The pursuit of Aaron Judge

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Jackie Bradley has an OPS+ of 76. That's pathetic and he is a pathetic offensive player. He is probably playing stellar defense but he is a fourth outfielder with the bat. The idea of going into next season with J.Bradley as a starting OF would be pretty dumb unless we are talking about CF than OK, but how many years of stellar defense does Bradley have left in him as centerfielder? Maybe none. Trading for J.Bradley and making him the starting RF (platooning him with a loser in Arroyo) and perhaps getting nothing for Hunter Renfroe (Binelas might not amount to much) is one of the reasons why Red Sox fans are worried about Bloom's ability to make sound baseball decisions.

 

The mighty Red Sox, with their big payroll, have a RF platoon combination of J.Bradley and Arroyo. The Red Sox couldn't do better than that? Bloom couldn't do better than that? The situation in RF was doomed from the start and it amazes that Bloom couldn't get that figured out. In the meantime, Renfroe is having a pretty solid season for the Brew Crew.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Fan_since_Boggs

[Bellhorn04]

Jackie Bradley has an OPS+ of 76. That's pathetic and he is a pathetic offensive player. He is probably playing stellar defense but he is a fourth outfielder with the bat. The idea of going into next season with J.Bradley as a starting OF would be pretty dumb unless we are talking about CF than OK, but how many years of stellar defense does Bradley have left in him as centerfielder? Maybe none. Trading for J.Bradley and making him the starting RF (platooning him with a loser in Arroyo) and perhaps getting nothing for Hunter Renfroe (Binelas might not amount to much) is one of the reasons why Red Sox fans are worried about Bloom's ability to make sound baseball decisions.

 

This post is mostly nonsense.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

I do find it hard to imagine us not signing Betts, then going LNL on Judge.

 

True. In signing Judge, the Red Sox would be admitting that the Betts decision was a mistake. But maybe the organization should own up to the mistake and attempt to rectify it by signing one of the best players in baseball who also happens to play for the Red Sox's biggest rivals. Sign Judge and the Red Sox weaken the Yankees--an extra benefit.

Edited June 7, 2022 by Fan_since_Boggs

[moonslav59]

True. In signing Judge, the Red Sox would be admitting that the Betts decision was a mistake. But maybe the organization should own up to the mistake and attempt to rectify it by signing one of the best players in baseball who also happens to play for the Red Sox's biggest rivals. Sign Judge and the Red Sox weaken the Yankees--an extra benefit.

 

We broke our own imposed rule on signing older than 30 SP'ers when we got Price. We may see the value in stealing Judge from the Yanks.

 

I doubt it happens. I think we have set 5-6 years as the upper limit on length. Maybe they go 7-8 on Devers, because of his age, but I wonder...

[moonslav59]

This post is mostly nonsense.

 

Even if you count the JBJ trade as a total bust, the totality of Bloom's moves have been a clear plus, and while he built up the 40 man roster, he also improved the farm and got us 2 wins from the WS.

 

Of course, he's made mistakes, but the ones people mention the most have not been completed, yet.

 

JBJ & Binelas/Hamilton might out perform the one year renfroe had left.

 

Cordero & Winckowski might our perform Beni, who is now on his last year.

 

Verdugo has already at least equaled the 60 games Betts played in 2020.

 

If I wanted to bash Bloom, I'd stick to Richards, Perez I, Perez II and Diekman/Andriese/Sawamura...

[Fan_since_Boggs]

I doubt it happens.

 

I don't think it is going to happen either. But I do think some team will make Judge a massive offer (maybe the Giants as has been speculated) and then the Yankees will need to figure out if they should match the offer or let Judge leave town. It'll be interesting to see how the Yankees proceed.

 

Judge is not only great in terms of performance, but he is a GM and owner's wet dream. He is a leader, the face of a franchise, no one is concerned about Judge putting in less work after he gets paid. The intangibles matter too and the intangibles work in Judge's favor.

 

The point that Judge is from California is a good one. I never realized that. The fact that he is from the west coast will probably make his decision to leave the Yankees a much easier one.

[moonslav59]

I don't think it is going to happen either. But I do think some team will make Judge a massive offer (maybe the Giants as has been speculated) and then the Yankees will need to figure out if they should match the offer or let Judge leave town. It'll be interesting to see how the Yankees proceed.

 

Judge is not only great in terms of performance, but he is a GM and owner's wet dream. He is a leader, the face of a franchise, no one is concerned about Judge putting in less work after he gets paid. The intangibles matter too and the intangibles work in Judge's favor.

 

The point that Judge is from California is a good one. I never realized that. The fact that he is from the west coast will probably make his decision to leave the Yankees a much easier one.

 

Going to the NL would be nice. You know the Yanks will spend to replace him, most likely by upgrading 2-3 positions with the money "saved."

[jacksonianmarch]

Yanks won’t let him go is my opinion. They did let Cano go, but he was never the legend Judge is. Also, Judge does have a good grasp on history, and being a legendary Yankee comes with its perks after he retires. My bet is he checks out the market and the Yanks bring him back.

[moonslav59]

Yanks won’t let him go is my opinion. They did let Cano go, but he was never the legend Judge is. Also, Judge does have a good grasp on history, and being a legendary Yankee comes with its perks after he retires. My bet is he checks out the market and the Yanks bring him back.

 

I'd say the odds are close to 60% he stays a Yankee.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

It'll be Steinbrenner's decision (not Cashman's). They probably bring him back but they will have to pay him top price or very comparable to the top offer. The one thing we have learned is that these players rarely take a discount. I also recently learned that Judge grew up not far from the Bay area and was a huge San Francisco Giants fan as a kid.

 

The Yankees have a history of keeping their guys. In that respect, they are very different from the Red Sox who lost: Lynn, Fisk, Boggs, Clemons, Vaughn, Betts, and probably Bogaerts. The Yankees usually keep their homegrown stars like B.Williams, Jeter, Rivera, Mattingly. Maybe I'm forgetting some contrary examples--this is just off the top of my head.

 

As far as Cano goes, I wouldn't be surprised if Cashman knew that Cano was a steroids guy and that mitigated the Yankees interest in matching a top offer. In contrast, Judge doesn't have any skeletons in his closet and so the Yankees will probably resign him.

 

Cano is such a disgraced player, a guy who may have been on a HOF track due to his production at 2b But now he will get so few votes in his first year of eligibility that he will be off the ballot after his first year.

Edited June 8, 2022 by Fan_since_Boggs

[dgalehouse]

Cano is not in the Hall of Fame conversation. Not even a little bit.

[Fan_since_Boggs]

If he wasn't a steroids guy and his stats were legitimate, he would be in the HOF conversation. After all, he is approaching 3,000 hits. If he didn't lose time due to PED suspension, that is if his stats were legitimate, he would be very close to 3,000 hits.

 

But as things currently stand, Cano has 0% chance to the make the HOF.

[notin]

It'll be Steinbrenner's decision (not Cashman's). They probably bring him back but they will have to pay him top price or very comparable to the top offer. The one thing we have learned is that these players rarely take a discount. I also recently learned that Judge grew up not far from the Bay area and was a huge San Francisco Giants fan as a kid.

 

The Yankees have a history of keeping their guys. In that respect, they are very different from the Red Sox who lost: Lynn, Fisk, Boggs, Clemons, Vaughn, Betts, and probably Bogaerts. The Yankees usually keep their homegrown stars like B.Williams, Jeter, Rivera, Mattingly. Maybe I'm forgetting some contrary examples--this is just off the top of my head.

 

As far as Cano goes, I wouldn't be surprised if Cashman knew that Cano was a steroids guy and that mitigated the Yankees interest in matching a top offer. In contrast, Judge doesn't have any skeletons in his closet and so the Yankees will probably resign him.

 

Cano is such a disgraced player, a guy who may have been on a HOF track due to his production at 2b But now he will get so few votes in his first year of eligibility that he will be off the ballot after his first year.

 

They lost Pettitte.

 

If they “knew” about Cano, are you saying they condoned cheating?

[Fan_since_Boggs]

Yankees with at least 24 HR in the team's first 59 games: Aaron Judge (2022), Mickey Mantle (1956), Babe Ruth (1921, '28, '30)

 

There is no way Judge comes in under 300 m.

 

They lost Pettitte

I'm trying to remember the circumstances behind Pettitte leaving, it may have been due to his desire to pitch in his home state. But then he returned to the Yankees a few years later. That 2009 championship is so tainted with PED guys Cano, A-Rod, and Pettitte playing a major role and god knows who else on that team was juicing.

[JDavis76]

Yankees with at least 24 HR in the team's first 59 games: Aaron Judge (2022), Mickey Mantle (1956), Babe Ruth (1921, '28, '30)

 

There is no way Judge comes in under 300 m.

 

 

I'm trying to remember the circumstances behind Pettitte leaving, it may have been due to his desire to pitch in his home state. But then he returned to the Yankees a few years later. That 2009 championship is so tainted with PED guys Cano, A-Rod, and Pettitte playing a major role and god knows who else on that team was juicing.

 

Kinda like the sox title teams led by papi, manny & company.......

[moonslav59]

Kinda like the sox title teams led by papi, manny & company.......

 

Not really, and who is the "company?"

 

Fan since Boggs didn't even mention Clemens & Co.

[Bellhorn04]

Kinda like the sox title teams led by papi, manny & company.......

 

Had to fight fire with fire.

[JDavis76]

Not really, and who is the "company?"

 

Fan since Boggs didn't even mention Clemens & Co.

 

Right, the whole league was juicing except for the sox. Got it, thanks for playing.

[moonslav59]

Right, the whole league was juicing except for the sox. Got it, thanks for playing.

 

Never said that, but explain your "company" statement. Name names.

 

Papi's rumored "positive" test was never proven, and the substance was unknown.

 

Manny was caught in LA, not BOS.

 

Is it highly probable some Sox cheated? Of course, but to equate the two teams with this "whole league was juicing" crap is unjustified. You guys had 4-5 proven examples. It's hardly close to equal.

[JDavis76]

Never said that, but explain your "company" statement. Name names.

 

Papi's rumored "positive" test was never proven, and the substance was unknown.

 

Manny was caught in LA, not BOS.

 

Is it highly probable some Sox cheated? Of course, but to equate the two teams with this "whole league was juicing" crap is unjustified. You guys had 4-5 proven examples. It's hardly close to equal.

 

Yeah, papi was going to get to the bottom of it just like OJ was going to find out who murdered Nicole and Ron. And manny only started juicing after he left the sox and I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn. Even merloni admitted that the team had meetings about how to take steroids safely. I'm sure they did that because nobody was juicing....

[Bellhorn04]

Even merloni admitted that the team had meetings about how to take steroids safely. I'm sure they did that because nobody was juicing....

 

Ha ha, what horseshit. Go read that story again and get back to us.

[bkzwhitestrican]

He essentially attributes the Yankees 2009 WS to 3 guys who were caught juicing at various parts of their career. But as soon as a similar comment is made about Manny/Papi and the Sox then it's a false equivalence. What's the saying, something about throwing stones and glass houses..

[JDavis76]

Ha ha, what horseshit. Go read that story again and get back to us.

 

Direct quote from merloni - "And I walk into that office, and this happened while I was with the Boston Red Sox before this last regime, I'm sitting in the meeting. There's a doctor up there and he's talking about steroids, and everyone was like 'Here we go, we're gonna sit here and get the whole thing—they're bad for you.' No. He spins it and says 'You know what, if you take steroids and sit on the couch all winter long, you can actually get stronger than someone who works out clean, if you're going to take steroids, one cycle won't hurt you, abusing steroids it will.'”

 

WEEI-AM’s “Big Show” co-host continued, “He sat there for one hour and told us how to properly use steroids while I'm with the Boston Red Sox, sitting there with the rest of the organization, and after this I said 'What the heck was that?' And everybody on the team was like 'What was that?' And the response we got was 'Well, we know guys are taking it, so we want to make sure they're taking it the right way'... Where did that come from? That didn't come from the Players Association."

[JDavis76]

He essentially attributes the Yankees 2009 WS to 3 guys who were caught juicing at various parts of their career. But as soon as a similar comment is made about Manny/Papi and the Sox then it's a false equivalence. What's the saying, something about throwing stones and glass houses..

 

Exactly.......

[Bellhorn04]

Direct quote from merloni - "And I walk into that office, and this happened while I was with the Boston Red Sox before this last regime, I'm sitting in the meeting. There's a doctor up there and he's talking about steroids, and everyone was like 'Here we go, we're gonna sit here and get the whole thing—they're bad for you.' No. He spins it and says 'You know what, if you take steroids and sit on the couch all winter long, you can actually get stronger than someone who works out clean, if you're going to take steroids, one cycle won't hurt you, abusing steroids it will.'”

 

WEEI-AM’s “Big Show” co-host continued, “He sat there for one hour and told us how to properly use steroids while I'm with the Boston Red Sox, sitting there with the rest of the organization, and after this I said 'What the heck was that?' And everybody on the team was like 'What was that?' And the response we got was 'Well, we know guys are taking it, so we want to make sure they're taking it the right way'... Where did that come from? That didn't come from the Players Association."

 

The whole point is that the team WASN'T EXPECTING the doctor to tell them how to take steroids properly. They were expecting a lecture on the dangers of taking them.

[jacksonianmarch]

The Sox brought in a doc to tell their team how to take steroids. How do you spin that?

[JDavis76]

The Sox brought in a doc to tell their team how to take steroids. How do you spin that?

 

That's a bingo!!

[moonslav59]

Yeah, papi was going to get to the bottom of it just like OJ was going to find out who murdered Nicole and Ron. And manny only started juicing after he left the sox and I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn. Even merloni admitted that the team had meetings about how to take steroids safely. I'm sure they did that because nobody was juicing....

 

You are assuming things I never even hinted as being true. Nice try.

 

Are you and Red identical twins?

[JDavis76]

You are assuming things I never even hinted as being true. Nice try.

 

Are you and Red identical twins?

 

I'm not assuming anything, but you certainly are.....

[moonslav59]

The Sox brought in a doc to tell their team how to take steroids. How do you spin that?

 

No need to spin. It is not proof any or more Sox players juiced than Yankee players.

 

You guys got caught, and it was way more than 3 players.

 

Funny how Yankee fans blast the Astros for cheating, when "everyone was doing it, including the evidence that shows the Yanks (and Sox) were, too, but on steroids, you flip the narrative with no thoughts of being hypocritical.

 

Sure, it's pretty certain some Sox were cheating, but you guys had your water fountain spiked with roids, It's apples and oranges.