Josh Beckett

[Cairns_Sox]

Mods, I understand there is a Offseason thread but I wanted to raise this issue and get everyone's opinion. If u need to merge it feel free.

 

With all the "allegations" going around lately, particulary the one's with Josh Beckett's name in them and let's face it - there is a few. Is there any way this guy is not shopped around in the off season? I understand he had a good year and is probably our best starter but all of these "allegations" happened on his watch as he is the leader of the pitching staff and it clearly sound like Lester and Lackey followed him like sheep.

 

His attitude stinks in my opinion, he gained weight during the year and apparently stopped caring when he was out of the Cy Young race. His contract isn't that bad and every team wants starting pitching. Surely he can't survive this?

[Gringo]

His trade value is still pretty high. If he's the ringleader of the circus, then for the sake of every younger pitcher, he should be traded. How about Beckett and Ellsbury to Tampa for Price, Moore, and Jennings?

 

[Cairns_Sox]

His trade value is still pretty high. If he's the ringleader of the circus, then for the sake of every younger pitcher, he should be traded. How about Beckett and Ellsbury to Tampa for Price, Moore, and Jennings?

 

 

If the rumors at true, there is no way this guy survives this. I mean the manager who was responsible for the players is gone. The GM who put this team together is gone. Surely if Beckett is the ringleader and the problem in the clubhouse he is next.

[Palodios]

Apparently Beckett has been a lazy teammate since his days in Florida in 2003. He also has some nice jewelery. I think if someone is willing to give a Jimeniz haul for him, it may be worth considering, but this staff just has too many holes to give up a big piece.

[Cairns_Sox]

Apparently Beckett has been a lazy teammate since his days in Florida in 2003. He also has some nice jewelery. I think if someone is willing to give a Jimeniz haul for him' date=' it may be worth considering, but this staff just has too many holes to give up a big piece.[/quote']

 

How can he come back here IF all that is being reported is true? So If he drops out of the Cy Young race next year do we have a repeat of this year?Let's be honest the Red Sox organization is bigger then Josh Beckett.

[Muggah]

Mods, I understand there is a Offseason thread but I wanted to raise this issue and get everyone's opinion. If u need to merge it feel free.

 

With all the "allegations" going around lately, particulary the one's with Josh Beckett's name in them and let's face it - there is a few. Is there any way this guy is not shopped around in the off season? I understand he had a good year and is probably our best starter but all of these "allegations" happened on his watch as he is the leader of the pitching staff and it clearly sound like Lester and Lackey followed him like sheep.

 

His attitude stinks in my opinion, he gained weight during the year and apparently stopped caring when he was out of the Cy Young race. His contract isn't that bad and every team wants starting pitching. Surely he can't survive this?

 

IMO, the whole situation with Beckett is a ticking timebomb. He's always fancied himself a straight shooter when it comes to the media, as well as a maverick, cowboy, tough talking Texan...whatever when it comes to answering questions about anything. That said, if he's still here I'm sure that every possible step will be taken by new management (whoever it is) to smooth things over and present him as 'repentant,' understanding and on-board with new policy, etc., but that's only going to go so far. Eventually Beckett's still going to have to confront the hostile media and fanbase that will be waylaying and salivating in FLA come ST. IMO, that's a powder keg with the fuse already lit.

 

The Sox will be debuting their new facility in FLA, as well as kicking off their centennial at Fenway. I can't imagine them allowing their sure-to-be over-the-top marketing blitz for the 2012 season being ruined before it even gets started by the mud-slinging circus that's sure to occur if Beckett, and for that matter Lackey, are still on the roster. Their presence is almost certain to create a toxic climate to start the season.

 

For those reasons, I think they'll make every effort to move both. Now, whether or not they can be successful in doing so is another matter entirely.

[Palodios]

How can he come back here IF all that is being reported is true? So If he drops out of the Cy Young race next year do we have a repeat of this year?Let's be honest the Red Sox organization is bigger then Josh Beckett.

 

So your starting rotation is fat-Lester, a Buchholz who missed most of the season, the worst pitcher in baseball, and then some combination of Wakefield/Miller/Weiland?

 

The solution to this problem is simple. Take Lester aside, and let him know that he is the leader of the rotation. Give him the game 1 start. This is not Beckett's team anymore. Until 2011, Lester has always appeared to be a very hard worker. The last several years, he has been the first to show up at Ft. Myers, and the Red Sox coaches have said very warm and glowing things about him.

[Cairns_Sox]

So your starting rotation is fat-Lester, a Buchholz who missed most of the season, the worst pitcher in baseball, and then some combination of Wakefield/Miller/Weiland?

 

The solution to this problem is simple. Take Lester aside, and let him know that he is the leader of the rotation. Give him the game 1 start. This is not Beckett's team anymore. Until 2011, Lester has always appeared to be a very hard worker. The last several years, he has been the first to show up at Ft. Myers, and the Red Sox coaches have said very warm and glowing things about him.

 

1) Trading Josh Beckett will be able to land you a decent starter.

 

2) You think that fixes the issue? I respect your opinion but I don't think Beckett responds to that very well.

[SoxSport]

I say nuts to trading Beckett. He was their best pitcher last year--and had a good year.

He was one of those who looked like he got in shape in spring training.

 

Maybe he does have a conditioning/dedication problem. That might explain his on-off years.

But that's really a management problem. The team is supposed to keep these guys in line.

They are being payed a king's ransom to play a kid's game.

 

No, they can't trade Beckett. No 1 starters do not grow on trees. Besides, he's a helluva good competitor

when he wants to be. Look at his World Series record.

 

You don't trade guys like that--he isn't replaceable.

[Palodios]

1) Trading Josh Beckett will be able to land you a decent starter.

 

2) You think that fixes the issue? I respect your opinion but I don't think Beckett responds to that very well.

 

I'm not talking about fixing Beckett. Beckett is going to do his own thing. I am talking about how the rest of the rotation responds, and they are going to need to listen to Lester, not Beckett.

[Reck]

This is what a mentldown of historic proportion will do to you. It seems no one wants part of Boston right now. Tito is gone. Theo is gone and Ortiz doesn't sound too thrill to come back either and on top of that you have Beckett acting like a teenager. Wow this is some kind of mess.

 

Beckett saying Baseball is not his priority says alot. His mind is not on the task at hand.

 

If I'm the FO I would start cleaning house. I'd start by eating up Lackey's contract and revamp the whole pitching rotation. Start fresh.

 

And so what if this takes you 5 years to be good again. I'd take that then have a disfunctional team and be a 50-60 game winner every year.

 

I'm ashamed as a Red Sox fan that it got to this point. The owner has got to be more involve in things. In part Henry and comp, are to blame for this debacle.

[Reck]

 

You don't trade guys like that--he isn't replaceable.

 

 

Wow fail. Everyone is replaceable. No one is untouch in sports.

[Gringo]

I say nuts to trading Beckett. He was their best pitcher last year--and had a good year.

He was one of those who looked like he got in shape in spring training.

 

Maybe he does have a conditioning/dedication problem. That might explain his on-off years.

But that's really a management problem. The team is supposed to keep these guys in line.

They are being payed a king's ransom to play a kid's game.

 

No, they can't trade Beckett. No 1 starters do not grow on trees. Besides, he's a helluva good competitor

when he wants to be. Look at his World Series record.

 

You don't trade guys like that--he isn't replaceable.

 

Beckett is replaceable, it just depends who you get....

[FredLynn]

So your starting rotation is fat-Lester, a Buchholz who missed most of the season, the worst pitcher in baseball, and then some combination of Wakefield/Miller/Weiland?

 

The solution to this problem is simple. Take Lester aside, and let him know that he is the leader of the rotation. Give him the game 1 start. This is not Beckett's team anymore. Until 2011, Lester has always appeared to be a very hard worker. The last several years, he has been the first to show up at Ft. Myers, and the Red Sox coaches have said very warm and glowing things about him.

 

If we can get someone who will help us in the future, especially a young SP with promise, I trade Beckett in a heartbeat. He is front and center in the clubhouse chaos. I don't really care who our SP are for 2012. We are not going to win a ring next year. Before we can construct a winner we have to demolish a large part of the current team. Fortunately, that is well under way with the departure of Francona and Epstein. That had to happen before any of the players could be changed. Now we can move forward and get rid of the deadwood on this team.

[redsoxrules]

WOW, some people are way over board .

 

with the right moves this team can definately compete for the WS next year .

[ORS]

WOW, some people are way over board .

 

with the right moves this team can definately compete for the WS next year .

No, the sky is falling. Take cover.

 

Of course, you are absolutely right. However, it will be interesting. It's not just a matter of making the right player acquisitions this offseason. They also need to address the clubhouse culture, which should be priority #1 IMO. Just having the current talent under contract onboard and committed makes them a contender. Addressing the closer, some other BP arms, the back end of the rotation, and the 3B/C/DH combination can come later in the offseason.

[Soxfan1]

After reading the Ortiz article, I'm starting to think all this beer, fried chicken, and video games is being blown out of proportion

[Cairns_Sox]

WOW, some people are way over board .

 

with the right moves this team can definately compete for the WS next year .

 

What moves? So you truly believe Josh Beckett deserves to be wearing the Red Sox uniform next season. With all this speculation going around you want to bring him back? The leader of this pitching staff with young guys like Lester and Bucholz. The guy that was running the circus and you want to bring him back next season?

[redsoxrules]

What moves? So you truly believe Josh Beckett deserves to be wearing the Red Sox uniform next season. With all this speculation going around you want to bring him back? The leader of this pitching staff with young guys like Lester and Bucholz. The guy that was running the circus and you want to bring him back next season?

 

If Josh Beckett puts up similar numbers next year than he did this year , then yes he should stay on the team .

 

If he's a problem in the club house then fix that issue.

[Palodios]

What moves? So you truly believe Josh Beckett deserves to be wearing the Red Sox uniform next season. With all this speculation going around you want to bring him back? The leader of this pitching staff with young guys like Lester and Bucholz. The guy that was running the circus and you want to bring him back next season?

 

Lester has been the ace of this staff for three years now. He should be a leader in this clubhouse-- not a young guy who needs direction.

[TylerD]

What moves? So you truly believe Josh Beckett deserves to be wearing the Red Sox uniform next season. With all this speculation going around you want to bring him back? The leader of this pitching staff with young guys like Lester and Bucholz. The guy that was running the circus and you want to bring him back next season?

Whether josh comes back or not I still think this team has to many weapons not to be good. some ppl r making out like were going to be terrible. Im not saying we will be great but with another wild card being added I see this team at least making the playoffs. And we all know that's what counts. Anything can happen in the playoffs.

[SoxSport]

After reading the Ortiz article' date=' I'm starting to think all this beer, fried chicken, and video games is being blown out of proportion[/quote']

 

Ditto. Also, the stuff about Tito's pills and personal life.

 

The questions about conditioning, however, are much more serious--and the manager is accountable for this.

 

We really are talking about the team's performance the last 3 years. Especially the last two years. Clearly, the team had gone soft on conditioning--from all the injuries. And the GM, Epstein, had done a poor job the last two years in FA signings. Lucchino et al were smart enough to see that changes were needed. Theo and Tito got the message it was time for a change. It's a good thing for Theo the Cubs were around.

[FredLynn]

WOW, some people are way over board .

 

with the right moves this team can definately compete for the WS next year .

 

Justify that. What realistic moves could be made to make us competitive for a WS ring next year. I don't see it. Too much deadwood, too many bad contracts, and not enough talented starting pitching in the FA market this year.

[FredLynn]

Lester has been the ace of this staff for three years now. He should be a leader in this clubhouse-- not a young guy who needs direction.

 

That is not factually correct. Beckett was the ace of the staff this year, if we had an ace.

Beckett: 13-7, 2.89

Lester: 15-9, 3.47

[Palodios]

That is not factually correct. Beckett was the ace of the staff this year, if we had an ace.

Beckett: 13-7, 2.89

Lester: 15-9, 3.47

 

And Buchholz was better than Lester the year before. Just because someone has a good year doesn't make them an ace. Lester has been the rock at the top of the rotation for several years consecutively.

[iMagic10]

Trade this overrated pitcher out of here.

 

Can we just go for Lincecum?

[FredLynn]

And Buchholz was better than Lester the year before. Just because someone has a good year doesn't make them an ace. Lester has been the rock at the top of the rotation for several years consecutively.

 

Wikipedia defines ace as follows:

 

In baseball, an ace is the best starting pitcher of any team

 

THIS YEAR, statistically, Beckett was much better than Lester. I would consider Beckett to have been our ace this year, though I don't regard either guy as a top tier pitcher in the class of Sabathia or Verlander or a few others. Those are the guys we need to take the pressure off Beckett and Lester.

[Palodios]

Wikipedia defines ace as follows:

 

In baseball, an ace is the best starting pitcher of any team

 

THIS YEAR, statistically, Beckett was much better than Lester. I would consider Beckett to have been our ace this year, though I don't regard either guy as a top tier pitcher in the class of Sabathia or Verlander or a few others. Those are the guys we need to take the pressure off Beckett and Lester.

 

That definition doesn't addend "THIS YEAR" on it. It just says "best starting pitcher of a team". As if... it were talking about a player, in entirety without sample sizes, and in the big picture.

 

Beckett has a career 3.84 ERA. Lester has a career 3.54 ERA, all of which in the AL East. I could throw out a hundred more statistics, but Lester is the better pitcher.

[Elktonnick]

Pumpsie, Talent wise the guys are as good as anyone. The problem is attitude,desire and proper coaching. Given those they could be as good as advertised. That being said Beckett's attidude and his behavior make him Personna Non Grata in Boston. This means he must go.

[3rdManOut]

Trade this overrated pitcher out of here.

 

Can we just go for Lincecum?

 

I dont know if the Giants would be so quick to want to let him go.