2011 - 2012 Offseason Thread

[User Name]

It's just Cash being Cash

 

Yeah, he was a pretty good backup catcher.

[jacksonianmarch]

I am not sure why the Pirates hold up is Jones. He's 30 yrs old and looks the part of a platoon DH rather than an NL 1b. If you are rebuilding, you could find someone younger to give you the same marginal production out of your 1b slot. I think the hold up as with anything Pirates, is money. The Yanks and Pirates have had good working relationships, but the problem is the Pirates always seem to get the upper hand. The big one to remember was the Marte and Nady deals. We get a good half season from Nady and all we get out of 4 yrs of Marte is a solid run in the 09 postseason. And they get Karstens, McCutchen, Ohlendorf, and Tabata. I think the deal actually gets done. It makes too much sense for both sides not to. The Yankees need someone to take the LH portion of the platoon at DH and the Pirates can use a starter on the cheap poised for a rebound in the NL. THey then can sell Burnett at midseason, when he typically has an ERA under 4 and looks like a solid contributor.

[jacksonianmarch]

More traction today on a Burnett trade. Sounds like they're only a few million apart. I had thought coming into this offseason that Burnett could turn it around, especially since shortening his motion with Rothschild in August. He really responded in September and his one start in October. But right now, he's the most expensive guy in a three player race for the #5 spot. And, he doesnt have anything going for him aside from pure stuff. Garcia outpitched him last season and Hughes has the better potential, assuming he's healthy.

[Meh]

Pirates agreed to take on 10 million with AJ's contract. Yankees seeking for them to pick up about 16 million and send an ok prospect back. According to https://twitter.com/#!/JonHeymanCBS

[Palodios]

The pirates can't afford to hold onto their own players, and yet they're willing to take on 10 million dollars for one of the worst pitchers in the American League? Seriously, contract them out of the league, they're a joke.

[RedSoxfanforlife305]

^This.

[Meh]

Pirates fans seem to agree on they'd give Cashman three options, 10 million and Bryan Morris, 14 million and victor black or 16.5(50/50 split) and Andrew Lambo. I think I'd just go for the Lambo package just due to money and maybe you hit gold with a busted prospect or maybe you get just that a busted prospect.

[User Name]

And what Pirates fans think matters because?

[Meh]

It doesn't im just throwing it out there. I couldn't believe they were actually excited about getting AJ either.

[Station 13]

http://cdn1.sbnation.com/imported_assets/979740/120767914_medium.jpg

 

Somebody please explain this.....

[RedSoxfanforlife305]

Ostrich looking ****.

[jacksonianmarch]

I actually think it'd be smart. Here's why. Burnett looked good after an adjustment by Rothschild in late August. He also always seems to have good numbers through the ASB. If he puts up his usual solid start to the season, and are only on the hook for $10 mil of his salary, then he's easily flippable at te deadline. They'd invest about $3 mil and be able to get something good for him

[Meh]

Dumping AJ looks more realistic each day. MLB Radio said the Royals are now expressing interest, they could be one of the 4 teams interested. I think the White Sox could be as well. The key is next year we'll have one SP under contract, CC. Then guys who are under team control like Pineda, Nova, Hughes and then Banuelos and Betances who will each have another year of developement under their belts. They'll have about 128 million in contracts next year, but will probably resign Mo and maybe Swisher. Raises to Gardner, Robertson, Hughes, Joba, Cervelli and Logan as well. They is also the slim to none chance Soriano opts out of his contract in a weaker closer market assuming he has a good year.

[jacksonianmarch]

There is actually a market for a guy who can throw 180+IP and take the bump nearly 30 times a season. Plus, if you look at his numbers between 2011 and 2009, and he looks like almost the same pitcher.

 

2009- 8.5K/9IP, 1.40WHIP, 2.0K/BB

2011- 8.2K/9IP, 1.43WHIP, 2.1K/BB

 

And in 2009, he was considered a good pitcher. The only big differences between the two seasons were the IP per start and the HR totals, which were much higher this past yr. If you remove him from the AL East and put him in the NL Central, he's probably a 200IP pitcher with an ERA close to 4. That will get you some nice trade chips

[Palodios]

There is actually a market for a guy who can throw 180+IP and take the bump nearly 30 times a season. Plus, if you look at his numbers between 2011 and 2009, and he looks like almost the same pitcher.

 

2009- 8.5K/9IP, 1.40WHIP, 2.0K/BB

2011- 8.2K/9IP, 1.43WHIP, 2.1K/BB

 

And in 2009, he was considered a good pitcher. The only big differences between the two seasons were the IP per start and the HR totals, which were much higher this past yr. If you remove him from the AL East and put him in the NL Central, he's probably a 200IP pitcher with an ERA close to 4. That will get you some nice trade chips

 

The last two years, Burnett was 10-15 and 11-11. If the best lineup in the majors, and an elite bullpen loses him 11 and 15 games, how on earth do the Pirates think it will happen? If they want a guy who pitches to a low 5 ERA in the AL East who eats innings, Wakefield is still a free agent, and cheap I hear.

[jacksonianmarch]

Wake doesnt give innings and isnt healthy. He also doesnt throw 95 with a wicked curve. Burnett in a weak division without the DH will likely put up a low 4's ERA and 200IP.

[Palodios]

Wake doesnt give innings and isnt healthy. He also doesnt throw 95 with a wicked curve. Burnett in a weak division without the DH will likely put up a low 4's ERA and 200IP.

 

Pitcher A had a 5.12 ERA with a 1.36 WHIP, and pitched 5.89 innings per start in the AL East.

Pitcher B had a 5.15 ERA with a 1.43 WHIP, and pitched 5.96 innings per start in the AL East.

[User Name]

Pitcher A has averaged 135 IP the last three years.

 

Pitcher B has averaged 195 IP the last three years.

 

That is Jacksonian's main point of contention, and he is unequivocally correct.

 

Also, Burnett's stuff would allow him to fare much better in the NL Central. Wake's health wouldn't improve going from the AL to the NL nor would the aging stop.

[Palodios]

Pitcher A has averaged 135 IP the last three years.

 

Pitcher B has averaged 195 IP the last three years.

 

That is Jacksonian's main point of contention, and he is unequivocally correct.

 

Also, Burnett's stuff would allow him to fare much better in the NL Central. Wake's health wouldn't improve going from the AL to the NL nor would the aging stop.

 

Wakefield has averaged 135 innings because he hasn't been a full-fledged starter the last few years, because he hasn't been good enough to be a full-fledged starter. That's the point-- that both of these guys suck.

[User Name]

Wakefield has averaged 135 innings because he hasn't been a full-fledged starter the last few years' date=' because he hasn't been good enough to be a full-fledged starter. That's the point-- that both of these guys suck.[/quote']

 

Burnett is just two years removed from a decent season. He's healthy, and his main problem the last two years has been a combination of homer-proneness and wildness. Part of that can be attributed to NYS. Since he still has good stuff it's not surprising a team is willing to take a chance on him if the Yanks absorb most of the money.

 

Make no mistake, if Pit trades for him, they're looking to keep him for half a season, let him rebuild value and flip him to a desperate contender at the TDL.

[jacksonianmarch]

UN nails it.

[Meh]

Jon Heyman @JonHeymanCBS Yankees/Guardians talk revolves around aj and travis hafner. cleve unsure it would do that swap. yanks also don't mind the FA DH options

 

AJ for Hafner? Honestly I know Hafner will handcuff us since he can't play the field but can Ibanez and Damon still? Even if they do will they be even below average out there? I'd do a Hafner for AJ swamp.

[Meh]

Sherman reported on XM radio that rumors more players are in the deal, maybe Cervelli?, along with AJ and Cash for better prospects.

 

 

Cervelli plays with a lot of fire, but as a backup catcher he can be replaced easily with Romine.

[jacksonianmarch]

If Cervelli got enough PT and could pin down his throwing inaccuracies, he could be a solid average big league catcher. He's got a cannon and he is adept as blocking and calling games. He is just inaccurate from behind the dish. I think we need to move Cervelli anyway. Romine is ready, and no better way to groom him than to see what it is like at the big league level for a full season. Romine and Martin are very similar, IMO, and I think the kid could learn something from the veteran. I do think, eventually, Romine could be a good starting catcher

[Meh]

idk if I'd hand Romine the job at the start of ST, assuming if we trade Frankie I'd try to sign a f/a backstop to a minor league deal ASAP, even before going for Chavez

[jacksonianmarch]

Why not? Your backup catcher gets what, 40 starts a year? Romine is not a step down defensively at all, which is what most backup catchers are, defensive replacements. I think Romine would do a good job and can learn on the job. Who knows, it may give the Yankees a reason to let Martin walk at yrs end and hand the job over if the kid does well enough. If he doesnt, then they resign Martin until Sanchez is ready in 2-3 yrs

[Meh]

idk I'd rather let a kid like Romine have to fight for that spot than just hand it to him, he hasn't played too much about Double-A too.

 

In other news AJ axed a trade to the Angels.

 

According to Wallace Matthews of ESPN, AJ Burnett has used his partial No Trade Clause to stop a trade to the Angels which would have brought Bobby Abreu back to the Yankees.

 

The Yankees attempted to "sell" the Angels to Burnett by telling Burnett he would be the Angels #5 starter, but Burnett still said no.

espn.go.com/blog/new-york/yankees/

[Divinity]

According to tweets by Jim Bowden, whom ESPN shares with XM-Sirius, AJ will be traded will be within the next 24 hours. Bowden tweets:

 

"NYY-PGH close to finalizing deal w/ Burnett.should get done in next 24 hours according to source;NYY weighing one last offer from other team."

 

He later tweeted:

 

"Pirates still working through the details at their end this hour NYY weighing one last proposal at their end this hour...tick tock tick tock"

 

Adios AJ

 

http://a.espncdn.com/combiner/i?img=/photo/2011/0810/espnNY_g_d1_burnett_576.jpg

[jacksonianmarch]

You know what, I don't hate AJ. He had a solid 2009 campaign and his peripherals in 2011 were similar to that season. He is what he is. A guy with amazing stuff who is a world beater when on, but too hot and cold to be relied upon for a championship caliber team.

[jacksonianmarch]

BTW, sounds like the deal gets finalized by end of business tomorrow. The Yankees may receive up to $15 mil in salary relief plus prospects. If this works, then Cashman should be lauded