What do the Red Sox need to do to make the playoffs?

[jung]

I think a one game play in is definitely a crap shoot no matter who you have starting that game....I don't really buy the argument that a short series is a crap shoot. If anything it is easier to control a short series with superior starting pitching than a long series.

[a700hitter]

i think 2007 spoiled us. we expect to be in the thick of it with injuries which we currently are. and sometimes its not possible. but you bet the players on the field are trying as hard as they can ...

Crawford and Ellsbury get back and we have a better lineup. compared to one with Kalish and Nava esp against RHH pitching.

Bailey can strengthen the bullpen even more.

BV will be facing some tough challenges on who gets DFAd.

 

Punto/DiceK might be the ones. and Kalish is likely headed to AAA.

 

I still Believe they can pull something spectacular. but SP needs to step up. Morales/Cook/Beckett/Buchholz are starting to get that.

Lester needs to be on his game from now on and be lights out for the remainder and we might be in good shape.

we need to win every series from here on. simple. play .667 baseball maybe loose a few here and there. but have to keep winning 4 out of 5 series.

Every team has injuries. The Yankees have them this season and most other seasons, but yet they keep accumulating division titles. We were spoiled by 2007? I don't know how you can get spoiled by one division title in 17 years.

[Bellhorn04]

Every team has injuries. The Yankees have them this season and most other seasons' date=' but yet they keep accumulating division titles. We were spoiled by 2007? I don't know how you can get spoiled by one division title in 17 years.[/quote']

 

Because we were making the playoffs with regularity, with or without the division title, and we had won the World Series or made a serious run at it in 3 out of 5 years.

[a700hitter]

Because we were making the playoffs with regularity' date=' with or without the division title, and we had won the World Series or made a serious run at it in 3 out of 5 years.[/quote']But we haven't been doing that recently and the wild card is now at an extreme disadvantage under the new rules, and the only way the Red Sox seem to get to the post season is via the wild card. One division title in 17 years is nothing to crow about.

[kapsis21]

Every team has injuries. The Yankees have them this season and most other seasons' date=' but yet they keep accumulating division titles. We were spoiled by 2007? I don't know how you can get spoiled by one division title in 17 years.[/quote']

 

Yankees have got the injury bug just now. the only guy they had injured that mattered was Gardner and Mo since last month. but they had 7th 8th 9th innning guys pat down in Robertson and ummm cant remember their closers name.. crap.

 

we were out Ellsbury Crawford our closer Bailey, our 8th inning specialist Bard ffrom day 1. and Melancon crapped the bed since day 1.

we had Ross/Sweeney/Pods/Pedroia/Youk out for 2 weeks + with injurries.

Youk was playing banged up.

 

practically 75% of our roster was on the DL. at some point.

 

Yankees have Gardner, Mo, and now CC and Petite. Tex was out for a week. Swisher maybe for 2 weeks, so was Chavez but he is replacable in their lineup.

 

can we play better than thi.... f***ing yes there is no doubt.

and it starts with Agon stepping up.

BV will need to make some decissions now. and it will all depend on what roster changes he makes that might be the deciding factor on our playoff chances.

[a700hitter]

Yankees have got the injury bug just now. the only guy they had injured that mattered was Gardner and Mo since last month. but they had 7th 8th 9th innning guys pat down in Robertson and ummm cant remember their closers name.. crap.

 

we were out Ellsbury Crawford our closer Bailey, our 8th inning specialist Bard ffrom day 1. and Melancon crapped the bed since day 1.

we had Ross/Sweeney/Pods/Pedroia/Youk out for 2 weeks + with injurries.

Youk was playing banged up.

 

practically 75% of our roster was on the DL. at some point.

 

Yankees have Gardner, Mo, and now CC and Petite. Tex was out for a week. Swisher maybe for 2 weeks, so was Chavez but he is replacable in their lineup.

 

can we play better f***ing yes there is no doubt.

and it starts with Agon stepping up.

BV will need to make some decissions now. and it will all depend on what roster changes he makes that might be the deciding factor on our playoff chances.

Pineda was supposed to be their #3 starter. He's out for the year. Joba almost amputated his foot on a trampoline. They don't count? We need to stop whining about injuries. Every team gets them, and even when the Yankees have more injuries than the Red Sox, they find a way to beat us.

[User Name]

I think a one game play in is definitely a crap shoot no matter who you have starting that game....I don't really buy the argument that a short series is a crap shoot. If anything it is easier to control a short series with superior starting pitching than a long series.

 

Doesn't matter. Anything can happen during the span of 4-7 games. A hot team can beat a massively superior team regardless of pitching matchups. Again, the 2011 Cardinals beat both the Phillies and Texas, two teams with superior pitching and superior offenses.

[User Name]

Speaking of blabber, what were those predictions of mine? You don't know, do you, because you have always been about taking shots and blabbering.

 

Please don't quote this guy when he has responded to me. Every once in a while I get the urge to respond to is blabber.

 

In general, your prediction is that everything about the Red Sox sucks, has sucked or will suck. And that's no blabber brah.

[kapsis21]

Pineda was supposed to be their #3 starter. He's out for the year. Joba almost amputated his foot on a trampoline. They don't count? We need to stop whining about injuries. Every team gets them' date=' and even when the Yankees have more injuries than the Red Sox, they find a way to beat us.[/quote']

 

Pineda was going to start in AAA so that shouldnt really be too much to fret.

Joba i forgot. but he was the bullpen arm that replaced Atchison or Mortensen. not that it matters but in a 2 run lead they were not going to give the ball to Joba.

[User Name]

Pineda was going to start in AAA so that shouldnt really be too much to fret.

Joba i forgot. but he was the bullpen arm that replaced Atchison or Mortensen. not that it matters but in a 2 run lead they were not going to give the ball to Joba.

 

The Sox have had DL stints from everyone in their starting rotation sans Lester and Doubront, almost the entire lineup, most of the bullpen, and even some of the reserve starters.

 

The Sox rank first in the Majors on days by their players on the DL and it's not even close. Injuries have passed the point where they have stopped being an excuse and have become a serious organization problem. Bad luck doesn't justify the amount of injuries the Sox have suffered the past three seasons. There has to be some sort of organizational problem.

[FredLynn]

So the WC isn't a viable way to make the playoffs and no 7-game division leads held in July have been squandered over the last couple of years.

 

You know what? You're absolutely right. Stick a fork in 'em.

 

I am pretty close to doing just that.

[kapsis21]

The Sox have had DL stints from everyone in their starting rotation sans Lester and Doubront, almost the entire lineup, most of the bullpen, and even some of the reserve starters.

 

The Sox rank first in the Majors on days by their players on the DL and it's not even close. Injuries have passed the point where they have stopped being an excuse and have become a serious organization problem. Bad luck doesn't justify the amount of injuries the Sox have suffered the past three seasons. There has to be some sort of organizational problem.

 

it could be an organizational problem...

 

The amount of injuries we have is by far the most any team can adapt to. The condition coaches and the medical staff needs to be better prepared when a player complains or even if he doesnt complain to figure it out.. thats their job.

[NativeBostonian]

We need to win series against teams like the Mariners and A's.

[FredLynn]

The Sox have had DL stints from everyone in their starting rotation sans Lester and Doubront, almost the entire lineup, most of the bullpen, and even some of the reserve starters.

 

The Sox rank first in the Majors on days by their players on the DL and it's not even close. Injuries have passed the point where they have stopped being an excuse and have become a serious organization problem. Bad luck doesn't justify the amount of injuries the Sox have suffered the past three seasons. There has to be some sort of organizational problem.

 

How do we rank if you remove players who are better off on the DL like Lackey, Matsusaka, Jenks, McDonald and the like? Its not the number of players on the DL, its who the players are. Even though Ellsbury and Crawford have been on the DL all year we have still scored plenty of runs with guys like Nava overperforming. The only significant pitcher on the DL is Bailey. Our pitching still stinks. That is the essence of our problems: poor pitching, especially the lack of a true ace. And that hasn't been addressed in three years. Until it gets addressed effectively we will see THIS kind of team out on the field year after year. Injuries have little to do with it.

[User Name]

How do we rank if you remove players who are better off on the DL like Lackey' date=' Matsusaka, Jenks, McDonald and the like? Its not the number of players on the DL, its who the players are. Even though Ellsbury and Crawford have been on the DL all year we have still scored plenty of runs with guys like Nava overperforming. The only significant pitcher on the DL is Bailey. Our pitching still stinks. That is the essence of our problems: poor pitching, especially the lack of a true ace. And that hasn't been addressed in three years. Until it gets addressed effectively we will see THIS kind of team out on the field year after year. Injuries have little to do with it.[/quote']

 

You're missing the core point. Even role players and relief pitchers are important. When you have so many injuries mounting up it puts pressure on the roster as a whole. That's not even debatable. The pitching would also look much better if it was relatively healthy, i'd wager. Please stop being illogical. Even if you remove the has-beens from the equation this team has been terribly injured this season, just like the past two seasons. Saying the quality of the team's play this year has little to do with injuries borders on idiocy.

[Bellhorn04]

I am pretty close to doing just that.

 

Ha ha. If they win the next few games in a row you'll be back on board. You know, you don't have to keep 'taking a position' on whether we'll make the playoffs or not. It's not really necessary. The outcome will not be affected by your constantly changing viewpoint.

[FredLynn]

You're missing the core point. Even role players and relief pitchers are important. When you have so many injuries mounting up it puts pressure on the roster as a whole. That's not even debatable. The pitching would also look much better if it was relatively healthy' date=' i'd wager. Please stop being illogical. Even if you remove the has-beens from the equation this team has been terribly injured this season, just like the past two seasons. Saying the quality of the team's play this year has little to do with injuries borders on idiocy.[/quote']

 

I will tell you what "idiocy" is: thinking we are a better team with the likes of Lackey and Matsusaka and Jenks to have to make room for on the roster. That is foolish. My guess is that if we take them out of the equation we do not have more injury days that most other teams.

I think we can stipulate that our problems this year have not been with the offense. Its been the pitching. Do you know that 69 of our 80 games have been started by the five SP who were tabbed as SP to begin the season. As Mazz said in his article today, injuries have not been the problem. Execution has.

[FredLynn]

Ha ha. If they win the next few games in a row you'll be back on board. You know' date=' you don't have to keep 'taking a position' on whether we'll make the playoffs or not. It's not really necessary. The outcome will not be affected by your constantly changing viewpoint.[/quote']

 

I have been crystal clear what my position is: we either win the ALE or we plan for next year because we are more than likely a one and out playoff team, and who needs that. We will probably compete all year for a WC position. By "out of it" I am referring to winning the ALE. This late in the season I would say eight games in the lost column is too much to overcome, so if we lose any more ground, we can stick a fork in them and move on to planning for next year or 2014.

[User Name]

I will tell you what "idiocy" is: thinking we are a better team with the likes of Lackey and Matsusaka and Jenks to have to make room for on the roster. That is foolish. My guess is that if we take them out of the equation we do not have more injury days that most other teams.

I think we can stipulate that our problems this year have not been with the offense. Its been the pitching. Do you know that 69 of our 80 games have been started by the five SP who were tabbed as SP to begin the season. As Mazz said in his article today, injuries have not been the problem. Execution has.

 

Lackey is useless because of TJ. A healthy Matsuzaka and Jenks could've at least been league average.But let's take the two of them out too and the Sox would still be number one in number of DL stints this year. Mazz is a sensationalist douchebag who you for some reason seem to worship as the voice of reason, even though the man is on Skip Bayless levels of attention whoring, (i just told you what exactly idiocy is by the way).

 

Let me tell you something: Both have been a problem. But execution hasn't been such a big problem as of late as injuries. And i'm not saying injuries are an excuse. They are a problem which the FO hasn't been able to remedy. They're way past the threshold of excuses. Minimizing the impact of the team's injury issues does nothing to help fix what has become an inherent problem.

 

If you want to grill the ownership of the Boston Red Sox for something, be fair and grill them for what's been obviously their fault: An inability to keep the team on the field. The rest is hyperbole.

[FredLynn]

Lackey is useless because of TJ. A healthy Matsuzaka and Jenks could've at least been league average.But let's take the two of them out too and the Sox would still be number one in number of DL stints this year. Mazz is a sensationalist douchebag who you for some reason seem to worship as the voice of reason, even though the man is on Skip Bayless levels of attention whoring, (i just told you what exactly idiocy is by the way).

 

Let me tell you something: Both have been a problem. But execution hasn't been such a big problem as of late as injuries. And i'm not saying injuries are an excuse. They are a problem which the FO hasn't been able to remedy. They're way past the threshold of excuses. Minimizing the impact of the team's injury issues does nothing to help fix what has become an inherent problem.

 

If you want to grill the ownership of the Boston Red Sox for something, be fair and grill them for what's been obviously their fault: An inability to keep the team on the field. The rest is hyperbole.

 

Lackey was useless long before TJ. So was DiceK. Jenks was never useful at all. And as I keep saying, and you keep avoiding, injuries to our position players have failed to keep us from scoring lots of runs. We are second in the AL in runs scored. Sure we would have scored more with Ellsbury and (maybe) Crawford in there, but their replacements have generally overperformed anyway. Our problem is pitching. Here is Mazz's article, which I happen to agree with:

 

Fact: Of the Red Sox' 80 games to date, 69 have been started by Josh Beckett, Jon Lester, Clay Buchholz, Daniel Bard and Felix Doubront, their season-opening five-man rotation. Until Beckett and then Buchholz went on the disabled list late last month, not a single one of them had missed more than a start to injury. Further, the Red Sox are 6-5 in games started by Daisuke Matsuzaka, Aaron Cook and Franklin Morales, the last of whom currently looks like a potential discovery.

In games started by Lester and Beckett this season - the alleged aces of the staff - the Red Sox are 14-17. At a time when pitchers are reclaiming the game, neither has an ERA under 4.00. Boston's two best starters (in theory) rank 21st (Beckett) and 31st (Lester) among the qualifying 44 AL starters in ERA, which simply is not good enough.

 

And so, when someone like Saltalamacchia refers to "pitching injuries" as he did to the Globe's Nick Cafardo on Monday, he's twisting the facts. Even minus any real contribution from Andrew Bailey or Mark Melancon, Red Sox relievers rank fifth in the AL in ERA (3.10), and they could be as high as second (Oakland, 3.00) by the end of the night.

 

Injuries have not been the real problem on the pitching staff.

 

Execution has.

[jung]

Well I am not sure I really answered the question UN asked. I am so non-plused by this two WC set up that I really posted what I thought the Sox needed to do to have a legitimate shot to remain in contention for and win the division. I think they could get to the one game play in doing most of what I suggested in my earlier post. However I don't think they would need another arm in the rotation to get in via the WC route. Since I really don't think you can plan strategically for a one game play in if I got in that way, what I did next would depend on who I was playing in the one game and who I thought I would be playing in the first round should I be able to win the one game play in game.

 

I would not necessarily pitch my best pitcher in the one game play in and would make the decision about whether I was going to try to cycle my best pitcher up to the top for that game as the season was winding down and I had some opinion about who I thought I was going to play both in the play in and then in the first round if I won the play in game.

 

As I said earlier I really don't think much of this one game play in thing.

 

I am just as inclined to think that Selig did not like the possibility that one or both of his cash cows (sox/yankees) might get shut out of the post season and used the rational that more teams would have a shot at the playoffs as a cover for his making an effort to insure that at least one of them would get in and increase the chances that both would remain in the hunt till late in the season.

[Bellhorn04]

The one game play ins were a terrible idea. Pure gimmickry, like the All Star Game deciding World Series home field advantage.

[Emmz]

They play up to what they can, they make it. Simple as that. This team has hella talent, time to play up to it. They keep playing like ass, they're going to finish with 80-85 games. They can still win 95, no problem if they're playing to ability and not blowing it.

[User Name]

Lackey was useless long before TJ. So was DiceK. Jenks was never useful at all. And as I keep saying, and you keep avoiding, injuries to our position players have failed to keep us from scoring lots of runs. We are second in the AL in runs scored. Sure we would have scored more with Ellsbury and (maybe) Crawford in there, but their replacements have generally overperformed anyway. Our problem is pitching. Here is Mazz's article, which I happen to agree with:

 

Fact: Of the Red Sox' 80 games to date, 69 have been started by Josh Beckett, Jon Lester, Clay Buchholz, Daniel Bard and Felix Doubront, their season-opening five-man rotation. Until Beckett and then Buchholz went on the disabled list late last month, not a single one of them had missed more than a start to injury. Further, the Red Sox are 6-5 in games started by Daisuke Matsuzaka, Aaron Cook and Franklin Morales, the last of whom currently looks like a potential discovery.

In games started by Lester and Beckett this season - the alleged aces of the staff - the Red Sox are 14-17. At a time when pitchers are reclaiming the game, neither has an ERA under 4.00. Boston's two best starters (in theory) rank 21st (Beckett) and 31st (Lester) among the qualifying 44 AL starters in ERA, which simply is not good enough.

 

And so, when someone like Saltalamacchia refers to "pitching injuries" as he did to the Globe's Nick Cafardo on Monday, he's twisting the facts. Even minus any real contribution from Andrew Bailey or Mark Melancon, Red Sox relievers rank fifth in the AL in ERA (3.10), and they could be as high as second (Oakland, 3.00) by the end of the night.

 

Injuries have not been the real problem on the pitching staff.

 

Execution has.

 

You agree with everything Mazz says, as long as it's disparaging the Red Sox. As for the article, he's not completely wrong, but he's not completely right either. Beckett and Buchholz have both had a myriad maladies for the season, and with a healthy Dice-K (like it or not) the Bard experiment probably doesn't happen, or the plug would have been pulled earlier. As you said yourself, a healthy Crawford and Ellsbury overperform their replacements not only offensively, but defensively too, which also helps the pitching staff. Ditto for Kalish, who is a great defender in RF, and they've had a rotating circus of defensive suck there all season.

[a700hitter]

Lackey was useless long before TJ. So was DiceK. Jenks was never useful at all. And as I keep saying, and you keep avoiding, injuries to our position players have failed to keep us from scoring lots of runs. We are second in the AL in runs scored. Sure we would have scored more with Ellsbury and (maybe) Crawford in there, but their replacements have generally overperformed anyway. Our problem is pitching. Here is Mazz's article, which I happen to agree with:

 

Fact: Of the Red Sox' 80 games to date, 69 have been started by Josh Beckett, Jon Lester, Clay Buchholz, Daniel Bard and Felix Doubront, their season-opening five-man rotation. Until Beckett and then Buchholz went on the disabled list late last month, not a single one of them had missed more than a start to injury. Further, the Red Sox are 6-5 in games started by Daisuke Matsuzaka, Aaron Cook and Franklin Morales, the last of whom currently looks like a potential discovery.

In games started by Lester and Beckett this season - the alleged aces of the staff - the Red Sox are 14-17. At a time when pitchers are reclaiming the game, neither has an ERA under 4.00. Boston's two best starters (in theory) rank 21st (Beckett) and 31st (Lester) among the qualifying 44 AL starters in ERA, which simply is not good enough.

 

And so, when someone like Saltalamacchia refers to "pitching injuries" as he did to the Globe's Nick Cafardo on Monday, he's twisting the facts. Even minus any real contribution from Andrew Bailey or Mark Melancon, Red Sox relievers rank fifth in the AL in ERA (3.10), and they could be as high as second (Oakland, 3.00) by the end of the night.

 

Injuries have not been the real problem on the pitching staff.

 

Execution has.

I agree. We haven't had any injuries of any duration or note to our starting pitchers. We are where we are, because our pitching sucks. Injuries are not the reason for this teams performance--- not even in the equation.

[User Name]

What doesn't seem to factor into the equation is simple logic. Wow.

[a700hitter]

In general' date=' your prediction is that everything about the Red Sox sucks, has sucked or will suck. And that's no blabber brah. [/quote']You got the wrong guy, blabberer. So, you shot off your mouth about my preseason predictions, but you couldn't back them up, because you have no idea what they were. None of my pre-season predictions included the word "suck". Get lost, you inflammatory jackass.

 

I have had you on ignore for a long time. You have been gone for a long time, but yet the minute you come back you take your cheap shots.

[User Name]

Hey i gave you a perfectly honest description of your predictions for the Red Sox, which you backed up in your previous post: Murphy's Law, and a whole lot of blabber.

 

If you can honestly sit there and say injuries haven't been part of the rough stretches the Red Sox have had have nothing to do with injuries, you're either delusional or not as smart as you think you are (which would be my choice for a reason).

[iortiz]

As I said over and over and over and over... problem has been our pitching. Even with key injured field players, our offense has been great in that department; In fact, outstanding performance given the circumstances, didn't expect this good.

 

Again, we need to improve the pitching, the question is, when? this season? 2013?... when?

[a700hitter]

Hey i gave you a perfectly honest description of your predictions for the Red Sox, which you backed up in your previous post: Murphy's Law, and a whole lot of blabber.

 

If you can honestly sit there and say injuries haven't been part of the rough stretches the Red Sox have had have nothing to do with injuries, you're either delusional or not as smart as you think you are (which would be my choice for a reason).

The injuries have been to our outfield and Youk, yet the offense has been fine. The Red Sox offense is second in the league in runs scored. The starting pitching has been the problem (11th out of 14 in ERA) and they haven't had any injuries beyond what other teams have suffered. The problem is the starting pitching, which by and large has been healthy. If you can't see that, then you can't see the cold hard numbers that tell the opposite story.

 

Back to ignore. I have no tolerance for a fool like you.