2011-2012 Offseason Thread

[SoxSport]

So far so good' date=' hopefully they can get a better OF than McDonald or maybe make a run at Cespedes. Still want to see them sign Oswalt of course to round things out.[/quote']

 

All the signs say they won't go over the cap. That means no expensive pitcher contracts or Cespedes, who is being marketed for top dollar. I think they might sign a Kazmir or Webb or Sheets--to a minor league contract. And maybe Andruw Jones, if they can get him cheap.

[seabeachfred]

So there is someone stupider than Theo Epstein!. Why in God's name would you put McDonald out there? I wouldn't even put him out there at the AAA level' date=' nevermind in the Majors. Let's face it. Anyone of these numbskulls makes JD Drew look like an All-Star. We stand a better chance getting production out of that position re-signing that idiot, J.D Drew.[/quote']

 

I just have to believe that Cherington will eventually realize that a combo of Sweeney and McDonald is about as ridiculolus a duo for as power and production position and will make a deal or sign a FA to man that spot. Sweeney is a singles hitter but clogs the bases because he possesses no speed, can't hit lefties and already gurges a lineup that is too lefthanded already. McDonald? Well you said it better than I could--the guy can't field and is a very dumb player prone to mistakes. Still, right now I'd rather think of the good thing that occurred most recently. A good closer like Andrew Bailey already guarantees our team about eight to ten more wins and Bobby Valentine is good to steal three or four instead of costing us ten to twelve. I still would like to sign Oswalt or Jackson and get our rotation in order and there is still some time to make that happen.

[seabeachfred]

What Ben really was saying is Kalish won't be available until mid-season due to shoulder surgery in November. That kills any trades involving him--at least until mid-season. By that time' date=' they might have Dice-K back in the mix.[/quote']

 

SoxSport, you mentioned in a previous post and it was mentioned even earlier that Mike Aviles is playing right field in winter ball somewhere. Now that is a very good idea and I hope he is making good progress. I like the guy and I know he is a very hard worker, not to mention that he hits RH and hits lefties well. RF at Fenway is no picnic and we can appreciate what Drew did out there because he played the position well. I would not mind one bit seeing Mike be our general handy man on the team. He could turn out to be a key player for us in 2012.

[a700hitter]

I just have to believe that Cherington will eventually realize that a combo of Sweeney and McDonald is about as ridiculolus a duo for as power and production position and will make a deal or sign a FA to man that spot. Sweeney is a singles hitter but clogs the bases because he possesses no speed' date=' can't hit lefties and already gurges a lineup that is too lefthanded already. McDonald? Well you said it better than I could--the guy can't field and is a very dumb player prone to mistakes. Still, right now I'd rather think of the good thing that occurred most recently. A good closer like Andrew Bailey already guarantees our team about eight to ten more wins and Bobby Valentine is good to steal three or four instead of costing us ten to twelve. I still would like to sign Oswalt or Jackson and get our rotation in order and there is still some time to make that happen.[/quote']... and if these guys bat 6th after Ortiz, his production will plummet. A pitcher would be certifiably insane to throw a fastball strike to Otiz with those guys on deck.

[SoxSport]

SoxSport' date=' you mentioned in a previous post and it was mentioned even earlier that Mike Aviles is playing right field in winter ball somewhere. Now that is a very good idea and I hope he is making good progress. I like the guy and I know he is a very hard worker, not to mention that he hits RH and hits lefties well. RF at Fenway is no picnic and we can appreciate what Drew did out there because he played the position well. I would not mind one bit seeing Mike be our general handy man on the team. He could turn out to be a key player for us in 2012.[/quote']

 

I'm skeptical of infielders moving to the OF and vice versa at the major league level.

Besides, I think there's a good chance they might need Aviles at 3B for part of the season.

Switching Youks to 3B from 1B at age 32 may have been too tough a switch for him.

[a700hitter]

I'm skeptical of infielders moving to the OF and vice versa at the major league level.

Besides, I think there's a good chance they might need Aviles at 3B for part of the season.

Switching Youks to 3B from 1B at age 32 may have been too tough a switch for him.

Agreed. No matter how hard he works at it, it would be very difficult for a career infielder to develop the proficiency necessary to play RF in anything but emergency situations. Fenway's RF is a very difficult field. Aviles should be used to spell Youk once a week. As you have noted, Youk is getting up there in age and he has had a pattern of wearing/breaking down. I'll wager anything right now that at some point he goes down with back spasms. It happens every year.

[a700hitter]

The Red Sox have re-signed Rich Hill to a minor league deal with an invite to Spring Training, reports John Tomase of The Boston Herald (on Twitter). The 31-year-old left-hander struck out a dozen in eight scoreless innings with the Sox last year before flowing out his elbow. He's currently rehabbing from Tommy John surgery.

Start printing the playoff tickets.

[example1]

Start printing the playoff tickets.

 

Hey, Hill was pretty damn good when he pitched last year. This isn't a bad move by any measure.

[Bellhorn04]

Hey' date=' Hill was pretty damn good when he pitched last year. This isn't a bad move by any measure.[/quote']

 

Agreed...stockpile those relievers.

[a700hitter]

Hey' date=' Hill was pretty damn good when he pitched last year. This isn't a bad move by any measure.[/quote']It's a non-move. It's doubtful that he pitches in 2012, so he'll get paid to rehab. When he is recovered, he'll go where the best deal is.

[jung]

I know we spend more time with the Sox than talkin' about baseball generally but doesn't it seem like there are more guys going through and rehabing from TJ these days? The operation has certainly been around for awhile. It is probably perfected or darned close to it by now. That might be having an impact.

 

Maybe it is some credible evidence that working less really does not keep arms from coming apart. Maybe working less actually promotes arms coming apart. At least that is the Nolan Ryan argument to some extent. Just seems like a lotta' guys going through it for whatever reason.

[Station 13]

Pitching is a a violent movement that absolutely brutal on the arm. watch when they slow mo in replay, it's like their arms are coming off.

[a700hitter]

Pitching is a a violent movement that absolutely brutal on the arm. watch when they slow mo in replay' date=' it's like their arms are coming off.[/quote']Was it any less violent in the 60's, 70's or 80's?

[jung]

Right 700...it can't be that. That has not changed I think and the mound has been at this lowered height for a long time now.

[Bellhorn04]

FWIW Rich Hill thinks he'll be ready to pitch 'early this season'.

[Station 13]

Was it any less violent in the 60's' date=' 70's or 80's?[/quote']

 

It just seems like many of the TJS recipient are big fastball pitchers, Wagner, Kuo, Johnson, Axford, Straburg, Rubby De La Rosa, Nathan, Chamberlain on the top of my mind.

 

There weren't many hard throwers 20 years ago as today.

 

It's just my guess behind the epidemic of TJS.

[a700hitter]

It just seems like many of the TJS recipient are big fastball pitchers, Wagner, Kuo, Johnson, Axford, Straburg, Rubby De La Rosa, Nathan, Chamberlain on the top of my mind.

 

There weren't many hard throwers 20 years ago as today.

 

It's just my guess behind the epidemic of TJS.

They threw hard and they threw more often.

[seabeachfred]

Agreed. No matter how hard he works at it' date=' it would be very difficult for a career infielder to develop the proficiency necessary to play RF in anything but emergency situations. Fenway's RF is a very difficult field. Aviles should be used to spell Youk once a week. As you have noted, Youk is getting up there in age and he has had a pattern of wearing/breaking down. I'll wager anything right now that at some point he goes down with back spasms. It happens every year.[/quote']

 

Can't disagree with you and Sox Sport on that---it is hard for a career infielder to make that switch without some difficulty, but when the alternative is slow and singles hitter Sweeney who couldn't even break in the Oakland lineup, and coupled with McDonald one of the dumbest ballplayers around, I would be willing to give it a go. Of course, if we could sign a Ludwick or a Ross or a Jones, that would help a lot more, especially with that inviting Monster staring at them for 81 games.

[seabeachfred]

It just seems like many of the TJS recipient are big fastball pitchers, Wagner, Kuo, Johnson, Axford, Straburg, Rubby De La Rosa, Nathan, Chamberlain on the top of my mind.

 

There weren't many hard throwers 20 years ago as today.

 

It's just my guess behind the epidemic of TJS.

 

Believe it or not Station 13, these injuries could be coming from NOT THROWING ENOUGH. Once at a clinic former Major Leaguer Claude Osteen said that since the pitching motion is an unnatural one the best way to counteract that is to throw more and develop stronger arm and wrist control, and if you looked back then there were a helluva lot more hard throwers than you might imagine.

 

Ever heard of Bob Gibson of the Cardinals, Dick Ellsworth of the Cubs, Jim Maloney of the Reds, Juan Marichal and Gaylor Perry of the Giants, Sandy Koufax and Don Drysdale of the Dodgers Tom Seaver and Jerry Koosman of the Mets, Nolan Ryan of many teams, and so on. I think today pitchers try to be too careful and might injure themselves from a lack of consistent throwing as well as bad mechanics.

[a700hitter]

Believe it or not Station 13, these injuries could be coming from NOT THROWING ENOUGH. Once at a clinic former Major Leaguer Claude Osteen said that since the pitching motion is an unnatural one the best way to counteract that is to throw more and develop stronger arm and wrist control, and if you looked back then there were a helluva lot more hard throwers than you might imagine.

 

Ever heard of Bob Gibson of the Cardinals, Dick Ellsworth of the Cubs, Jim Maloney of the Reds, Juan Marichal and Gaylor Perry of the Giants, Sandy Koufax and Don Drysdale of the Dodgers Tom Seaver and Jerry Koosman of the Mets, Nolan Ryan of many teams, and so on. I think today pitchers try to be too careful and might injure themselves from a lack of consistent throwing as well as bad mechanics.

Sam McDowell, Tiant in his Indian years, Lolich, Chance, McLain, Palmer, Carlton, Tannana and on and on.

[example1]

Don't a lot of pitchers choose to have surgery proactively because the arm supposedly comes back stronger than it was before? If they see some wear then they can choose to get it early, before it is a huge deal, sit out a year, and come back as strong as before if not stronger. I'm sure Jacko can inform us of this.

 

Changing a surgery from one that was risky for the longterm health of a pitcher to something that actually helps would be one reason more people opt for it than before and why, by extension, it seems more people than ever are rehabing from it. Just a thought...

[Rdsxmbnt]

If I recall it's not necessarily the surgery itself that makes them come back stronger but rather the intensive rehab that better prepares the joints and ligaments to handle the stress of being a major league pitcher

[jacksonianmarch]

If I recall it's not necessarily the surgery itself that makes them come back stronger but rather the intensive rehab that better prepares the joints and ligaments to handle the stress of being a major league pitcher

 

Yep. The rehab focuses on core training. These guys come back with a completely healthy arm (most of the time) and a stronger core leading them to sometimes increased velocity. Makes one wonder why all pitchers dont go on the workout regimen in the offseason regardless of whether you have had TJS. There is still risk involved, though. It isnt perfect, but most players do come back completely healthy. They typically do not come back completely healthy their first yr back, though, and starters typically take longer than relievers

[Spudboy]

Pitching is a a violent movement that absolutely brutal on the arm. watch when they slow mo in replay' date=' it's like their arms are coming off.[/quote']

 

Excellent observation. Where is Jacko with his knowledge of physiology?

 

Oops. I should have read the entire thread before posting......

[Spitball]

This appears to be off topic, but the Padres just acquired Carlos Quentin. I was hoping he he might be an option for the Red Sox. I wonder if Chris Denorfia (.887 OPS versus left handers) might be a fit to platoon in right. He is a little known who does a lot of things very well but not great. He actually platooned with Sweeney at one time in Oakland.

[a700hitter]

This appears to be off topic' date=' but the Padres just acquired Carlos Quentin. I was hoping he he might be an option for the Red Sox. I wonder if Chris Denorfia (.887 OPS versus left handers) might be a fit to platoon in right. He is a little known who does a lot of things very well but not great. He actually platooned with Sweeney at one time in Oakland.[/quote']He has a pretty good glove in RF too.

[Spitball]

He has a pretty good glove in RF too.

 

Yes, he does. He's a pretty good all around player. Now that the Padres have added Quentin, he might be available.

 

Btw, he is a New Englander who went to Wheaton College.

[BSN07]

I'm not seeing Quentin holding up in SD playing RF. I don't know for sure but I'm guessing he will be playing LF next season.

 

But Denorfia may still be available. I can't see the asking price being too high.

[VA Sox Fan]

Long but funny stuff from Abraham:

 

Looking ahead to a big 2012 for the Sox

 

Posted by Peter Abraham, Globe Staff December 31, 2011 10:08 AM

By Peter Abraham, Globe Staff

 

Red Sox fans will be happy to see 2011 end.

 

The Greatest Team Ever finished in third place and were such a bunch of clods that manager Terry Francona called them out in public before quitting.

 

Then general manager Theo Epstein fled the premises, covering his tracks by saying it was his plan all along to leave his hometown, family and friends behind to go work for ... the Cubs?

 

The brain trust sprang into action, taking two months to hire a manager after telling their new GM he had no money to spend.

 

The good news is 2012 is upon us. Here's what to expect:

 

Jan. 2: Red Sox announce 10-year, $250 million deal for Prince Fielder to play right field. "What, you really thought we were out of money?" GM Ben Cherington said. "Have you seen how many tourists line up to pay $12 for those Fenway Park tours?"

 

Jan. 21: Red Sox and Cubs finalize compensation for Epstein. In lieu of any players going to Boston, he will personally call every season ticket holder and apologize for signing John Lackey.

 

Feb. 11: Truck Day is canceled. Get-a-lifers are asked to go about their business rather than stand on a side street in the cold and watch a rented truck get loaded with baseball equipment. "If you really find that exciting, go hang around the loading docks at Dick's Sporting Goods," chief operating officer Sam Kennedy said in a statement.

 

Feb. 19: Pitchers and catchers report to spring training. Josh Beckett agrees to talk to Bobby Valentine, but only on Tuesdays from 2-2:15 p.m.

 

March 3: Red Sox defeat Northeastern 10-0 as Carl Crawford hits three home runs and steals two bases. Reveals afterward that one of Tampa Bay's six fans, an 86-year-old palm reader from Pinellas Park, had put a curse on him last year.

 

April 5: Sox beat Detroit 1-0 as Jacoby Ellsbury homers in ninth inning to beat Justin Verlander. Scott Boras says Ellsbury is agreeable to a contract extension of 12 years and $300 million along with 12 percent of all Mass Pike revenue.

 

April 20: Red Sox beat Yankees 4-3. Alex Rodriguez, hitless so far on the season, flies to China with his cousin after the game to have an experimental treatment on his sore knee suggested by Lakers star Metta World Peace. "Hopefully he'll be back soon," GM Brian Cashman says. "OK, I'm lying."

 

May 10: New NESN sideline reporter Mila Kunis leaves the network to return to Hollywood. Heidi Watney makes her triumphant return.

 

May 13: Liverpool loses its final match of the season to Swansea City and is eliminated from the English Premier League playoffs.

 

May 14: The Liverpool Echo newspaper reveals that manager Kenny Dalglish lost control of the Reds during the season. Players were eating pork pies during games while drinking Guinness. "This is all news to me," says John Henry. "We'll look into it."

 

May 19: Red Sox beat Phillies 2-1 when Jonathan Papelbon hits Kelly Shoppach with the bases loaded in the ninth inning. The closer says later he doesn't like pitching in Philadelphia. "The cops here won't fist-bump me when I come out of the bullpen," he says. "They're too busy arresting fans."

 

June 3: Former Red Sox manager Terry Francona is suspended by ESPN for week after cursing six times in one sentence then spitting a wad of bubble gum and tobacco on the foot of Linda Cohn, ruining her Jimmy Choos. "Aw (bleep), I'm (bleeping) sorry," Francona says.

 

June 17: Red Sox complete three-game sweep of the Cubs at Wrigley Field as Prince Fielder drives in 12 runs. Those Cubs fans still sober enough to run chase Epstein down West Addison Street. "But Hoyer is the GM," he yells.

 

June 30: Bobby Valentine takes a leave of absence to run the International Monetary Fund and prevent the collapse of the European economy. Tim Bogar becomes interim manager.

 

July 12: With the All-Star break over, Daisuke Matsuzaka is asked how close he is to returning to the team. "It should be any month now," he says through a translator. "I'm ready to look at the mound and think about pitching."

 

July 16: Red Sox announce that "Sweet Caroline" has been scrapped in favor of "Baby Got Back" by Sir Mix-A-Lot. Angry Pink Hats vow to protest at halftime before somebody reminds them there is no halftime in baseball.

 

Aug. 1: Tim Wakefeld appeals to Major League Baseball to allow Boston Park League victories to count toward his career win total.

 

Aug. 15: Valentine returns, Bogar having led the Red Sox into first place. New Yawkey Way sports bar "Timmy B's" is the hottest spot in town.

 

Aug. 21: Adrian Gonzalez hits 30th home run. Gives all the credit to Tim Tebow.

 

Sept. 7: Jon Lester throws one-hit shutout against the Blue Jays. Between innings, he also beats Beckett and Clay Buchholz in Angry Birds.

 

Sept. 15: Dustin Pedroia named team captain. Immediately gains respect of teammates by calling time out in the seventh inning, going to the mound and kicking the crap out of Andrew Miller after he walks three batters in a row.

 

Sept. 30: Red Sox finish September 20-6 with a victory in Baltimore. MVP lock Carl Crawford drives in his 123rd run. Andrew Bailey picks up his 37th save with help from comeback player of the year Bobby Jenks.

 

Oct. 1: Red Sox clinch pennant with a 4-1 victory at New York. Nick Punto drives in three runs in support of Junichi Tazawa, who records his 15th win. "Who's methodical now?" crows Cherington in the winning clubhouse.

 

Oct. 9: Red Sox complete first-round playoff sweep of the Angels. Right fielder Ryan Kalish makes two leaping catches to steal home runs away from Albert Pujols. "I owe it all to the crack Red Sox medical staff," Kalish says later.

 

Oct. 18: Red Sox win the pennant with four-game sweep of the Texas Rangers. In his first appearance of the season, John Lackey outduels Yu Darvish. "It's fun to win for the supportive fans in Boston," Lackey says.

 

Nov. 1: Red Sox claim their third World Series in nine years with a seven-game thriller against the surprise New York Mets. Clay Buchholz beats Johan Santana in Game 7 as Valentine tops his old team.

 

"Can you believe it?" say Joe Castiglione after Bailey gets the final out. "If your windshield is broken in a Kenmore Square riot, call 1-800-54-GIANT."

 

Nov. 2: Davis Ortiz tells Enrique Rojas of ESPN Deportes that he is upset the Red Sox have not offered him a contract for 2013. "I just woke up, give me a second," Cherington says.

 

Nov. 3: Matsuzaka announces he's ready to pitch. He is shocked to learn the season is over.

 

Nov. 4: Duck Boat parade draws millions of happy fans to Boston. "We're all proud of the Red Sox. Especially Dustin Youkilis and Jacoby Saltalamacchia," says Mayor Menino.

 

So there you have it. Get your tickets now.

 

-----------------

 

Happy New Year, gang. thanks for reading and here's looking forward to a good 2012 for everybody. I'm on vacation for two weeks starting tomorrow. Nick and the crew will have you covered.

[BSN07]

Hahaha that was hysterical