible against LHP in the minors. But again, that probably gets worse in the bigs. With Casas out I would have been fine with him as a platoon option over Cooper. Apparently they didn’t think so

I’m optimistic that they have started to extend young guys, but it feels like an overpay out of desperation at the same time. I said all offseason and spring training that Rafaela needed more seasoning, mostly in dead ears. People just can’t seem to figure out spring training stats are largely useless. I still really like Rafaela, I think him and Bello will be worth the money, but you sign guys this early you expect to get steep discounts.

Some people are only happy when it rains

Proves more about the fans than the players