2012 Catch-All Trade Deadline Thread

[Station 13]

With Beckett and Buchholz on the DL' date=' I think they need to get a good starter in here.[/quote']

 

WTF Buchholz?

[a700hitter]

Red Sox place Clay Buchholz on disabled list

Permalink|Comments (14) Posted by Leonard Neslin June 24, 2012 11:36 AM

 

Peter Abraham reports the Red Sox have placed Clay Buchholz on the disabled list due to a gastro-intestinal issue.

 

No corresponding roster move has been announced as of this time.

 

Buchholz yesterday was scratched from today's start. He's 8-2 with a 5.53 ERA.

 

We'll have updates on this when we know more.

DL stints for bad tummy aches.

[SemperFi Sox]

They couldn't just wait a few days to see how he felt? Idiotic.

[a700hitter]

They couldn't just wait a few days to see how he felt? Idiotic.

They had 4 more days to wait and the DL could have been retroactive. He over-did the Ibuprofen and probably gave himself the beginnings of an ulscer. get him on some tagamet or other strong acid blocker and run his ass out there. Another pampered wuss.

 

Mommy, my tummy hurts. You'll be okay son. Now get your books and I'll drive you to school since you aren't feeling too well. I guess she would have social services investigating her today.

[jung]

Man I can't believe this move. Clay has been on a hot pitching streak and this team needs to win games.

[SemperFi Sox]

Man I can't believe this move. Clay has been on a hot pitching streak and this team needs to win games.

 

His last start put an end to his 'hot streak'

[redsoxfan3]

The Red Sox will face interesting positions once all four of their left-handed hitting outfielders are back in action. Things could get interesting with Scott Podsednik, who could be a trade candidate if Daniel Nava is still hot. The Reds are one team that could be in the mix as they seek a leadoff hitter.

 

There has been a lot of talk about Scott Podsednik being used as a trade chip but Cody Ross and Daniel Nava could also be made available by the Red Sox.

 

Interesting find from MLBTR. We all know a couple OF's have to go, especially with CC and Ells coming back shortly. This is a tough choice. From the sound of things, it looks like Ells, CC, Sweeney, and Kalish are the players that will stick, although I am sure if someone is interested in Sweeney then he is available to be traded. I am not sure if I would rather have Ross or Nava. I have a feeling that we are going to deal Pods and one of Ross or Nava. I am not really sure which one teams would be interested in more, but it is interesting to think about.

[a700hitter]

Interesting find from MLBTR. We all know a couple OF's have to go' date=' especially with CC and Ells coming back shortly. This is a tough choice. From the sound of things, it looks like Ells, CC, Sweeney, and Kalish are the players that will stick, although I am sure if someone is interested in Sweeney then he is available to be traded. I am not sure if I would rather have Ross or Nava. I have a feeling that we are going to deal Pods and one of Ross or Nava. I am not really sure which one teams would be interested in more, but it is interesting to think about.[/quote']I'd send Kalish to AAA. He's not ready yet.

[redsoxfan3]

I'd send Kalish to AAA. He's not ready yet.

 

With Kalish in AAA, that leaves us with CC, Ells, Sweeney, Ross, Pods, D-Mac, and Nava (when CC, Ells, and Sweeney all return). I am assuming that D-Mac gets DFA'd, so that still leaves us with six OF's. If we trade Pods, then that leaves us with CC, Ells, Sweeney, Ross, and Nava. I could deal with an OF that consists of those five. The report did say that Nava and Ross were possible trade chips, so I guess that with Kalish, it depends if one of those two get traded as well.

[BornToRun]

Cc. Ells. Ross/Sweeney.

 

Nava as the 5th.

[a700hitter]

With Kalish in AAA' date=' that leaves us with CC, Ells, Sweeney, Ross, Pods, D-Mac, and Nava (when CC, Ells, and Sweeney all return). I am assuming that D-Mac gets DFA'd, so that still leaves us with six OF's. If we trade Pods, then that leaves us with CC, Ells, Sweeney, Ross, and Nava. I could deal with an OF that consists of those five. The report did say that Nava and Ross were possible trade chips, so I guess that with Kalish, it depends if one of those two get traded as well.[/quote']DFA DMac-- long overdue. DFA Nava and trade him during the 10 day period. his value will never be higher.

 

OF: CC, Ells, Ross/Sweeny, Pods (5th OFer)

[SoxSport]

Like I said, Beckett, Buchholz and Lester have become the Three Pussies.

[BornToRun]

Beckett's pitched fine and is making his next start, buchholz has intestinal bleeding or some s***, and Lester has 3.60 FIP.

[a700hitter]

Beckett's pitched fine and is making his next start' date=' buchholz has intestinal bleeding or some s***, and Lester has 3.60 FIP.[/quote']Did they successfully remove the pea from the princess's mattress?

[Bellhorn04]

With Kalish in AAA' date=' that leaves us with CC, Ells, Sweeney, Ross, Pods, D-Mac, and Nava (when CC, Ells, and Sweeney all return). I am assuming that D-Mac gets DFA'd, so that still leaves us with six OF's. If we trade Pods, then that leaves us with CC, Ells, Sweeney, Ross, and Nava. I could deal with an OF that consists of those five. [b']The report did say that Nava and Ross were possible trade chips[/b], so I guess that with Kalish, it depends if one of those two get traded as well.

 

I don't know which one of those would make me sicker. Nava I can possibly understand, but why in the f*** would they trade Ross? The guy is killing LH pitching. We need his RH power.

[SoxSport]

Actually I like Beckett. He's a big game pitcher. Lester looks out of shape to me. He needs to lose a few pounds. Buchholz looks like the strong wind would blow him over.

 

None of these guys, in my view, throws enough pitches in a quality start. It's a 100 and out. Sometimes less. The toughness ain't there.

[SoxSport]

I don't know which one of those would make me sicker. Nava I can possibly understand' date=' but why in the f*** would they trade Ross? The guy is killing LH pitching. We need his RH power.[/quote']

 

You figure those FO dickheads would think like this. Trading your best outfielders right now.

 

What they should do is trade Youks, wait a bit until Ells comes back, and then trade him for an ace starter before the deadline. They have more than enough decent outfielders now--Ells is expendable.

[ellsburyforMVP]

You figure those FO dickheads would think like this. Trading your best outfielders right now.

 

What they should do is trade Youks, wait a bit until Ells comes back, and then trade him for an ace starter before the deadline. They have more than enough decent outfielders now--Ells is expendable.

 

A guy that would of won the MVP if we made the playoffs last yr is expendable? seriuously?:dunno::dunno:

[seabeachfred]

I'd send Kalish to AAA. He's not ready yet.

 

Kalish has missed a lot of games the past year and a half and some more time at Pawtucket would make him ready for a full time job with us next year. He doesn't need to be jerked off in and out of the lineup. Besides, I don't see how anyone on this board would advocate letting Ross and Nava go. They have been productive and solid. Nava is a switch hitter with two more hits today while Ross has shown that he is tailor made for Fenway. McDonald, the front office's pet, must be sent away and if anyone wants Nava or Ross it would have to be part of a big trade for a big time pitcher like Hamels, assuming he might be available. Even that has a qualification to it. There must be no rent a pitcher for three months. We have to rebuild and right now we do not have the kind of team that can even make the playoffs, let alone go deep into it.

 

If Hamels becomes available we need his name on a new contract or we take our chances in FA this winter.

[SoxSport]

A guy that would of won the MVP if we made the playoffs last yr is expendable? seriuously?:dunno::dunno:

 

...for an ace starter. They have good depth in the OF right now, in case you haven't noticed.

Their weakness is pitching.

[SoxSport]

Kalish has missed a lot of games the past year and a half and some more time at Pawtucket would make him ready for a full time job with us next year. He doesn't need to be jerked off in and out of the lineup. Besides, I don't see how anyone on this board would advocate letting Ross and Nava go. They have been productive and solid. Nava is a switch hitter with two more hits today while Ross has shown that he is tailor made for Fenway. McDonald, the front office's pet, must be sent away and if anyone wants Nava or Ross it would have to be part of a big trade for a big time pitcher like Hamels, assuming he might be available. Even that has a qualification to it. There must be no rent a pitcher for three months. We have to rebuild and right now we do not have the kind of team that can even make the playoffs, let alone go deep into it.

 

If Hamels becomes available we need his name on a new contract or we take our chances in FA this winter.

 

Can't see Hamels leaving Philly. Not while they're paying Pap $13mil to close. And Halladay has some shoulder questions. Hamels will get Cain money.

 

With CC and Ells out, the Sox have had some surprises in the OF. Nava, Ross and Kalish give them enough depth to deal Ellsbury/Boras. That assumes CC is untradeable. The kids are changing the face of the team, and there will shortly be a logjam in the outfield.

[SoxSport]

Reading a story this morning about the plight of the Phillies--a reporter asked Manuel why he took Hamels out the other night for Bastardo with a 3 hit shutout after 7 innings. Bastardo s*** the bed in the 8th and cost the Phillies the game. Manuel's reply: "Bastardo is our 8th inning guy." That says a lot about the state of pitching in baseball. My, how things have changed--for the worse.

[Bellhorn04]

Can't see Hamels leaving Philly. Not while they're paying Pap $13mil to close. And Halladay has some shoulder questions. Hamels will get Cain money.

 

I think you're right. Halladay is on the shelf, Lee has a 5.10 ERA in his last 7 starts. They need Hamels very badly and as you say, they have demonstrated a willingness to pay premier prices.

[jung]

Bastardo is our 8th inning guy...what the hell does that imply. If a guy has a shutout going into the ninth does Paps come in because he is their 9th inning guy? What a ******** way to play baseball. Maybe their continued occupancy of the NLE basement is not that much of a surprise after all. Boy that big closer contract to Paps is sure as hell doing them a lotta' good.

 

It would appear that the biggest mistake the Phils made was thinking that it made sense to spend that much money on a closer when they don't have enough of a team to get them to their closer with a chance to win in the first place.

 

That has been my general line of thinking with regard to big money for closers to begin with. You better have one hell of a team taking you up to the 9th inning if you are going to pay a guy big money just to pitch in the 9th inning.

[Bellhorn04]

Bastardo is our 8th inning guy...what the hell does that imply. If a guy has a shutout going into the ninth does Paps come in because he is their 9th inning guy? What a ******** way to play baseball. Maybe their continued occupancy of the NLE basement is not that much of a surprise after all. Boy that big closer contract to Paps is sure as hell doing them a lotta' good.

 

I think most managers are still leery of a pitcher throwing 125 pitches or more, for health reasons and also, probably, because the number crunchers have shown them how most pitchers lose effectiveness at that point. Hamels was at 111 pitches after 7. Maddon also pulled Price at 112 pitches with 1 run allowed.

[BornToRun]

Reading a story this morning about the plight of the Phillies--a reporter asked Manuel why he took Hamels out the other night for Bastardo with a 3 hit shutout after 7 innings. Bastardo s*** the bed in the 8th and cost the Phillies the game. Manuel's reply: "Bastardo is our 8th inning guy." That says a lot about the state of pitching in baseball. My' date=' how things have changed--for the worse.[/quote']

 

Any idea what Hamels pitch count was?

[jung]

A1 111 if the guy is still going good I think he stays in. More importantly at least from what was posted here the Manual simply stated that Bastardo was brought in because "Bastardo is our 8th inning guy" implying that Hamel's pitch count was not as important as the process Manual had arrived at...Bastardo for the 8 and I guess Paps for the 9th and if that is what Manual is really saying then that is what I find kinda' ridiculous.

 

I tend to want the Manager to make a decision based on how the starter is pitching at that point. Hard to imagine a guy having pitched a good game if his pitch count is around 125 for 7 innings cause that would imply some walks tossed in there and probably a bunch of 3 ball counts as well but clearly you can be pitching a good game and end up at 111 for 7 innings.

 

If the SP was still controlling the opposition offense to the same degree I would have thought it more likely to have brought the SP back out for the 8th but with a very short leash.

 

The way the piece is being presented it sounds more like Manual brings out Bastardo cause Bastardo pitches his 8th innings and that is that.

[Bellhorn04]

A1 111 if the guy is still going good I think he stays in. More importantly at least from what was posted here the Manual simply stated that Bastardo was brought in because "Bastardo is our 8th inning guy" implying that Hamel's pitch count was not as important as the process Manual had arrived at...Bastardo for the 8 and I guess Paps for the 9th and if that is what Manual is really saying then that is what I find kinda' ridiculous.

 

Yeah, I hear ya...to me it sort of sounds like Manual just wasn't interested in getting into a big discussion with whoever asked the question on the whys and wherefores of pitch counts, like we do here...

[FredLynn]

I think you're right. Halladay is on the shelf' date=' Lee has a 5.10 ERA in his last 7 starts. They need Hamels very badly and as you say, they have demonstrated a willingness to pay premier prices.[/quote']

 

I assume that would depend on their budget. Everyone but the Yankees seems to have a budget nowadays. Could be that Hamels is over what the Phillies want to spend.

[SoxSport]

Bastardo is our 8th inning guy...what the hell does that imply. If a guy has a shutout going into the ninth does Paps come in because he is their 9th inning guy? What a ******** way to play baseball. Maybe their continued occupancy of the NLE basement is not that much of a surprise after all. Boy that big closer contract to Paps is sure as hell doing them a lotta' good.

 

 

Agreed. But that's the mindset of most managers these days. They have an 8th inning guy, and then a 9th inning guy. Pretty soon they'll have a 7th inning guy, and then a 6th inning guy...

 

Leyland has cost Verlander two wins this year (in April) doing the same thing--taking out Verlander late, with a lead, when he didn't have to. Valentine has done the same--notably with Doubront. Morales was also taken out an inning too soon.

 

Todays' managers just can't wait to get to the bullpen--to replace their $15million starter

with a bunch of $1million dollar retreads. Risky business.

 

As for Pap, I think that was ownership talking. They simply didn't want to deal with Boras

on Madsen because of the Drew experience. They felt they had to go big with a closer because of their big 3 starters.Good move, as it turned out. I don't think they expected Halladay to go down--nor to have early hitting problems, even without Howard. My guess is they'll be strong 2nd half with Howard and Halladay. They are now 2nd in the league in hitting.