May, 28th Tiger vs Red Sox

[a700hitter]

I am anxious to see how Bard throws tomorrow. He claims to have found something in his bullpen session this week and that he feels like himself again. Does that mean he is going to be throwing 95-96 again? Who knows. We sure could use a big outing from Bard tomorrow against Verlander. Need to score early against him so Bard doesn't feel like he has to be perfect. Easier said than done.

 

It would make sense, though. The Sox would wait to get over .500 against the best pitcher in baseball

I am not anxious to see him pitch. I am looking for some backup activity in case he gets his doors blown off early.

[jung]

I am not anxious to see him pitch.

 

So is there a particular reason that you think Bard is going to pitch worse than he has lately? Are you thinking that since it is Verlander, Bard will see this as a big moment and become as defocused as he has sometimes been when a runner gets on base or is it something else that you think will be his undoing?

[a700hitter]

So is there a particular reason that you think Bard is going to pitch worse than he has lately? Are you thinking that since it is Verlander' date=' Bard will see this as a big moment and become as defocused as he has sometimes been when a runner gets on base or is it something else that you think will be his undoing?[/quote']I don't think he will be any worse than he has been, although he has been getting progressively worse. Should I be eagerly anticipating his start? The Sox are 3-5 in games he starts. His ERA in May is 5.38, and he is going head to head with Verlander, the reigning MVP.

[Station 13]

I don't think he will be any worse than he has been' date=' although he has been getting progressively worse. Should I be eagerly anticipating his start? The Sox are 3-5 in games he starts. His ERA in May is 5.38, and he is going head to head with Verlander, the reigning MVP.[/quote']

 

In 5 losses his runs support were 1, 0, 1, 4, and 3. Most team loses 4 of those in most cases. The 4 run support loss being Albers serving up a golfer ball to Butler.

[Palodios]

In 5 losses his runs support were 1' date=' 0, 1, 4, and 3. Most team loses 4 of those in most cases. The 4 run support loss being Albers serving up a golfer ball to Butler.[/quote']

 

I don't think that's fair at all to use those numbers. In his five losses he gave up 5, 1, 4, 5, 5 runs. Sure, you can throw out the shutout by Tampa in his one run loss, but four of his five losses are well deserved.

[FredLynn]

We're at.500 and Bard is going against Verlander tomorrow. Wer are going nowhere fast.

 

The only way we win tomorrow is if Verlander has an off game. That happens occasionally. Otherwise, its a mismatch.

[Station 13]

I don't think that's fair at all to use those numbers. In his five losses he gave up 5' date=' 1, 4, 5, 5 runs. Sure, you can throw out the shutout by Tampa in his one run loss, but four of his five losses are well deserved.[/quote']

 

If the 9 batters send up there only muster out 1.8 run a game in the losses, they totally deserves it.

[Station 13]

The only way we win tomorrow is if Verlander has an off game. That happens occasionally. Otherwise' date=' its a mismatch.[/quote']

 

He usually pitches well against Boston. And he is pitching even better this year than last year.

[jung]

OK, that I get 700. I thought maybe you were talkin' about expecting an early and total implosion, something worse than what we might expect based on his recent stints. My bad.

 

Of course he might go all ta' hell early. I don't see anything lately that would suggest that but I also have not seen anything lately that would suggest a really good stint either.

 

That did not look like the same Tiger bunch that started the season. We might get some help there. I do not know if their problem is a lineup that is always swingin' 11/10's but maybe the reason they hammered so many during the first series is because they are always swingin' 11/10's. Put enough raw meat in front of that crew and I guess you should expect to see some blood and guts flying.

 

Maybe they are much like Salty, big and strong but not ever likely to hit for average. I am totally on board with Salty swinging for the fences every time up. But if I had a team full of Salty's I would be worried. Maybe to some extent that is what the Tigers have turned out to be. Keep the ball away from the spots where they can really hurt you and the Tiger stays caged. Hang the raw meat out there and look out.

 

The difference might be giving up the occasional 1 run homer vs guys crossing the plate every five seconds.

[Palodios]

If the 9 batters send up there only muster out 1.8 run a game in the losses' date=' they totally deserves it.[/quote']

 

If Bard pitches poorly, he deserves to lose. It is as simple as that.

[a700hitter]

OK, that I get 700. I thought maybe you were talkin' about expecting an early and total implosion, something worse than what we might expect based on his recent stints. My bad.

 

Of course he might go all ta' hell early. I don't see anything lately that would suggest that but I also have not seen anything lately that would suggest a really good stint either.

 

That did not look like the same Tiger bunch that started the season. We might get some help there. I do not know if their problem is a lineup that is always swingin' 11/10's but maybe the reason they hammered so many during the first series is because they are always swingin' 11/10's. Put enough raw meat in front of that crew and I guess you should expect to see some blood and guts flying.

 

Maybe they are much like Salty, big and strong but not ever likely to hit for average. I am totally on board with Salty swinging for the fences every time up. But if I had a team full of Salty's I would be worried. Maybe to some extent that is what the Tigers have turned out to be. Keep the ball away from the spots where they can really hurt you and the Tiger stays caged. Hang the raw meat out there and look out.

 

The difference might be giving up the occasional 1 run homer vs guys crossing the plate every five seconds.

I am hoping that he finds something to turn things around for him. Time is running out on him.

[jung]

Well the difference between what we saw from the Tigers today and what we saw the first series was night and day. I doubt that is all Felix other than in saying that Felix showed the other Sox pitchers what they can do with this Tigers team if they keep the ball away from the real green light, go deep locations...up and in catching to much plate to the RH hitter, down and in catching to much plate to the LH hitter.

[redsoxrules]

If the 9 batters send up there only muster out 1.8 run a game in the losses' date=' they totally deserves it.[/quote']

 

it doesen't changed the fact that he sucked himself

[SoxFanForsyth]

I am not anxious to see him pitch. I am looking for some backup activity in case he gets his doors blown off early.

 

Considering his average FB during his 1st start vs TOR was 95 mph, and touched 98mph, then in his last start he averaged 92 mph, touching 94, I would expect that he's not right. So when he comes out and says "I finally feel like myself again", I would think that would be a good thing.

 

When his FB sits 95 and he can gear it up to 98 when needed, that makes all of his other pitches much more effective, especially his slider.

 

I'm not saying he's going to dominate or throw harder, I'm just anxious to see how his comments translate into performance.

[jung]

I did not catch Bard's comment about feeling like "himself" and I don't know how that is going to translate either. It seemed to me that he recognized that he was not the kind of pitcher that could run it up there at 96 inning after inning as a starter nor the kind of pitcher that could summon that sort of heat when he needed it at least in the starter's role.

 

It has seemed to me the entire time that Bard has been unable to maintain consistent arm angle and consistent motion from one pitch to the next and from one inning to the next after having a sit while the Sox bat. It has also seemed difficult for him to maintain his concentration and focus once there is a runner on base or some other distraction that has taken his attention away from the hitter.

 

In addition, on those evenings when he is a two pitch pitcher, once the hitters have seen him he seems to feel compelled to get finer and finer as the game progresses which makes matters worse for him with regard to walks. In fact this is where I have been disappointed in the Sox coaching. Where V or somebody has come out to talk to Doubront when the game seems to be getting away from him, I have not really seen the Sox do that with Bard.

 

Now how feeling like "himself" resolves the issues that have plagued him I guess remains to be seen. Maybe he is talking about his velo??? Guess we will just have to see.

 

As I have said before, I think Bard has done pretty well in what has looked to me to be a difficult situation. Doubront has been better than the other 4's that he runs into out there and Bard does better than the other 5's he runs into. Verlander is a whole other ball of wax though. I do hope trying to match him inning for inning does not become a distraction all its own.

[Bellhorn04]

If the Orioles-Jays score holds up the Sox will have gone from 7.5 out of first on May 19 to 4.5 out on May 28.

[FredLynn]

If Bard pitches poorly' date=' he deserves to lose. It is as simple as that.[/quote']

 

Bard can pitch very well tomorrow and still lose because Verlander can pitch great shutdown baseball. Lets just hope he has an off game; thats our only hope.

[jung]

It is the other first place team, that is probably more worrisome. Although the Orioles pitching probably means they will stick longer than we would like.

 

I know it is popular to praise the Rays for their record on their budget but I really do begin to wonder where they would be were it not for that rat hole of a basement dungeon that is their home park. They are 17-8 down their in that hell hole. Some part of that record must have something to do with how difficult it is for teams to come into that place and play. Rays are 12-12 away from the Trop.

[redsoxbeatz]

I dont understand why that stadium IS so hard to others to play in?

[RedSoxNC84]

It is the other first place team, that is probably more worrisome. Although the Orioles pitching probably means they will stick longer than we would like.

 

I know it is popular to praise the Rays for their record on their budget but I really do begin to wonder where they would be were it not for that rat hole of a basement dungeon that is their home park. They are 17-8 down their in that hell hole. Some part of that record must have something to do with how difficult it is for teams to come into that place and play. Rays are 12-12 away from the Trop.

 

The stadium for their AAA team (durham) is actually located literally right next to a prison. I think they do a lot of drafting from there.

[jung]

I dont understand why that stadium IS so hard to others to play in?

 

I know for me, when I watch a game telecast from there, even though I am viewing it on TV, it is the only indoor stadium that leaves me with that feeling like every bad CYO gym where I have played late night basketball games. the acoustics are horrible in there. You can tell they are horrible. No other indoor stadium that I have seen a game played in leaves me with that CYO gym feeling.

 

Then there is the fact that occasionally the ball does actually clang off a catwalk....almost like they did not design it specifically to avoid that happenstance. I know it is rare but for God sake....it is major league baseball. It should never happen. I also get the feeling that in a park where that possibility actually does exist, fly balls going up might leave the player with an odd feeling of being out of position even though there is nothing the player can do if the ball does clang off one of those catwalks. That is another one of those elements that are reminiscent of a bad CYO gym. Those places always felt like the space provided was to small for the specific activity you were engaged in, which has an odd feeling all its own.

 

There is no denying that the place looks incredibly dark comparing it to other indoor parks, there just does not seem like there is enough light in there and certainly not what these players would view as the usual amount of light.

 

The overall effect leaves me feeling like the Trop is farther removed from any of the other places where they play. To come in there and play three or four games and then move on must be kinda' strange. Must take some part of the first game of a series just to get over how odd the place must feel.

[NativeBostonian]

I know for me, when I watch a game telecast from there, even though I am viewing it on TV, it is the only indoor stadium that leaves me with that feeling like every bad CYO gym where I have played late night basketball games. the acoustics are horrible in there. You can tell they are horrible. No other indoor stadium that I have seen a game played in leaves me with that CYO gym feeling.

 

Then there is the fact that occasionally the ball does actually clang off a catwalk....almost like they did not design it specifically to avoid that happenstance. I know it is rare but for God sake....it is major league baseball. It should never happen. I also get the feeling that in a park where that possibility actually does exist, fly balls going up might leave the player with an odd feeling of being out of position even though there is nothing the player can do if the ball does clang off one of those catwalks. That is another one of those elements that are reminiscent of a bad CYO gym. Those places always felt like the space provided was to small for the specific activity you were engaged in, which has an odd feeling all its own.

 

There is no denying that the place looks incredibly dark comparing it to other indoor parks, there just does not seem like there is enough light in there and certainly not what these players would view as the usual amount of light.

 

The overall effect leaves me feeling like the Trop is farther removed from any of the other places where they play. To come in there and play three or four games and then move on must be kinda' strange. Must take some part of the first game of a series just to get over how odd the place must feel.

 

You are dead on with your observation. I've been to Tropicana Field a whole bunch of times. I go to pretty much every Red Sox Rays game. I've also been to a whole bunch of other stadiums and quite frankly it doesn't feel like a ball game, at Tropicana Field. It feels like I'm watching baseball being played in my living room. The noise is weird the air-conditioning puts you to sleep and the stupid find the cow games distracts you from the actual action.

 

The problem is they can't build a new stadium. It might help building it in Tampa but who is going to take that risk when they don't draw. There has to be a sign of significant gain in order for someone to take a financial risk like building 1 billion dollar stadium. Hell look at the Marlins. They have this nice beautiful new stadium and their 15th in attendance. A new stadium alone should move your attendance up drastically. Never mind the fact that the Marlins are actually doing pretty well this year.

 

I say move the Rays somewhere else. The Florida experiment has failed.

[Station 13]

Trop is a bush league hellhole. Always been.