2011-2012 Offseason Thread

[SoxSport]

I think it is becoming obvious that the Red Sox have no interest in Oswalt.

 

Oswalt has become too picky on where he wants to pitch. And he probably wants too much money. Aside from his back issues, I don't think he was the same pitcher in Philly as Houston. Has lost some of his heat with age.

[Elktonnick]

Oswalt has become too picky on where he wants to pitch. And he probably wants too much money. Aside from his back issues' date=' I don't think he was the same pitcher in Philly as Houston. Has lost some of his heat with age.[/quote']

 

Oswalt must think he is the greatest since Cy Young. Maybe his attitude will change come April if he is not signed.

[iortiz]

...mmmm The guy had announced his retirement, hadn't he?. I don't got it.

[Muggah]

Please Palodios' date=' not a multi-year contract. What if he suddenly goes into a funk and has a rotten year (a possibility because he had three rotten half-years in a row back in 2008-2010)? We're not only stuck with him for another season but Ryan Lavarnway is blocked indefinately. To me that is absolutely stupid to the core; he is our best RH power prospect and you cannot to waste young talent like that. Besides, after this year he comes off the books with Dice K and a couple of others and we have some potential money freed up for players who can help us. With more inter-league games scheduled in 2013 do we want this guy in the lineup at f irst base and risk Gonzales in the OF? You know damn well Diva will not be content to be sitting on the bench in those games. A morale problem might develop if he was forced to sit. One year and out . Besides, he is no longer Big Papi, team leader and clutch performer. He has become a very selfish player and a big prima donna.[/quote']

 

Big Diva is arguably the biggest clubhouse problem they have, Fred. No way do we want this guy around for another year after this. It was a huge mistake to even offer him arbitration this year. People shouldn't let themselves be fooled by this guy. IMO the rumpswabs have been bending over backwards for years making excuses for this guy. In fact, I'll go as far as to predict that after Big Diva is finally gone the stuff we're going to hear about him is going to end up making Manny Ramirez look like a choir boy next to him. Enough already. One year---that's IT!!!!

[Elktonnick]

Big Diva is arguably the biggest clubhouse problem they have' date=' Fred. No way do we want this guy around for another year after this. It was a huge mistake to even offer him arbitration this year. People shouldn't let themselves be fooled by this guy. IMO the rumpswabs have been bending over backwards for years making excuses for this guy. In fact, I'll go as far as to predict that after Big Diva is finally gone the stuff we're going to hear about him is going to end up making Manny Ramirez look like a choir boy next to him. Enough already. One year---that's IT!!!![/quote']

 

I think that there is a growing sentiment among Boston sportwriters that Ortiz is more a part of the problem than part of the solution.

[User Name]

I love how the importance of sportswriter's opinions wildly varies from subject to subject depending on the positive or negative impact on the arguments of posters.

 

Consistency plz.

[jung]

Holy smokes guys! Did I miss a bunch of stuff today?

 

Did Ortiz do something else in the last few days that has endeared us to him even further (ha ha ha).

 

Dis Oswalt announce retirement? I think I remember somebody reporting that Oswalt was not ruling out retirement. I think that is about three or four weeks old now.

[Elktonnick]

Holy smokes guys! Did I miss a bunch of stuff today?

 

Did Ortiz do something else in the last few days that has endeared us to him even further (ha ha ha).

 

Dis Oswalt announce retirement? I think I remember somebody reporting that Oswalt was not ruling out retirement. I think that is about three or four weeks old now.

 

It wasn't posted here but Felger and Mazz got off the Patriots long enough today to say something to the effect that Beckett and Ortiz were at the center of the cultural problem on the team which needed to be addressed.

[FredLynn]

I think it is becoming obvious that the Red Sox have no interest in Oswalt.

 

Or perhaps the reverse is true. My guess is that Oswalt could very well retire rather than pitch here for the Red Sox.

[jung]

Thanks folks.

[FredLynn]

I love how the importance of sportswriter's opinions wildly varies from subject to subject depending on the positive or negative impact on the arguments of posters.

 

Consistency plz.

 

It is a well known fact that some of the sports writers and radio hosts get some of their material from us. And frankly, its getting old. Muggah and I have been considering patenting our stuff so that its not stolen and reproduced for free on a regular basis.

[User Name]

It is a well known fact that some of the sports writers and radio hosts get some of their material from us. And frankly' date=' its getting old. Muggah and I have been considering patenting our stuff so that its not stolen and reproduced for free on a regular basis.[/quote']

 

You know what? I probably need to start patenting my stuff too!

[FredLynn]

You know what? I probably need to start patenting my stuff too!

 

I am not sure that will be possible if your application to become the GM is accepted.

[User Name]

I am not sure that will be possible if your application to become the GM is accepted.

 

Good point. They were very pleased with the low-carb diet for Silva idea. I also suggested putting a "Handle with Care" sticker on Cook, but that wasn't as well-received.

[VA Sox Fan]

;]Big Diva is arguably the biggest clubhouse problem they have[/b]' date=' Fred. No way do we want this guy around for another year after this. It was a huge mistake to even offer him arbitration this year. People shouldn't let themselves be fooled by this guy. IMO the rumpswabs have been bending over backwards for years making excuses for this guy. In fact, I'll go as far as to predict that after Big Diva is finally gone the stuff we're going to hear about him is going to end up making Manny Ramirez look like a choir boy next to him. Enough already. One year---that's IT!!!![/quote']

 

Why is this the only place I've heard such complaints? You guys constantly crap on Ortiz. I do not get it. Any credible links or articles about him being such a problem? No one is perfect by far, but I am baffled.

[jung]

Well the Felger and Maz stuff sounds like it was part of a longer discussion. I am going to have to try to catch their nightly repeat. Not sure what time that comes on. Watching the hockey game but will try to catch them if I can.

[User Name]

Mazz is a sensationalist douchebag. I'd like to see Felger's stance on it though.

[FredLynn]

Why is this the only place I've heard such complaints? You guys constantly crap on Ortiz. I do not get it. Any credible links or articles about him being such a problem? No one is perfect by far' date=' but I am baffled.[/quote']

 

I recall one story on him where he barged in on a Francona news conference and complained about being out of the lineup and being therefore unable to pad his stats. Maybe stuff like that has something to do with it.

[User Name]

I've heard and read a lot of opinions saying the incident was "overblown" and that Ortiz wasn't seriously complaining. Goes both ways.

[Elktonnick]

Why is this the only place I've heard such complaints? You guys constantly crap on Ortiz. I do not get it. Any credible links or articles about him being such a problem? No one is perfect by far' date=' but I am baffled.[/quote']

 

If you have Direct TV and the sports package you can get the Boston sports channels NESN and CSNE. Dennis & Callahaan are simulcast on NESN in the AM and Felger and Mazz on CSNE in the aftternoon. MUt & Merloni also on WEEI aren't simulcast. In any case there has been ample commentary on these sport radio shows about the Red Sox clubhouse issues. THis PM Felger and Mazz mainly focused on Beckett but made the negative comment about Ortiz. I think a lot of it stems from his interrupting Francona's news conference last year and his pouting over his contract among other things. Hence some have begun to call him Big Diva because of his apparent prima donna attitude. Anyway that's my take for what it's worth

[seabeachfred]

So wait.....2010 was a rotten year for Ortiz? He hit for an .899 OPS with 32 HR. That is most MLB player's career year.

 

Let's not get carried away here because of personal (and usually conjecture-based) judgements about Ortiz.

 

He was a bargain for the Red Sox for years on end, and now that he's trying to get paid (deservedly so) he gets showered with insults from the team's "fans".

 

About the "no longer clutch" point: Ortiz has had OPS's with men on of 1.008 , .934 and .810 in 2011, 2010 and 2009 (his sub .800 OPS season).

 

 

 

Jesus, no wonder Oswalt doesn't wanna pitch here.

 

I guess you like to hear the words of your writing in print because you conveniently bypassed or forgot most of what I wrote. The clutch thing was only in passing and the fact is he is not the great clutch performer he once was and I don't expect him or anyone else to keep that kind of pace up the way he did his first five years with the club. However, you seemed to skip over my contention that Ryan Lavarnway is too good a prospect to languish in the minors with the RH power he possesses and which we can use in our overwhelming LH hitter's lineup in a ballpark that is tailor made for right hand hitters.

 

Next season th ere will be 30 inter-league games and I noticed you didn't touch on that either. That means there are 30 games that Papi is utterly useless to us in the lineup---or are you silly enough to say he play first base and Gonzales play RF or sit some games out. Are you really saying that? No, you're not because you are not stupid.

 

Then you bring up 2010.....the fact is he was useless for close to the two first months of the season as he was in 2008 and 2009. You mean that couldn't happen again? As for the judgments on Ortiz, if memory serves me correctly he went off on a scorekeeper last season over an RBI and made a complete ass of himself afterward. Maybe you can force yourself to recall that. During the Inter-league games the past two years he has made scenes over his lack of playing time even though he is a butcher at first base. Besides, the price for DH's who can't play defense is no longer that high and he sure as hell wouldn't have gotten near what he's asking had he refused the arbitration that Cherington stupidly offered him. And, again, his presence in the lineup not only will cost us money we could have used for pitching but meas Lavarnway won't get into the lineup until he is 27, just like Youkilis who was kept out for that long. With good prospects, keeping them hinged to the minors or the bench until they are 27 is criminal, stupid and a waste of good talent.

 

One year for Ortiz and then bon voyage. Let's see what he'd get next spring as a free agent. It would be a helluva lot less than he's going to get this year.

[User Name]

I guess you like to hear the words of your writing in print because you conveniently bypassed or forgot most of what I wrote. The clutch thing was only in passing and the fact is he is not the great clutch performer he once was and I don't expect him or anyone else to keep that kind of pace up the way he did his first five years with the club. However' date=' you seemed to skip over my contention that Ryan Lavarnway is too good a prospect to languish in the minors with the RH power he possesses and which we can use in our overwhelming LH hitter's lineup in a ballpark that is tailor made for right hand hitters.[/quote']

 

LAVARNWAY IS GOING TO PLAY CATCHER. Just thought you should know that.

 

Next season th ere will be 30 inter-league games and I noticed you didn't touch on that either. That means there are 30 games that Papi is utterly useless to us in the lineup---or are you silly enough to say he play first base and Gonzales play RF or sit some games out. Are you really saying that? No, you're not because you are not stupid.

 

I addressed two points: The point that he is still good under pressure, and the point that he shouldn't be chastised for trying to get paid like every other player. Anything else you argue is creating a position i did not present. I didn't "conveniently ignore" anything, i addressed the points i found pertinent.

 

Then you bring up 2010.....the fact is he was useless for close to the two first months of the season as he was in 2008 and 2009. You mean that couldn't happen again? As for the judgments on Ortiz, if memory serves me correctly he went off on a scorekeeper last season over an RBI and made a complete ass of himself afterward. Maybe you can force yourself to recall that. During the Inter-league games the past two years he has made scenes over his lack of playing time even though he is a butcher at first base. Besides, the price for DH's who can't play defense is no longer that high and he sure as hell wouldn't have gotten near what he's asking had he refused the arbitration that Cherington stupidly offered him. And, again, his presence in the lineup not only will cost us money we could have used for pitching but meas Lavarnway won't get into the lineup until he is 27, just like Youkilis who was kept out for that long. With good prospects, keeping them hinged to the minors or the bench until they are 27 is criminal, stupid and a waste of good talent.

 

Lavarnway and Ortiz playing are not mutually exclusive. Why is it so difficult for you to understand that Lavarnway isn't making the big club until he's ready as a catcher?

 

In 2010 he started slow, and so what? He was a force overall for the Sox.

 

As for your "recallings" of incidents, most players have their whining moments. So what? Get over it.

 

One year for Ortiz and then bon voyage. Let's see what he'd get next spring as a free agent. It would be a helluva lot less than he's going to get this year.

 

Did i disagree with him being gone after one year? Did you read the post?

[seabeachfred]

Big Diva is arguably the biggest clubhouse problem they have' date=' Fred. No way do we want this guy around for another year after this. It was a huge mistake to even offer him arbitration this year. People shouldn't let themselves be fooled by this guy. IMO the rumpswabs have been bending over backwards for years making excuses for this guy. In fact, I'll go as far as to predict that after Big Diva is finally gone the stuff we're going to hear about him is going to end up making Manny Ramirez look like a choir boy next to him. Enough already. One year---that's IT!!!![/quote']

 

Muggah, I will never deprecate what Ortiz did for the Red Sox during his salad days with us. From 2003 through 2007 he was perhaps the greatest clutch hitter in baseball and certainly the greatest in Red Sox history. Something has happened to him the last four years. He is less a leader and more a complainer and keep in mind he was the only player on the team who wanted to keep Manny Ramirez no matter what trouble that guy was causing. Perhaps he misses the guy more than we imagine because something has caused him from being Big Papi to being Big Diva. The press has noticed it, you hear it on NESN from time to time and only the ball washers and rumpswabs seem to think his constant whining at umps about calls and scorekeepers about RBI's is just fine anddandy. Some of us think he has worn this a little thin.

 

I see no way out of having him this year and acccept he will be with us and I wish him a super season, but it is time we start thinking of the future and start getting some of our good young p rospects into that lineup--something we haven't done since Ellsbury in 2007.

[User Name]

The Red Sox still appear to be in the running for free-agent righty Roy Oswalt. According to one major league source, the issue is no longer money, but geography. Oswalt evidently prefers the Midwest (St. Louis) or South (Texas). But if those scenarios don't work out, the Red Sox would be an alternative. There are some back issues with Oswalt, but none severe enough to scare the Red Sox away.

[jung]

I get both stations on cable and thought they replay Felger and Maz at night but could be wrong about that. Maz has always seemed to play some sort of wall for Felger to bounce off us as opposed to being an equal participant.

 

I would hope they would have something more to add at this point beyond the Ortiz/Tito press room incident from last year. Ortiz could go a long way to helping his image by making this arbitration thing less of a burden for the Sox especially since I think they have done Ortiz the all time favor in offering it to him.

 

I know some have a different view and I respect that but I really think they have done Ortiz a monster favor. I also think Ortiz was fortunate to have his contract negotiation and subsequent arbitration offer this arrive just as the Sox are trying to make a big marketing push for the 100th year thing....Fenway bricks etc. Not sure the Sox would have been as interested in Ortiz if not for the Fenway anniversary.

 

By the way, not to have a negative take on the bricks thing because I do have a chunk of the original Green Monster but I have had a hard time getting into the bricks thing.

 

Now give me a chance to throw one through a window at JH's house and now we're talkin'.

[a700hitter]

• The Red Sox still appear to be in the running for free-agent righty Roy Oswalt. According to one major league source, the issue is no longer money, but geography. Oswalt evidently prefers the Midwest (St. Louis) or South (Texas). But if those scenarios don't work out, the Red Sox would be an alternative. There are some back issues with Oswalt, but none severe enough to scare the Red Sox away.

 

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/2012/02/news_and_notes_24.html

[seabeachfred]

You know what? I probably need to start patenting my stuff too!

 

With your passion and love for the Red Sox you would be a natural for an important job where you could be heard waxing poetic about the team-----working in the front office.

[Elktonnick]

I get both stations on cable and thought they replay Felger and Maz at night but could be wrong about that. Maz has always seemed to play some sort of wall for Felger to bounce off us as opposed to being an equal participant.

 

I would hope they would have something more to add at this point beyond the Ortiz/Tito press room incident from last year. Ortiz could go a long way to helping his image by making this arbitration thing less of a burden for the Sox especially since I think they have done Ortiz the all time favor in offering it to him.

 

I know some have a different view and I respect that but I really think they have done Ortiz a monster favor. I also think Ortiz was fortunate to have his contract negotiation and subsequent arbitration offer this arrive just as the Sox are trying to make a big marketing push for the 100th year thing....Fenway bricks etc. Not sure the Sox would have been as interested in Ortiz if not for the Fenway anniversary.

 

By the way, not to have a negative take on the bricks thing because I do have a chunk of the original Green Monster but I have had a hard time getting into the bricks thing.

 

Now give me a chance to throw one through a window at JH's house and now we're talkin'.

 

Interesting observation about Ortiz and the 100th anniversary, I confess I hadn't thought of that link. I think Mazz was more animated then Felger today. I only saw about 45 minutes of the discussion. The big rap on Ortiz is his sense of entitlement and the lack of commitment that he and the others had towards winning over individual achievement if I can paraphrase their discussion.

[Palodios]

Why is this the only place I've heard such complaints? You guys constantly crap on Ortiz. I do not get it. Any credible links or articles about him being such a problem? No one is perfect by far' date=' but I am baffled.[/quote']

 

In all fairness, he did say he was willing to pitch for the Yankees:lol:

[VA Sox Fan]

I recall one story on him where he barged in on a Francona news conference and complained about being out of the lineup and being therefore unable to pad his stats. Maybe stuff like that has something to do with it.

 

I recall that incident too. He is referred to as Big Diva because of ONE incident when the team was sinking any way? I don't and won't buy it.

 

Ortiz has done much more good/great for this orgainzation and he's doesn't deserve to be crapped on. Again, no one is perfect. This one incident and referring to him as Big Diva is an over-the-top exaggeration.

 

From the ones who couldn't stand Francona, didn't he deserve the disrespect? Maybe barging in on the press conference would have brought Tito out of his "coma" LOL!

 

Sounds to me like that incident was as overblown as the Carl Crawford "not returning BV's phone calls" Things tend to get exaggerated in the off season when there is not much to discuss. Sometimes unwarranted discussions happen when things are slow. It happens. I suppose it's normal. Not buying any of it for a minute.