When should the Bard experiment end?

[jacksonianmarch]

Whaddya think?

[a700hitter]

I'd sign Oswalt, and while he is getting ready to pitch, I'd let Bard continue to start. Maybe in that time he gets his s*** together and Buchholz doesn't, or maybe someone gets injured.

[Station 13]

2 more max. If he continues to throw changeups/sinkers like he has, he isn't going to be anything more than a backend guy. There no value in that, there's value in 70 appearances of making hitters peed their pants.

[FredLynn]

How do you start polls here? I can't seem to find the right buttons.

[jacksonianmarch]

start a thread then at the bottom there is a click box to add on a poll. Submit the thread and the poll options come up

[a700hitter]

How do you start polls here? I can't seem to find the right buttons.

When you start a thread, before you sumbit the thread, go to the bottom and you will see the check-offs for submitting a poll. After you submit the thread, it will ask you about the poll you want to post.

[FredLynn]

Thanks to both of you. I was looking for it BEFORE I started a thread.

[mvp 78]

I said through June as that's probably when DiceK/Oswalt would be 100%.

 

It's also a good enough sample size to make a permanent plan for him.

[rhfil]

He needs to get his head on straight. Has cost too many mistakes with stupid plays - throwing the ball to the catcher with two outs instead of getting the easy out at first, balking in the winning run, walking three in the first inning. He is obviously not comfortable out there starting. If I remember correctly he also had problems in the past coming in in pressuse situations. Was only effective coming in with no one on.

[Station 13]

If I remember correctly he also had problems in the past coming in in pressuse situations. Was only effective coming in with no one on.

 

False.

[iortiz]

Let's face it, this can not end in the near future. You need a replacement. D-K is not close to be ready, the last I heard. Oswalt is a mystery.

 

Guy has showed some sparks. Nothing impressive IMO. Hard to say if he is a MLB starter pitcher. This will require more time. We do not have, unless you want to watch POs on Tv.

[Spitball]

Let's face it, this can not end in the near future. You need a replacement. D-K is not close to be ready, the last I heard. Oswalt is a mystery.

 

Guy has showed some sparks. Nothing impressive IMO. Hard to say if he is a MLB starter pitcher. This will require more time. We do not have, unless you want to watch POs on Tv.

 

His strikeouts to walks are trending very poorly at this point as a starter. I would move him back to the pen to see if he can correct the problem. He is a strikeout pitcher who is not missing bats. He recently had start in which there were only four swings and misses.

 

Pitching to soft contact still requires strikeouts also to be successful. Most effective pitchers are not much lower than 6.0/9.

[rhfil]

His record for the last two years as a set-up man is 3 wins and 11 losses. And he has 4 saves out of 16 opportunities. He doesn't seem to be very effective any time he comes in.

[Dojji]

You can't judge a setup man based on his save rate. They get the blame for blown saves but only get holds when they preserve the lead. If a man only blows 12 leads in 2 years that's NTFB.

[Dojji]

Hard to say if he is a MLB starter pitcher.

 

No it isn't. He's yards ahead of what most teams have in the #5 spot. He's not consistent, but that doesn't mean he isn't good.

[iortiz]

No it isn't. He's yards ahead of what most teams have in the #5 spot. He's not consistent' date=' but that doesn't mean he isn't good.[/quote']

 

Didn't know that that the experiment were for a the 5th spot... I need to see a lot more.

[Whatsinaname]

Just don't trust Padilla. Would prefer Bard in the 8th.

[Dojji]

Didn't know that that the experiment were for a the 5th spot... I need to see a lot more.

 

Right now it's a 5th spot. You don't put Bard in the rotation for what he's going to do the first year he's there. If other people aren't performing, that's on them. You can't slot Bard up further at this time because he's probably not going to finish the year in the rotation.

[JohnGreen2004]

He needs to get his head on straight. Has cost too many mistakes with stupid plays - throwing the ball to the catcher with two outs instead of getting the easy out at first' date=' balking in the winning run, walking three in the first inning. He is obviously not comfortable out there starting. If I remember correctly he also had problems in the past coming in in pressuse situations. Was only effective coming in with no one on.[/quote']

 

That's just not correct. Bard was Tito's "fireman" over the last couple years. I'm pretty sure it has more to do with the drop in velocity, causing him to lose confidence in his fastball. I did a piece on that issue yesterday. Don't think it has to do with pressure situations.

 

There were times when he gave up the go ahead run but it was mostly a product of being used only in those situations. He was bound to give up hits, couldn't be perfect every time he stepped on with RISP.

[FredLynn]

That's just not correct. Bard was Tito's "fireman" over the last couple years. I'm pretty sure it has more to do with the drop in velocity, causing him to lose confidence in his fastball. I did a piece on that issue yesterday. Don't think it has to do with pressure situations.

 

There were times when he gave up the go ahead run but it was mostly a product of being used only in those situations. He was bound to give up hits, couldn't be perfect every time he stepped on with RISP.

 

Nice to see that the local Boston press is paying attention to Sox boards like TalkSox. I have known for years that you guys get some of your material from us

[Rdsxmbnt]

The experiment ends when one of Matsuzaka/Cook/Oswalt? is ready to effectively take over. That said based on the trend so far it seems the experiment should end, he just doesn't have the stamina to remain a starter. The evidence on sosh I was reading is particularily damning, mainly the huge decreasing trend in velocity and lack of consistent mechanics. He's a good #4/5 SP on a good team but his value is certainly is best utilized in the bullpen.

[SoxFanForsyth]

He's the best thing the Red Sox have in terms of a #5 SP right now. Having said that, if the Sox go out and sign Oswalt, you put Bard back in the bullpen. Oswalt will be ready to throw sometime in June from what I've heard, so I said Through June. Even if Oswalt isn't signed by the Sox, you go to DiceK.

 

Bard's innings limit should be about 130-140 IP this year. That's doubling his innings from last year. Another 5 starts will put him right around 75 IP. Then you throw him in the bullpen the rest of the year. Even if you want to stick with him as a SP next season, you still cap his innings. And it's not a cap on SP innings, it's a cap on total innings. You don't just scrap the guy in early August when he's reached 135 IP. You put him into the bullpen where he can come out for 40-45 games out of the pen as well.

 

By the way, he's lost a lot of velocity and seems to be throwing on the side of the ball rather than on top of the ball. That's worrisome. Gets a bit more movement, but he's a flamethrower, not a Greg Maddux.

[Bloodsox0]

As soon as possible, as we seen two nights ago we lost a great closer, why lose a great set up man when he is still healthy and available? Bring up whoever until Dice K, or leave Bard as starter until Dice comes back.

[Dojji]

Because of course, there's absolutely no solution at all to our bullpe issues that doesn't involve specifically putting Bard back there.

 

Admit it. People wouldn't fixate on the Bard to the pen issue in particular if it wasn't for the fact that they are used to thinking of him as a reliever. It's not about fixing the bullpen (which has been OK for the most part) nearly as much as it is about reestablishing the comfort zone.

[a700hitter]

Admit it. People wouldn't fixate on the Bard to the pen issue in particular if it wasn't for the fact that they are used to thinking of him as a reliever.

And your point is...?