Red Sox 2012/2013 Offseason Thread

[mvp 78]

Reading Fred:

Morse is only 31!

Gomez is almost 29!

 

Morse barely got any playing time until he was in his late 20's... kinda like Gomez.

[mvp 78]

Through age 27, Morse had exactly 4 more homeruns than Gomez.

 

Just don't see the fascination here for Morse and the disdain for Gomez. The grass isn't always greener...

[SoxSport]

Cherington, in his WEEI interview, sounded pretty upbeat about Gomez. They see him as a viable alternative at 1B, though he still has a lot to prove about hitting at the ML level--especially in the power department.

 

1B is a power position, not a defensive position. It is the opposite of the SS position--a defensive position. It's essential the Red Sox have a power hitter at 1B--especially since their OF does not contain anybody named Hamilton. That's what they are banking on with Napoli. Morse would do, too, but Rizzo is going to want maybe more than they'll give for a one year rental.On the other hand, that might be offset by the draft pick they would eventually get. They can't wait forever for Napoli because their options outside of Gomez are narrowing all the time. Smoak isn't an option--he has never hit for power in the minors or in Seattle, except that weird last September. Garrett Jones is there, but he would work in a platoon with a rhd bat, and Pitt may want too much for him in the way of prospects. Mourneau the same.

[a700hitter]

Cherington, in his WEEI interview, sounded pretty upbeat about Gomez. They see him as a viable alternative at 1B, though he still has a lot to prove about hitting at the ML level--especially in the power department.

 

1B is a power position, not a defensive position. It is the opposite of the SS position--a defensive position. It's essential the Red Sox have a power hitter at 1B--especially since their OF does not contain anybody named Hamilton. That's what they are banking on with Napoli. Morse would do, too, but Rizzo is going to want maybe more than they'll give for a one year rental.On the other hand, that might be offset by the draft pick they would eventually get. They can't wait forever for Napoli because their options outside of Gomez are narrowing all the time. Smoak isn't an option--he has never hit for power in the minors or in Seattle, except that weird last September. Garrett Jones is there, but he would work in a platoon with a rhd bat, and Pitt may want too much for him in the way of prospects. Mourneau the same.

I like the Garrett Jones possibility. He can play first or the OF-- flexibility is good He has very good splits against righties, and it would give them the opportunity to see if Gomez can play at the ML level. If Gomez flops, Jones plays full time.

[SoxSport]

I like the Garrett Jones possibility. He can play first or the OF-- flexibility is good He has very good splits against righties, and it would give them the opportunity to see if Gomez can play at the ML level. If Gomez flops, Jones plays full time.

 

I wonder if they haven't talked to Pitt already about Jones--during the Hanrahan talks. Pitt has one or two other younger guys they want to play at 1B, so he's available. They probably know what it will take to get Jones.

[Meh]

He has Seattle ans Cleveland(two s*** landing spots) and I believe the Yanks and Sox(for $ leverage, not because he won't play there). NTC are used for more things then just keeping you out of a city you don't want to play in these days.

 

And somehow if Salty plays 1B, I still see him some how effecting the teams ERA

 

Guardians, Cubs, Red Sox, and M's are his NT teams.

 

What about a three team deal?

Ellsbury to the M's.

Upton to the Red Sox

Barnes, Owens, Furbush and Franklin to the DBacks?

 

sox make his 2016 contract year a player option year to make him accept the deal.

[a700hitter]

Guardians, Cubs, Red Sox, and M's are his NT teams.

 

What about a three team deal?

Ellsbury to the M's.

Upton to the Red Sox

Barnes, Owens, Furbush and Franklin to the DBacks?

 

sox make his 2016 contract year a player option year to make him accept the deal.

We need pitching. I don't see the sense of swapping Ellsbury and prospects for a dog like Upton.

[Lucienbel]

I like the Garrett Jones possibility. He can play first or the OF-- flexibility is good He has very good splits against righties, and it would give them the opportunity to see if Gomez can play at the ML level. If Gomez flops, Jones plays full time.

 

I like Garrett Jones as well....I was sort of hoping that he would be involved in the talks during the Hanrahan deal. The first base/outfield thing allows them to take a lot of different approaches in interleague play as well as just in general.

[seabeachfred]

Reading Fred:

Morse is only 31!

Gomez is almost 29!

 

Morse barely got any playing time until he was in his late 20's... kinda like Gomez.

 

Are you sitting there and actually saying that you would take Gomez over Morse? Unless your out of your damn mind you simply cannot say that with a straight face or funtioning brain. Morse is a power hitter, Gomez is not. Morse has already proven himself as a capable power threat, Gomez has not. Morse can play both outfield and first, Gomez can only play first and is a butcher at third.

 

Also MVP while you once again are taking the party line and trying to act at Cherington's cheer leader, we need at least one more power hitter in our lineup if for no other reason than to give cover to Ortiz unless we want to see him get one good pitch a game. There isn't that much power in the outfield unless you want to bet that Ellsbury will stay in one piece for a while year. The infield has average power with Middlebrooks and Pedroia and so so with Drew. Catching? Satalamacchia might not even be with us in the Spring, that is, if your boy Cherington has a semblance of a brain and understands that having him behind the plate means a much higher ERA by our pitchers. Therefore, who knows how much power we will get behind there. You see, unlike you, I do not have much faith in Cheringtons knowledge of the game or the sound reason for giving the job to Lavarnway.

 

Well once more, we can agree to disagree.

[seabeachfred]

Cherington, in his WEEI interview, sounded pretty upbeat about Gomez. They see him as a viable alternative at 1B, though he still has a lot to prove about hitting at the ML level--especially in the power department.

 

1B is a power position, not a defensive position. It is the opposite of the SS position--a defensive position. It's essential the Red Sox have a power hitter at 1B--especially since their OF does not contain anybody named Hamilton. That's what they are banking on with Napoli. Morse would do, too, but Rizzo is going to want maybe more than they'll give for a one year rental.On the other hand, that might be offset by the draft pick they would eventually get. They can't wait forever for Napoli because their options outside of Gomez are narrowing all the time. Smoak isn't an option--he has never hit for power in the minors or in Seattle, except that weird last September. Garrett Jones is there, but he would work in a platoon with a rhd bat, and Pitt may want too much for him in the way of prospects. Mourneau the same.

 

You might be wasting your breath Sox Sport. Some of the front office boosters cannot see the ramifications of being so power short that Ortiz is going to need protection this season. He would get that in Morse; he most certainly would not get that with Gomez.

[a700hitter]

Pitchers and catchers report in less than a month. It starting to look like we are done with moves except for a first base move with Napoli. It's funny that Napoli was the first major deal the Red Sox announced this off season. I believe the Gomes deal was announced prior, but that was not a major deal. It's unbelievable that the first major move has still not been finalized and might not be finalized. If the Napoli deal doesn't get done that means that the FO addressed the needs of a 93 loss last place team (the worst Red Sox showing since 1965) by acquiring:

 

Victorino

Gomes

Dempster

Drew

Uehara

Hanrahan

Ross

[BSN07]

Guardians, Cubs, Red Sox, and M's are his NT teams.

 

What about a three team deal?

Ellsbury to the M's.

Upton to the Red Sox

Barnes, Owens, Furbush and Franklin to the DBacks?

 

sox make his 2016 contract year a player option year to make him accept the deal.

 

No interest in giving up Barnes. Not overly motivated to give up Owens but I could be convinced with a solid argument from someone I'm sure. I'm not a huge Upton guy. I think there is as much of a chance he blooms in Boston as there is he flames out.

 

Seattle makes sense for Ellsbury. I'm already on record predicting if he isn't traded there he will sign there next off season. Seattle is deeeesperate and if Ells has a solid season Boras is going to exploit the s*** out of them. It will be more then BJ Upton's deal and I bet Boras somehow pulls a Crawford like deal out of the M's. It just makes way too much sense.

[jacksonianmarch]

Victorino- replaces Crawford

Gomes- replaces Ross

Dempster- Replaces Beckett

Drew- replaces Aviles

Uehara- replaces Melancon

Hanrahan- supplants Bailey

Ross- replaces Shoppach

 

The only big plus above is Uehara vs Melancon and if you look at health, Victorino vs Crawford. Without Napoli, they dont replace Gonzalez. Regardless, without another big acquisition, this team will struggle to win 80 games in the AL East.

[jacksonianmarch]

No interest in giving up Barnes. Not overly motivated to give up Owens but I could be convinced with a solid argument from someone I'm sure. I'm not a huge Upton guy. I think there is as much of a chance he blooms in Boston as there is he flames out.

 

Seattle makes sense for Ellsbury. I'm already on record predicting if he isn't traded there he will sign there next off season. Seattle is deeeesperate and if Ells has a solid season Boras is going to exploit the s*** out of them. It will be more then BJ Upton's deal and I bet Boras somehow pulls a Crawford like deal out of the M's. It just makes way too much sense.

 

You are best served by giving all your kids one more yr to see what they can become in the minors. I have a feeling that after August 1, you're going to see Barnes and Bradley in the big leagues with Bogaerts in AAA waiting in the wings.

[a700hitter]

Victorino- replaces Crawford

Gomes- replaces Ross

Dempster- Replaces Beckett

Drew- replaces Aviles

Uehara- replaces Melancon

Hanrahan- supplants Bailey

Ross- replaces Shoppach

 

The only big plus above is Uehara vs Melancon and if you look at health, Victorino vs Crawford. Without Napoli, they dont replace Gonzalez. Regardless, without another big acquisition, this team will struggle to win 80 games in the AL East.

Unless more is done, or all the "ifs" get answered in the affirmative, they will be fighting for 4 th place.

[jacksonianmarch]

Unless more is done, or all the "ifs" get answered in the affirmative, they will be fighting for 4 th place.

 

I haven't made an actual prediction on the sox missing the playoffs or not being in contention since I started posting on message boards. I thought they'd be fighting for the 2nd WC spot last yr, but they obviously missed that mark by a lot. I just dont think they have the star power on either side of the ball and they arent complete in the starting rotation. They also lack the thunder in the lineup of prior yrs. They'll go 78-84 and finish in last place in the division. Them slipping, the Yankees effectively refusing to get better and watching the other three teams gain experience and get better will make this division a f***ing buzzsaw. I still see the Yankees winning the division, but the way things are going for them, I think 2013 is the true last yr of the Yankee "dynasty". 2008 didnt fit since they had a ton of injuries and subsequently won a title the yr after. I honestly see 2014 being a rebuild yr of sorts and both the Yankees and the Sox might be on the downturn for the following 3 yrs or so, with the sox uptrending before the Yankees. It's kinda depressing knowing that this is really the last stand for the Yanks, and if they come out like s***, then they'll go into a hole they wont recover from for years

[a700hitter]

I haven't made an actual prediction on the sox missing the playoffs or not being in contention since I started posting on message boards. I thought they'd be fighting for the 2nd WC spot last yr, but they obviously missed that mark by a lot. I just dont think they have the star power on either side of the ball and they arent complete in the starting rotation. They also lack the thunder in the lineup of prior yrs. They'll go 78-84 and finish in last place in the division. Them slipping, the Yankees effectively refusing to get better and watching the other three teams gain experience and get better will make this division a f***ing buzzsaw. I still see the Yankees winning the division, but the way things are going for them, I think 2013 is the true last yr of the Yankee "dynasty". 2008 didnt fit since they had a ton of injuries and subsequently won a title the yr after. I honestly see 2014 being a rebuild yr of sorts and both the Yankees and the Sox might be on the downturn for the following 3 yrs or so, with the sox uptrending before the Yankees. It's kinda depressing knowing that this is really the last stand for the Yanks, and if they come out like s***, then they'll go into a hole they wont recover from for years

The Yanks look like they could have some trouble this year aging at key positions losing some depth that they have had in past seasons, but Cashman always seems to find a way. I really wish we had throw a lot of money at him a few years ago when his contract was up and shown Theo the door.

[jacksonianmarch]

The biggest reason why I'm a believer in the Yankees is that their pitching staff should be pretty dominant. If they all age at once, then we're f***ed

[mvp 78]

Are you sitting there and actually saying that you would take Gomez over Morse? Unless your out of your damn mind you simply cannot say that with a straight face or funtioning brain. Morse is a power hitter, Gomez is not. Morse has already proven himself as a capable power threat, Gomez has not. Morse can play both outfield and first, Gomez can only play first and is a butcher at third.

 

Also MVP while you once again are taking the party line and trying to act at Cherington's cheer leader.

 

I was just pointing out the hypocrisy in you stating Morse is only 31, but Gomez is an old 28. At the same point in their lives, Morse only had 4 more homeruns than Gomez... You can't spin that, it's just the truth.

 

I'm no cheerleader, but you'd know that if you actually read my posts rather than rambled off into another one of your senseless diatribes.

[Spitball]

Guardians, Cubs, Red Sox, and M's are his NT teams.

 

What about a three team deal?

Ellsbury to the M's.

Upton to the Red Sox

Barnes, Owens, Furbush and Franklin to the DBacks?

 

sox make his 2016 contract year a player option year to make him accept the deal.

 

I don't think the Sox are trading Ellsbury right now. They might change their mind at the trade deadline. I do know for certain they will not acquire Upton for one year of Ellsbury.

[jacksonianmarch]

Ellsbury, Barnes and Owens is a steep, steep price to pay

[seabeachfred]

Nonense!!!!!! By your skirting my question about choosing Gomez over Morse, you pretty much played the Cherington line that Gomez would be just fine for first base for the Red Sox this year and kept up your flunky party line support intact. If you had bothered to read the whole post I made it was clear that Morse has already proved he could hack on the big league level while your boy Gomez could not. And, please MVP, enough with the denials. You are a total party line follower in that whatever comes down from Yawkey Way is just fine and dandy with you, and until I see you finally take the front office to task for something wrong that they did, that is what I will consider as your person.

 

And don't tell me you will criticize them for bungling when you see something to criticize because that is bogus for the simple reason that this front office has made one screwup after another the past few years. Wake up and smell the freakin' coffee.

[Spitball]

Ellsbury, Barnes and Owens is a steep, steep price to pay

 

Right, and the Mariners can not possibly contend this year. They will absolutely not want one year of Ellsbury.

[Spitball]

Nonense!!!!!! By your skirting my question about choosing Gomez over Morse, you pretty much played the Cherington line that Gomez would be just fine for first base for the Red Sox this year and kept up your flunky party line support intact. If you had bothered to read the whole post I made it was clear that Morse has already proved he could hack on the big league level while your boy Gomez could not. And, please MVP, enough with the denials. You are a total party line follower in that whatever comes down from Yawkey Way is just fine and dandy with you, and until I see you finally take the front office to task for something wrong that they did, that is what I will consider as your person.

 

And don't tell me you will criticize them for bungling when you see something to criticize because that is bogus for the simple reason that this front office has made one screwup after another the past few years. Wake up and smell the freakin' coffee.

 

This is just a question...or a concern. Morse has bulked up considerably since his rookie season. MLB will be testing for HGH this season. Morse already has one suspension for PEDs. How can the Red Sox be certain he is clean? He seems like a candidate for suspicion and doubt.

[a700hitter]

This is just a question...or a concern. Morse has bulked up considerably since his rookie season. MLB will be testing for HGH this season. Morse already has one suspension for PEDs. How can the Red Sox be certain he is clean? He seems like a candidate for suspicion and doubt.

He is a moose. i don"t know how you can be certain that anyone is clean today.

[Spitball]

He is a moose. i don"t know how you can be certain that anyone is clean today.

 

Well, a guy comes up as a middle infielder. He bulks up considerably and already has one suspension. He is can be a concern.

[a700hitter]

Well, a guy comes up as a middle infielder. He bulks up considerably and already has one suspension. He is can be a concern.

I would be concerned.

[mvp 78]

Nonense!!!!!! By your skirting my question about choosing Gomez over Morse, you pretty much played the Cherington line that Gomez would be just fine for first base for the Red Sox this year and kept up your flunky party line support intact. If you had bothered to read the whole post I made it was clear that Morse has already proved he could hack on the big league level while your boy Gomez could not. And, please MVP, enough with the denials. You are a total party line follower in that whatever comes down from Yawkey Way is just fine and dandy with you, and until I see you finally take the front office to task for something wrong that they did, that is what I will consider as your person.

 

And don't tell me you will criticize them for bungling when you see something to criticize because that is bogus for the simple reason that this front office has made one screwup after another the past few years. Wake up and smell the freakin' coffee.

 

You really have terrible reading comprehension skills.

[mvp 78]

Fred, all your arguments boil down to "I'm a straight shooter so anyone who doesn't agree with me is a ballwasher for the FO." Maybe you should try reading other people's posts for once? You are the only poster on here who thinks I'm a honk for the FO, I'm not.

[a700hitter]

Fred, all your arguments boil down to "I'm a straight shooter so anyone who doesn't agree with me is a ballwasher for the FO." Maybe you should try reading other people's posts for once? You are the only poster on here who thinks I'm a honk for the FO, I'm not.

Just a honk in general.