2011 Trade Deadline Thread

[RedSoxfanforlife305]

Yup because CC just can't beat Beckett.

[redsoxbeatz]

Yup because CC just can't beat Beckett.

 

exaccctly

[SoxSport]

Mazz just came out with one of those negative pronouncements about Bedard. "a gamble". "injury history." "negative with media."

 

The latter is important only to the media. Everybody else cares only about how the guy pitches. But that's the media.

 

Anybody's a gamble. And most veteran pitchers have an injury history. The most important thing is what a pitcher has done lately. And Bedard was very good the first half until he tweaked his knee. And his first start back showed he still has his stuff. He should be better his next start.

 

The Red Sox have shown they have the patience and knowhow with pitchers. I think they overuse the pitch count machine with starters in games (without much medical foundation, by the way), and wear out their relief pitchers with too many 1 inning appearances. No, they aren't much different from everybody else. That's why they need 12-13 pitchers these days. But they are way down in pitching stats in the League, and should ask themselves if they are doing things right.

 

Re Bedard, A lot of this naysay about him could be media sour grapes about the Yankees not getting him.

Even Mazz seems obligated to join the bandwagon.

 

Welcome to the Boston media, Erik.

[jacksonianmarch]

I don't think the Yankees were wrong in asking for the MRI. I think they did well in passing on UJ...same for my Sox. I am glad we did not get him. By the end of the year' date=' you will see that he is not what everyone thinks he is. There is no other reason that CR was willing to trade him. Sorry Cleveland....I think you bought a pig in a poke.[/quote']

 

Pomeranz and White are two top flight prospects with top of the rotation capability. The Sox didnt have that, the Yankees had that in Banuelos and Betances only. They gave up a ton in just those two. McBride looks like a power guy who is old for the league and I dont know much about Gordon. But in the top 2 there, they gave up a shitload. Jimenez has reined in his command from two yrs ago, but his stuff has tailed off this yr and his command has betrayed him a little as well. He's what I'd call a #2 for now. He's got ace stuff, but he has his flaws

[SoxSport]

The Red Sox have Wakefield listed as their starter on August 3rd. It looks like Bedard could pitch for us on Saturday against the Yankees. As of now, that series would set up as:

 

Lester vs. Garcia

Bedard vs. Sabathia

Beckett vs. Hughes

 

If I were the GM, I would be telling Tito to abandon his 7-run/minimum pitch count philosophy with his starting pitchers, and get 'em out of the game quicker when they don't have their stuff. That means Lackey and Wakefield, who are on again, off again every other game, like a light switch.

 

Forget about Miller. He belongs in the bullpen doing mid-relief. That's the way new pitchers USED to break in, to establish their confidence.

[Dojji]

Mazz just came out with one of those negative pronouncements about Bedard. "a gamble". "injury history." "negative with media."

 

The latter is important only to the media. Everybody else cares only about how the guy pitches. But that's the media.

 

Anybody's a gamble. And most veteran pitchers have an injury history. The most important thing is what a pitcher has done lately. And Bedard was very good the first half until he tweaked his knee. And his first start back showed he still has his stuff. He should be better his next start.

 

The Red Sox have shown they have the patience and knowhow with pitchers. I think they overuse the pitch count machine with starters in games (without much medical foundation, by the way), and wear out their relief pitchers with too many 1 inning appearances. But they aren't much different from everybody else. That's why they need 12-13 pitchers these days.

 

A lot of this naysay about Bedard could be media sour grapes about the Yankees not getting him.

Even Mazz seems obligated to join the bandwagon.

 

Welcome to the Boston media, Erik.

 

I hope they baby Bedard a little, for obvious reasons. He's a good pitcher, but job 1 is to keep him healthy.

 

I wonder if they're going to trot out the famous Shoulder Strengtenhing Program on this one. It worked for Paps and kept Schilling alive for one last year, so who knows.

[AtWork]

Yesterday's push by the Yankees to acquire Astros lefty Wandy Rodriguez came from ownership, not GM Brian Cashman. SI's Jon Heyman wrote yesterday that the Yankees offered to pay $21MM of the $38MM left on Rodriguez's contract, implying they feel that Rodriguez is worth less than $7MM a year. Rosenthal says the Astros were willing to pay $2MM of Rodriguez's salary this year (essentially all of it) "or $5MM if his [player] option for 2014 were exercised." I'm in the minority, but I'm with the Astros in thinking paying Wandy down to the range of Ted Lilly's contract is reasonable. At any rate, Rosenthal says the Astros and Yankees never even got to the point of discussing names.

Cashman has seven untouchables in trade discussions, a rival GM told Rosenthal.

 

No wonder he wasn't able to make a deal at the deadline.

[Will617]

Pomeranz and White are two top flight prospects with top of the rotation capability. The Sox didnt have that' date=' the Yankees had that in Banuelos and Betances only. They gave up a ton in just those two. McBride looks like a power guy who is old for the league and I dont know much about Gordon. But in the top 2 there, they gave up a shitload. Jimenez has reined in his command from two yrs ago, but his stuff has tailed off this yr and his command has betrayed him a little as well. He's what I'd call a #2 for now. He's got ace stuff, but he has his flaws[/quote']

 

Ranaudo has that kind of capability, but he's much further from the majors than Pomeranz and White. The Sox never had the pieces to make a deal like this happen (bar trading like Pedroia or completely gutting the farm, or other ridiculous options).

[jacksonianmarch]

That's the thing. Ranuado is in high A right now and struggling. Pomeranz just dominated that level and is in AA where he's been lights out through 3 starts

[Dojji]

Come on guys, Jacko's right. IF we'd stil had Casey Kelly we coulda done something, but we have traded a lot off the top of our farm system and we can't quite match what teams that haven't done that can offer. It's just what it is.

[jacksonianmarch]

No wonder he wasn't able to make a deal at the deadline.

 

Those 7 probably are....

 

1. Montero

2. Betances

3. Banuelos

4. Romine

5. Sanchez

6. Williams

7. Heathcott

[SoxSport]

No wonder he wasn't able to make a deal at the deadline.

 

Cashman sure disappointed Heyman. I'm surprised they didn't get Jimenez. George would have never allowed that to happen.

[SoxSport]

Come on guys' date=' Jacko's right. IF we'd stil had Casey Kelly we coulda done something, but we have traded a lot off the top of our farm system and we can't quite match what teams that haven't done that can offer. It's just what it is.[/quote']

 

Who is Casey Kelly? What's he done?

[suns]

Pomeranz and White are two top flight prospects with top of the rotation capability. The Sox didnt have that' date=' the Yankees had that in Banuelos and Betances only. They gave up a ton in just those two. McBride looks like a power guy who is old for the league and I dont know much about Gordon. But in the top 2 there, they gave up a shitload. Jimenez has reined in his command from two yrs ago, but his stuff has tailed off this yr and his command has betrayed him a little as well. He's what I'd call a #2 for now. He's got ace stuff, but he has his flaws[/quote']

 

I didn't read this whole thing, I read the first sentence.

They have top rotation capability, while Ubaldo is a ace, a person who has already proved himself

[Dojji]

Who is Casey Kelly? What's he done?

 

Kelly was a young, very highly regarded pitching prospect, a little raw because he's young and split time between pitching and playing shortstop, but with VERY high potential. He was part of the Gonzo deal.

[jacksonianmarch]

I didn't read this whole thing, I read the first sentence.

They have top rotation capability, while Ubaldo is a ace, a person who has already proved himself

 

He was an ace for half a season last yr. He's been sporadic since then.

[suns]

He was an ace for half a season last yr. He's been sporadic since then.

 

He played in the ultimate hitters park.

[jacksonianmarch]

Until they used a humador. And he played in the ultimate pitchers league against terrible lineups. Suns, he's got a ton of talent, but the risk is high for him and the cost was humongous. If he becomes a 4.50ERA pitcher with a ton of walks for you guys, then your GM will have buttf***ed your future for an AJ Burnett

[AtWork]

I didn't read this whole thing, I read the first sentence.

They have top rotation capability, while Ubaldo is a ace, a person who has already proved himself

 

You don't trade half your farm for a player whose team won't let you do an MRI on his shoulder. Shoulder injuries are death for pitchers.

[BecKett]

So when should we expect to see Bedard for the first time?

[Dojji]

Not much before the third. He threw on the 30th remember?

[AtWork]

So when should we expect to see Bedard for the first time?

 

No word yet. August 3rd would be 5 days rest for him but the Red Sox have Wakefield listed as the starter for now. The next most logical date would be August 5th against the Yankees.

[SoxFanForsyth]

No word yet. August 3rd would be 5 days rest for him but the Red Sox have Wakefield listed as the starter for now. The next most logical date would be August 5th against the Yankees.

 

I'd be beyond shocked if he got to start against NYY. I'd say they'll throw him on Thursday and bump Lester to Friday vs NYY

[SoxSport]

Just listened to Mazz and Chad Finn on Globe video. Mazz was a good deal more positive about Bedard than his column. They said his relationship with his teammates and the fans was far more important than his relationship with the media (maybe Mazz saw my post. you never know). Also said Bedard can be good if he's healthy, and all they need from him is 6 innings and 3 runs or less. You can't rely on that from their current guys except from Lester and Beckett. Bedard also gives them another lefty starter against the Yankees--especially in Yankees stadium. He and Lester get the call this weekend.

[AtWork]

I'd be beyond shocked if he got to start against NYY. I'd say they'll throw him on Thursday and bump Lester to Friday vs NYY

 

You're probably right, personally I'd rather see Bedard face the Yankees than Wakefield. Like it or not, Bedards our 3rd starter now.

[jacksonianmarch]

Yankees have the best OPS vs lefties in baseball at .826. The whole lefty thing isnt really a big issue

[AtWork]

Yankees have the best OPS vs lefties in baseball at .826. The whole lefty thing isnt really a big issue

 

And last I checked the Red Sox had the second best. So much for their biggest weakness going into the season.

[Palodios]

For all the negative things you could say about Aviles, he can kill lefties. .800 career against them, even better recently.

[SoxSport]

Current leading story on Bedard at the Globe: "when healthy, Bedard is a good pitcher, not a great one."

 

Why all this downplaying of Bedard?

 

Well, Bedard does not like the media. that's #1.

 

And then you have the NY factor: what would they be saying if the Yankees got Bedard?

 

My guess is they wouldn't be saying the same thing.

[Palodios]

That's ridiculous. Greatness when healthy has never been Bedard's problem. Its how rarely "when healthy" has been.