moonslav59

It could be near double the money but over more years- something like $320M/10 or even 11 or 12 to bring the AAV down.

Well, we were discouraged when reports said we low-balled him, too.

We very well might have been a little better had DD been the GM under the same circumstances, but I honestly think he'd have quit under those conditions. I doubt our farm would be ranked so highly, and yes, I know that is just speculative value. For argument's sake, would you have wanted us to trade Casas and Bello and finish in 2nd place with one playoff round win in 2022?

The edit button does not work for me, many times. I meant WS (World Series) not WAS.

I never said Bloom has been a success. We aren't even sure, yet, if the apparent farm build-up will amount to what we hope it will. IMO, the top priority Bloom was handed was to build up the farm. It's fine to disagree. Another top priority, after 2020, was to try and be competitive while rebuilding, and Bloom is 1 for 2 on that front. I don't think JH or anyone in the organization felt like a WS was the expectation in 2021 or 2022. It might be yours and many other fans, but I honestly don't think they expected it. They certainly did not expect a last place finish either, especially after the promise the 2021 team showed. As you pointed out, injuries were a big key to that letdown. I also think declines by too many returning vets was a big reason, too, and I don't think either of them can be blamed fully on Bloom. The deadwood on the budget, either. We like to point to JBJ and Paxton and a few other failed moves, but overall, IMO, Bloom has made more good moves than bad. When I look at the 26 and 40 man rosters of 2020, as well as the farm, back then, I see major progress, whether it showed up in wins or not. It's not excuse making. It's reality. Bloom was not handed a big enough budget to do what you wanted done. He was not told he could trade away many top prospects for instant gratification. Yoiu might wish he had been told that, or maybe you think JH is telling him he can, but he is choosing not to. We both have wildly differing views on what can reasonably been expected to happen given the farm status (only Houck has been added between Devers and Bello/Casas) and the massive budget cuts he had up to the Story signing. That's the reality. It's not a bubble. Had DD been handed Bloom's budget and told not to trade top prospects, you really think we'd be in the WAS, right now? If yes, explain how.

My comment was that DD has never been hired to build up a farm for the longer term outlook. I neve said "trade everything". I mentioned trading away the farm, but that was more about the Sox, and even with the Sox, I have repeatedly said he did not decimate the farm. I should have worded that better. I never set a timeframe with Detroit, but he did trade away many very good prospects for key players later on in Detroit. The point is: team hire DD when they want to win, soon. They don't hire him to build up a farm, so they can win in 4-7 years. He has the okay to spend big and or trade away several top prospects to win NOW or soon. That was not the situation Bloom was hird into, no matter how hard many posters want to think it was. They seem to think it was Bloom's idea to not spend big or trade away key prospects, so we could have been better in 2020, 2021 and even 2022. Maybe, someday that will change. Maybe, if it does, they will hire someone like DD to change course.

That is encouraging and seems like a fair offer... maybe they can get him to take $200M/8.

It was in BOS in 2015. It was in Philly, this time. The future was not now in BOS after 2019, and that was not Bloom's choice. It might be your choice, but not the organization- like it or not. It might be the choice in 2023.

"Trade everything?"

Give him the old pick-up truck.

He was hired to build up their farm for a longer term outlook? No, he was hired to trade away their farm, if needed to win as soon as possible. C'mon man! He didn't get to the pennant in 3 years by looking to improve the farm.

DD has never been hired to build for the future. You don't think that is significant?

That's certainly part of it, but when I look at the totality of his moves made and the circumstances around his winter spending budget and the philosophy to build for the future (by not trading away top prospects and actually trying to add prospects via trades) as part of the plan he was brought in under, I see a vastly different view than you and many others do.

They could have easily traded Renfroe for no monetary cost in return. We may not have gotten much, but still...

Health, the farm quality and JH's willingness to spend.

I'm not. I'm just pointing our two major disparities between DD and Bloom, and I have often said the Bloom tight budget lasted from day one to mid March 2022.

Those numbers don't reflect the drop in payroll, particular new spending and in 2020, massive cuts in actual spending. That 2019 number also included Castillo & Pablo, but the 2022 number included Sale and half Price.

We already have a much higher payroll compared to most other teams, but I agree. Paying a hefty tax plus all the draft and bonus pool penalties discourage the Sox from spending like LAD.

$206M is "VERY" close? It's basically a Mookie away.

Because the 2019 team was similar on paper to the 2018 team. The problem was injuries, like 2022, and the on paper 2018 team declined by 2019 and even more so by 2022.

LOL. I was just razzin' cause he razzed me on pasting instead of patting myself on the back.

I'm pasting myself on the b ack trying to figure out where the lost place in the division is hiding.

We are talking about the restraints Bloom had in the 3 years with the Sox, and Price's contract was part of that. No longer, is true- same with JD and Nate. The Sale deal is the only one left. DD had his HRams and Pablos, so it's not totally unbalanced, but the budget cut from 2019 to 2020 was massive, and we have yet to come close to that $236M of 2019.

No. I'm pointing out a case where the GM has nothing to do with wins and losses. I said nothing about them being compared to the Sox.

No doubt. There is no argument, if you only look at wins and losses. If you look at the farm he inherited and left and the b udget he had vs Bloom, it's night and day times two. Do you really think DD wins us a ring without trading prospects for Sale, Kimbrel, and others? Bloom could get us more wins by doing that, too, but that's not the plan. That's just half of it. Now, forget about inflation: these are the opening day budgets. DD 184M 197M 234M 236M Bloom 73M (pro-rated for covid) 180M 206M Throw away 2020 and DD's 2019 budget was cut from $236M to $180M. That's $56M. Tell me how DD builds a winner by cutting payroll and notv trading top prospects.