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Everything posted by notin
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Carlton and Morris were throwing that hard. The last pitcher to throw 290 IP was Blyleven, who was a soft-tosser with his endless stream of curveballs...
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Not even if you added up two of their pitches. But Jamie Moyer had plenty of success soft-tossing the ball into his late 40's..
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Escalating salaries is certainly a big factor now, but we really didn't see those take off until around 1990. Since that was also around the time the closer became a limited ninth inning specialist, I couldn't tell you if one factor was bigger than the other...
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Not sure how anyone will value him. His K/9 are down and his BB/9 are up, which is probably a bigger factor. His trade value is probably about the same as Workman's, since he has the extra year of control. (Baseballtradevalues.com gives Barnes a surplus trade value of $3.2mill while Workman was worth $2.3mill.)
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Looking at his game log, Barnes has given up 9 ER in 11 games. But 8 of them came in three outings, with 6 of those 8 coming against the Yankees. Not ideal, but I think other teams might value him differently than we do on this board. Especially since the number of sellers is probably going to be small with this expanded playoff format...
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It only takes one team. And Barnes has a good enough track record. I don't think his 11 IP this year have killed his value completely...
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Did you see Greinke throw that 54 mph eephus pitch for a strike the other day? Can't toss the ball much softer than that...
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Look at the top ten for 1969. Juan Marichal threw 299 2/3 IP and came in tenth in IP that year. It is odd that after the shortened 1981 season, no on ever topped 300 again. And after 1985, no one ever topped 290. A lot of that might be because were entering the Closer Era of pitcher management, and the closer often came in long before the ninth. inning. The rise of the Closer Strategy, which then lead to the specialized bullpens of today, basically killed the complete game and appears to have done a hatchet job on pitcher IP. And now we are in full blown Death of Starting Pitching, as Tampa has shown the effectiveness of spreading out the IP with their use of openers. (Kansas City tried this a few years back, too, but was not as successful.)
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He still throws 95 mph. It just takes on pitching coach who thinks he can fix him and is ignorant of the fact that he hasn't been able to fix all the problem pitchers in his s***** bullpen that are creating the need for Barnes in the first place. While that sounds really specific, it's probably a lot more common than we realize...
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1. I was assuming it would be Anderson, but either one could take over 2B, which has been a weak position for the Sox the past few seasons. 2. Anderson was the only one they drafted and that was two years before they dealt Tatis. Luis Robert was an international free agent from Cuba. Moncada, Kopech (for Sale), Jimenez, Cease (for Quintana) and Giolito (for Eaton) were all acquired via trade....
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I can see that. I still think Barnes is the most likely to move, and the Astros, Padres, and Cubs top my guess list of destinations. I am entering full blown prediction mode here...
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1. It was an example, but I can get you a TON more data year by year if you like. Click away. https://www.baseball-reference.com/leaders/IP_top_ten.shtml 2. It was AN INCREDIBLE EXAMPLE. Young didn't throw a meager 200 IP. He threw over THREE HUNDRED IP, and often topped 400 IP. In the extremely likely event you do not click away, it might be worth noting you do not see less than 300 IP leading the league routinely until around 1981...
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Imagine the White Sox had they not traded Tatis. Put him in the infield with Moncada and Anderson with Jimenez and Robert in the OF (and only Anderson above 25 years old). And Giolito, Cease and Kopech on the mound. Ah but I'm sure they think James Shields was worth it...
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The main reason to keep him around is if you don't think you can get a pitcher "like Perez" for one year $6.25 million. Personally, any deal of Perez is nothing more than conditional upon the offer from the other team. He's not on a Price contract, so no need to give him away, either...
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The only active pitcher with 3,000 IP (less than half of Young's career total) is Bartolo Colon, who is only technically active. Verlander is 12 IP away and Greinke is 93 IP away. Both are likely to eclipse that total next season. Many historians believe Young did throw in excess of 100mph, but I don't think this has ever been validated. Clearly he was a bit of a freak, however, as he did probably throw a lot harder than many of his counterparts. Of course, velocity might not have been as important to their success, as they were legally allowed to throw spitballs..
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Cy Young, for example, threw at least 300 IP for 17 consecutive years. The streak broke for him at age 40, when he was limited to 299 IP...
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A deeper talent pool...
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Oh I doubt they have a full blown firesale. No one does that mid-season. There's just not enough time..
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I doubt they can pull off that many trades. Barnes is the most likely, since anyone hoping to contend can use bullpen help. After that, maybe one of the other 3 gets moved...
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Why? Small sample size, but far from impressive. Nice batting average, but it’s supported by a .364 BABIP. No power (.051 ISO), and questionable plate disciple (6K/BB). His OBP and SLG are both basically carried by his BA, hence the sub-.700 OPS. He’s basically a bucketful of singles. Defensively he’s only got 57 innings in the field at 2b, so his UZR (-19) is probably not representative. He has options. As he’s very young, he probably needs time in Pawtucket, which he can get once his Rule 5 status clears...
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Arauz is not the solution...
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Workman has some value, but the problem this years is GMs might be hesitant with rental players knowing there’s always the chance the postseason is just cancelled. Look how badly the Mookie trade almost worked out for the Dodgers. In April and May, there was no season in sight, and they had no extension in place. Imagine if that situation continued. Pivetta is a gamble. But he was always a guy whose stuff was just flat out good. He might not pan out, but I don’t think he’s any bigger of a gamble than any minor leaguer that could have been acquired for Workman. Maybe Seabold will be the better pitcher, but no one knows whether or not that will happen. Remember Edwin Escobar? He was acquired with Hembree in the Peavy trade. And Escobar was supposedly the better prospect, even getting ranked by BA. Clearly he was the headliner and Hembree the throw-in. Escobar also pitched all of 2 innings for the Sox and 25 for his career. Not nearly as capable as the throw-in from that trade...
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It’s been going on for your entire life. As 5GG said, 200 IP is an accomplishment nowadays. Going back even further than he did, there used to be no such thing as a pitching rotation. You pitched when you felt good. And if you weren’t starting, you went to the bullpen. Christy Mathewson and Joe McGinnity used combine to to give the Giants 100 appearances and 80-90 starts year in and year out. Nowadays, not only do we have dedicated relief pitchers, they have clearly defined roles. Some of them insanely specialized, like facing tough left-handed hitters, and no one else. (Until recent stupid rules were implemented.)
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Being “too left handed” with David Price isn’t the same as being too left handed with Martin Perez...
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The most confusing team is the Phillies. They went out and got bullpen help, but they have the second worst record in the NL. They might consider selling over buying..
