Aug. 21 Red Sox vs. Yankees

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

So where are all those people who thought Penny was a solid #3 option? The guy has sucked all season. Sure' date=' he might have had a stretch of some quality games, but he can't do s*** against a competent lineup.[/quote']

Where are the ones that thought it was a ridiculously horrible idea to trade him, for that matter?

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

IT WAS 6-1 in the 5th ' date=' insted of putting Bowden for 10 f***ing runs you put one of the best bulpen in the game and it would be a hole diferent story[/quote']

Why, so we can steamroll every arm in the bullpen and f*** ourselves for the rest of this series? Saito, Ramirez, and Delcarmen each through only one inning, and we have Okajima, Bard and Papelbon available for tomorrow's game.

[lesterkett]

everibody be ready for the tazawa massacre

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

O noez!

[SCM33]

Agree, Theo also basically gave up pretty early anyway by putting Green in LF, Baldelli in RF and Kotchman at 1B. He wasnt gunna burn the team in a game they had no business winning.

[CrespoBlows]

Agree' date=' Theo also basically gave up pretty early anyway by putting Green in LF, Baldelli in RF and Kotchman at 1B. He wasnt gunna burn the team in a game they had no business winning.[/quote']

 

Probably Tito's call.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Lots of ranting and really not one coherent point. There's really nothing here to respond to. Talk about ********.

 

So you don't have an anti-Drew bias and a pro-Nixon bias?

 

He also had knee surgery in the 2007 offseason. As players get older, durability becomes an issue,. They start to break down. He had two major injuries in two seasons. Ownage still in place.

 

f***ing christ almighty. Yeah, he's been really f***ing injury riddled this year, ay? 2008 is the only season since 2003 where he's missed a significant amount of games. You're positive he will break down in the future on what evidence, doctor? Once again, you clearly can't differentiate between durability issues and performance issues. Either that, or you're just pulling arbitrary junk out of thin air.

 

An admission that you put words in my mouth. Those words reflect your feelings regarding my opinions. Those words don't reflect my feelings. Owned yet again. I'm taking you too school today little boy.

 

Admission that I stuck words in your mouth? My mockery of your ridiculous ideas flew clear over your head, and now you front this terrible attempt at saving face. If anything, you're the one placing words in my mouth with this post. I can now write you down as a hypocrite.

 

What's dishonest is looking at Drew's performance as anything more than mediocre.

 

.374 OPS, .842 OPS, 15 HR. THIS ISN'T MEDIOCRE. HIS PERFORMANCE IS MEDIOCRE IF YOU LOOK AT THE HORRIBLE, MEANINGLESS, ARCHAIC STATS THAT YOU'VE BEEN CLINGING TOO.

 

I'll say it one more time. Batting average and RBI are stat abortions that completely massacre the very idea of common sense. It's one thing to just read numbers, apparently it's another to comprehend what these numbers are telling you.

 

5 tool? I would be happy with 2 on an every day basis.

Being a **** means he doesnt play every day, the man is a walking estrogen tablet.

I bet his tits are bigger than my wifes.

 

But he gets on base, DOESN'T MAKE OUTS, and contributes to the offense positively. He can be an estrogen druggie and I wouldn't give a s*** as long the aforementioned holds true.

 

StLouis, Atlanta and LA all let him walk away as playoff contenders,lets not get into semantics.

 

Atlanta and LA lost him through free agency. Drew left Atlanta to sign a fat deal with the Dodgers. He became too expensive for the Braves. Drew opted out of his LA deal to sign a fatter deal with Boston. LA had two outfield prospects ready to make a splash on the major league team, and had no desire to overpay for Drew as a result.

 

St. Louis the only team that cut the ties with Drew, as opposed to Drew cutting ties with them.

 

they didnt want him period bottom line end of story

 

DREW CUT TIES WITH LA AND ATLANTA, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND.

 

and these are solid organizations not to be confused with Miami and Kansas City. Although Atlanta has fallen from the scene StLouis and LA are serious contenders today and StLouis was then.

They let this phenom walk with no counter offers and no worries.

 

St. Louis traded him both for pitching and

 

You say he was too expensive for LA yet they signed .220 hitting Andruw Jones for more money and just reupped Manny for 45M more?

 

Jones signed a two year deal for $36 million, and they hoped to make him a reclamation project. If it didn't work, they weren't bound to him long-term. Drew would have required that they commit five years, which they didn't want to do with the likes of Matt Kemp, Andre Either, and (at the time) Delwyn Young coming through the system.

 

Comparing Manny to Drew? Really?

 

RBI are an insult to our intelligence?....

ive never heard it put that and i never heard the word clutch be refered to as meaningless and irrelevent. I would suspect the rest of the baseball world would agree.

 

RBI are an insult to intelligence. What does this information tell you? That the batter produced a base hit that caused a runner on base, that he had no hand in putting on base, to score. The batter is credited with the base hit, rightfully so. But the batter is also credited with driving in the runner he has no connection to, which is ********. Baserunners and batters, on the same team, are almost entirely different factions in any given game situation.

 

Clutch isn't just meaningless and irrelevant, it's non-existent.

 

these guys arent robots,inspite of their appearence, they do feel pressure.

I love arguing baseball so I'll play until my MIS department shuts me out for the day.

 

I know they aren't robots. That doesn't mean their hitting ability increases or decreases with a runner at X base with X outs.

 

You can have your walks and your OBP, myself and 30 other GM's prefer 30Hr 100rbi seasons.

 

Good, you can have the 100 instances of a meaningless statistical recording, while I focus on plate discipline, walks, getting on base, and not making outs, and come away with all the winnings.

 

When Billy Bean puts together a winning program then I'll pay attention to the other ********.

 

Oakland Athletics, wins per season in order from 2000-2006: 91, 102, 103, 96, 91, 88, 93. Their sole offensive focus through this entire period was plate discipline, on-base percentage, and walks.

 

All with either the lowest or among the lowest payrolls in baseball.

 

Since I know the world series argument is coming next, the playoffs are a crapshoot. One bad outing by your ace in a given series can ruin your season... even if you are the better team. That's one of the reasons why a wild card team is in the WS virtually every year.

 

Currently the franchise is rebuilding, since they don't really have the financial to go get outside guys to assure they stay on stop every year.

 

Do you know of any other team in Baseball that offered JD Drew a contract after he left 12M on the table in Los Angeles? I dont and no one ever tried to drive the price up and Drew never sought another team out.

 

Because half of baseball is still putting their money on RBI's. 65 year old baseball-lifer goons that only recognize and acknowledge names and completely dismiss common sense... they don't sway my opinion in the least.

 

Have you ever have a dinner at home with all the relatives and the extended family?

Im half irish and half sicilian so in my house all the adults are at the big boy table but there arent enuff chairs for all of them.

So we take the crazy aunt who pisses herself, the uncle who drinks 2 qts of whiskey and then goes out to get another half gallon and later at night he brings in an arseral of weapons he wants to show your kids ,the crazy aunts illegitimate son who is a spoiled brat and survived by giving handjobs to the older Gay neighbor who was his Cub Scout leader and inherited his millions after the aids virus took him from his career as an architecht in Soho and cousin Marias husband Jack, who is perpetually unemployed but just bought an Armani suit and showed up in a Mercedes SUV and of course all the children aged 3-16.

The 2nd crowd goes out onto the porch to eat in the table your grandfather used to beat Arthur Breslin with during the McLain McLaughlin wars of the 60s.....

Now if this were a GM's meeting where would Theo sit and what character would he be.

If this were a table of ballplayers where would Drew sit and what character would he be.

 

I been doing this analogy for 20 years while transplanting players and Gm's so please humor me.

 

I don't understand what you're asking.

 

Here we ago again with OBP. Look, Nick Johnson has a higher career OBP than Drew. So don't start making ridiculous comparisons with Hall of Famers like McCovey and Matthews. Christ, the guy has made ONE all star team in 12 years!

 

This is the finest example yet of your strict adherence to whatever those f***s on ESPN tell you.

 

Drew gets on base (DOESN'T MAKE OUTS) at a rate similar to some of the best players in the history of the game? Oh no, that can't be right! He's not enough of a gritty dirtdog for that to make any sense!!

 

Sweet jesus.

 

The guy doesn't produce runs. Period. What else is there to say?

 

If you would stop hugging batting average and RBI for two seconds, and look at something meaningful for a change, all the evidence is right there. Quality on-base percentage? Check. Quality OPS? Check. Walks? Check. Not making outs? Check.

 

You know what, let's try this another way:

 

Runs scored for each team that J.D. Drew has been a member of and played a meaningful role:

2000 Cardinals: 809

2001 Cardinals: 887 (one of his very best statistical seasons, hampered a bit by injuries)

2002 Cardinals: 787

2003 Cardinals: 876

2004 Braves: 803

2005 Dodgers: 685 (Drew played 72 games)

2006 Dodgers: 820

2007 Red Sox: 867

2008 Red Sox: 845

2009 Red Sox: 620 thus far

 

So tell me, is he just always in the right place at the right time, constantly shielded and piggy-backed by the likes of Mark McGwire, Albert Pujols, Chipper Jones, and Manny Ramirez, or is he some underlying factor in each team's run total? I think I already know your answer.

 

That's a good question. I guess I'm s***ing on Drew because you folks are defending his subpar production. I s*** on Ortiz a couple weeks ago, so I guess it's Drew's turn. It won't be his last, as he's only just passed the halfway point of his contract.

 

Unbelievable. This is like me taking Martinez's lack of stolen bases and using it to try and front a coherent argument about how unproductive he is. Wouldn't make much sense, would it?

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Probably Tito's call.

Think he meant Tito.

[SCM33]

Yeah, Tito, my bad.

[SCM33]

So you don't have an anti-Drew bias and a pro-Nixon bias?

 

 

 

f***ing christ almighty. Yeah, he's been really f***ing injury riddled this year, ay? 2008 is the only season since 2003 where he's missed a significant amount of games. You're positive he will break down in the future on what evidence, doctor? Once again, you clearly can't differentiate between durability issues and performance issues. Either that, or you're just pulling arbitrary junk out of thin air.

 

 

 

Admission that I stuck words in your mouth? My mockery of your ridiculous ideas flew clear over your head, and now you front this terrible attempt at saving face. If anything, you're the one placing words in my mouth with this post. I can now write you down as a hypocrite.

 

 

 

.374 OPS, .842 OPS, 15 HR. THIS ISN'T MEDIOCRE. HIS PERFORMANCE IS MEDIOCRE IF YOU LOOK AT THE HORRIBLE, MEANINGLESS, ARCHAIC STATS THAT YOU'VE BEEN CLINGING TOO.

 

I'll say it one more time. Batting average and RBI are stat abortions that completely massacre the very idea of common sense. It's one thing to just read numbers, apparently it's another to comprehend what these numbers are telling you.

 

 

 

But he gets on base, DOESN'T MAKE OUTS, and contributes to the offense positively. He can be an estrogen druggie and I wouldn't give a s*** as long the aforementioned holds true.

 

 

 

Atlanta and LA lost him through free agency. Drew left Atlanta to sign a fat deal with the Dodgers. He became too expensive for the Braves. Drew opted out of his LA deal to sign a fatter deal with Boston. LA had two outfield prospects ready to make a splash on the major league team, and had no desire to overpay for Drew as a result.

 

St. Louis the only team that cut the ties with Drew, as opposed to Drew cutting ties with them.

 

 

 

DREW CUT TIES WITH LA AND ATLANTA, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND.

 

 

 

St. Louis traded him both for pitching and

 

 

 

Jones signed a two year deal for $36 million, and they hoped to make him a reclamation project. If it didn't work, they weren't bound to him long-term. Drew would have required that they commit five years, which they didn't want to do with the likes of Matt Kemp, Andre Either, and (at the time) Delwyn Young coming through the system.

 

Comparing Manny to Drew? Really?

 

 

 

RBI are an insult to intelligence. What does this information tell you? That the batter produced a base hit that caused a runner on base, that he had no hand in putting on base, to score. The batter is credited with the base hit, rightfully so. But the batter is also credited with driving in the runner he has no connection to, which is ********. Baserunners and batters, on the same team, are almost entirely different factions in any given game situation.

 

Clutch isn't just meaningless and irrelevant, it's non-existent.

 

 

 

I know they aren't robots. That doesn't mean their hitting ability increases or decreases with a runner at X base with X outs.

 

 

 

Good, you can have the 100 instances of a meaningless statistical recording, while I focus on plate discipline, walks, getting on base, and not making outs, and come away with all the winnings.

 

 

 

Oakland Athletics, wins per season in order from 2000-2006: 91, 102, 103, 96, 91, 88, 93. Their sole offensive focus through this entire period was plate discipline, on-base percentage, and walks.

 

All with either the lowest or among the lowest payrolls in baseball.

 

Since I know the world series argument is coming next, the playoffs are a crapshoot. One bad outing by your ace in a given series can ruin your season... even if you are the better team. That's one of the reasons why a wild card team is in the WS virtually every year.

 

Currently the franchise is rebuilding, since they don't really have the financial to go get outside guys to assure they stay on stop every year.

 

 

 

Because half of baseball is still putting their money on RBI's. 65 year old baseball-lifer goons that only recognize and acknowledge names and completely dismiss common sense... they don't sway my opinion in the least.

 

 

 

I don't understand what you're asking.

 

 

 

This is the finest example yet of your strict adherence to whatever those f***s on ESPN tell you.

 

Drew gets on base (DOESN'T MAKE OUTS) at a rate similar to some of the best players in the history of the game? Oh no, that can't be right! He's not enough of a gritty dirtdog for that to make any sense!!

 

Sweet jesus.

 

 

 

If you would stop hugging batting average and RBI for two seconds, and look at something meaningful for a change, all the evidence is right there. Quality on-base percentage? Check. Quality OPS? Check. Walks? Check. Not making outs? Check.

 

You know what, let's try this another way:

 

Runs scored for each team that J.D. Drew has been a member of and played a meaningful role:

2000 Cardinals: 809

2001 Cardinals: 887 (one of his very best statistical seasons, hampered a bit by injuries)

2002 Cardinals: 787

2003 Cardinals: 876

2004 Braves: 803

2005 Dodgers: 685 (Drew played 72 games)

2006 Dodgers: 820

2007 Red Sox: 867

2008 Red Sox: 845

2009 Red Sox: 620 thus far

 

So tell me, is he just always in the right place at the right time, constantly shielded and piggy-backed by the likes of Mark McGwire, Albert Pujols, Chipper Jones, and Manny Ramirez, or is he some underlying factor in each team's run total? I think I already know your answer.

 

 

 

Unbelievable. This is like me taking Martinez's lack of stolen bases and using it to try and front a coherent argument about how unproductive he is. Wouldn't make much sense, would it?

 

Very good analysis, I think you should copy and paste in to a DREW thread, as it will get lost in the game thread.

 

I dont like Drew very much, but I dont hate him. Overpaid? Yes, but its not my money and fans need to stop putting a dollar value with him. He got paid very well, in a very good market the year he got paid. Hes been good, maybe not what some people expected, especially with the talent EVERYBODY knows he does have, but he is not the teams problem in terms of wins and losses, he contributes much more positive than negetive. People are just looking for a scapegoat, and since Drew isnt rah rah with the media, some fans seem to equate that with his skill level/desire to win.

[The_Destroyah]

So you don't have an anti-Drew bias and a pro-Nixon bias?

 

 

 

f***ing christ almighty. Yeah, he's been really f***ing injury riddled this year, ay? 2008 is the only season since 2003 where he's missed a significant amount of games. You're positive he will break down in the future on what evidence, doctor? Once again, you clearly can't differentiate between durability issues and performance issues. Either that, or you're just pulling arbitrary junk out of thin air.

 

 

 

Admission that I stuck words in your mouth? My mockery of your ridiculous ideas flew clear over your head, and now you front this terrible attempt at saving face. If anything, you're the one placing words in my mouth with this post. I can now write you down as a hypocrite.

 

 

 

.374 OPS, .842 OPS, 15 HR. THIS ISN'T MEDIOCRE. HIS PERFORMANCE IS MEDIOCRE IF YOU LOOK AT THE HORRIBLE, MEANINGLESS, ARCHAIC STATS THAT YOU'VE BEEN CLINGING TOO.

 

I'll say it one more time. Batting average and RBI are stat abortions that completely massacre the very idea of common sense. It's one thing to just read numbers, apparently it's another to comprehend what these numbers are telling you.

 

 

 

But he gets on base, DOESN'T MAKE OUTS, and contributes to the offense positively. He can be an estrogen druggie and I wouldn't give a s*** as long the aforementioned holds true.

 

 

 

Atlanta and LA lost him through free agency. Drew left Atlanta to sign a fat deal with the Dodgers. He became too expensive for the Braves. Drew opted out of his LA deal to sign a fatter deal with Boston. LA had two outfield prospects ready to make a splash on the major league team, and had no desire to overpay for Drew as a result.

 

St. Louis the only team that cut the ties with Drew, as opposed to Drew cutting ties with them.

 

 

 

DREW CUT TIES WITH LA AND ATLANTA, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND.

 

 

 

St. Louis traded him both for pitching and

 

 

 

Jones signed a two year deal for $36 million, and they hoped to make him a reclamation project. If it didn't work, they weren't bound to him long-term. Drew would have required that they commit five years, which they didn't want to do with the likes of Matt Kemp, Andre Either, and (at the time) Delwyn Young coming through the system.

 

Comparing Manny to Drew? Really?

 

 

 

RBI are an insult to intelligence. What does this information tell you? That the batter produced a base hit that caused a runner on base, that he had no hand in putting on base, to score. The batter is credited with the base hit, rightfully so. But the batter is also credited with driving in the runner he has no connection to, which is ********. Baserunners and batters, on the same team, are almost entirely different factions in any given game situation.

 

Clutch isn't just meaningless and irrelevant, it's non-existent.

 

 

 

I know they aren't robots. That doesn't mean their hitting ability increases or decreases with a runner at X base with X outs.

 

 

 

Good, you can have the 100 instances of a meaningless statistical recording, while I focus on plate discipline, walks, getting on base, and not making outs, and come away with all the winnings.

 

 

 

Oakland Athletics, wins per season in order from 2000-2006: 91, 102, 103, 96, 91, 88, 93. Their sole offensive focus through this entire period was plate discipline, on-base percentage, and walks.

 

All with either the lowest or among the lowest payrolls in baseball.

 

Since I know the world series argument is coming next, the playoffs are a crapshoot. One bad outing by your ace in a given series can ruin your season... even if you are the better team. That's one of the reasons why a wild card team is in the WS virtually every year.

 

Currently the franchise is rebuilding, since they don't really have the financial to go get outside guys to assure they stay on stop every year.

 

 

 

Because half of baseball is still putting their money on RBI's. 65 year old baseball-lifer goons that only recognize and acknowledge names and completely dismiss common sense... they don't sway my opinion in the least.

 

 

 

I don't understand what you're asking.

 

 

 

This is the finest example yet of your strict adherence to whatever those f***s on ESPN tell you.

 

Drew gets on base (DOESN'T MAKE OUTS) at a rate similar to some of the best players in the history of the game? Oh no, that can't be right! He's not enough of a gritty dirtdog for that to make any sense!!

 

Sweet jesus.

 

 

 

If you would stop hugging batting average and RBI for two seconds, and look at something meaningful for a change, all the evidence is right there. Quality on-base percentage? Check. Quality OPS? Check. Walks? Check. Not making outs? Check.

 

You know what, let's try this another way:

 

Runs scored for each team that J.D. Drew has been a member of and played a meaningful role:

2000 Cardinals: 809

2001 Cardinals: 887 (one of his very best statistical seasons, hampered a bit by injuries)

2002 Cardinals: 787

2003 Cardinals: 876

2004 Braves: 803

2005 Dodgers: 685 (Drew played 72 games)

2006 Dodgers: 820

2007 Red Sox: 867

2008 Red Sox: 845

2009 Red Sox: 620 thus far

 

So tell me, is he just always in the right place at the right time, constantly shielded and piggy-backed by the likes of Mark McGwire, Albert Pujols, Chipper Jones, and Manny Ramirez, or is he some underlying factor in each team's run total? I think I already know your answer.

 

 

 

Unbelievable. This is like me taking Martinez's lack of stolen bases and using it to try and front a coherent argument about how unproductive he is. Wouldn't make much sense, would it?

 

Good post. A little agressive but im sure everyone is man enough to take it.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Something I forgot to mention: In 2005, the GM of the Dodgers was Paul DePodesta, who worked right under Billy Beane in Oakland for almost a decade and fully believed and practiced this "moneyball" idea(giving it that kind of name implies that it isn't rooted in simple common sense, though). Since Drew and on-base percentage are synonymous, and that's what the A's made their living on in the early part of the decade, of course DePodesta would really want him. When Drew opted out in 2007, the GM was Ned Colletti, a standard old baseball guy who held a completely different philosophy that leaned more toward "traditional" ideas.

 

So yeah, small wonder that Drew left LA and the Dodgers didn't give their left nut to try and retain him. TWO DIFFERENT GM'S WITH TWO DIFFERENT PHILOSOPHIES.

[jacksonianmarch]

I was in section 29' date=' drunk.....still screaming YOU SUCK PENNY, 3 innings after he was removed from the game.[/quote']

 

We may have heard you. I heard a Penny is a homo and a Penny sucks chant in the 5th after he was long gone

[jacksonianmarch]

enjoy the game today guys. I'll be in by the end of the game. Damn work

[Gom]

This was a fun game. Hopefully AJ can keep it going..and if he does, we go for the sweep baby!

[a700hitter]

So you don't have an anti-Drew bias and a pro-Nixon bias?

That's right I don't. You are wrong on both counts. That's why your attempt at baiting me have been unsuccessful on this issue and you continue to let me own you. I don't think that I have posted anything positive about Nixon in more than 2 years.

 

In the 2006 off-season I thought that Drew was way over-priced, and I thought the Sox should have signed Nixon on the cheap for one year and saved themselves $11-12 million until better OF options became available in 2007. The issue was $. It had nothing to do with this "Dirt Dog" issue that you are obsessed with. I was very critical of Drew's performance in 2007. At the end of July that year, he was batting under .250, with 6 Hrs and a .728 OPS. No one was happy with that. In the middle of that summer, I read an article about his son who had a disease or condition that required surgery where they had to break his bones or something horrendous and that he had to be in a full body cast for months. At that point, I realized that something else was probably affecting his play, so I didn't criticize his play for the rest of that year.

 

So, again you are 100% wrong about both of your assumptions about me being anti-Drew and Pro-Nixon, but you continue to beat that drum anyway. My continued ownage of you on this makes me giggle to myself.

 

f***ing christ almighty. Yeah' date=' he's been really f***ing injury riddled this year, ay? 2008 is the [b']only[/b] season since 2003 where he's missed a significant amount of games. You're positive he will break down in the future on what evidence, doctor? Once again, you clearly can't differentiate between durability issues and performance issues. Either that, or you're just pulling arbitrary junk out of thin air.

So the FO office will not consider that his advancing age might go hand in hand with an increased probability of injury resulting from physical wear and tear, including his prior injury problems to his knee and wrist? You don't think that would reduce his market value? Well, I am glad that you are not running the organization.

 

Admission that I stuck words in your mouth? My mockery of your ridiculous ideas flew clear over your head' date=' and now you front this terrible attempt at saving face. If anything, you're the one placing words in my mouth with this post. I can now write you down as a hypocrite.[/quote']An admission of mocking. Would that be against our rules too? Is it part of baiting? Nothing you could come up with would be over my head. It's likely to go under my head. So, why don't you just stop baiting me on this topic and find something else to do like riding your Big Wheel.

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

That's right I don't. You are wrong on both counts. That's why your attempt at baiting me have been unsuccessful on this issue and you continue to let me own you. I don't think that I have posted anything positive about Nixon in more than 2 years.

 

lol

 

In the 2006 off-season I thought that Drew was way over-priced, and I thought the Sox should have signed Nixon on the cheap for one year and saved themselves $11-12 million until better OF options became available in 2007. The issue was $.

 

Oh? The same Trot Nixon that spent 2007 platooning with the immortal Franklin Gutierrez and found him out of the majors the following season for all but eleven games? That Trot Nixon? You wanted to sign him to play right field on the cheap, in anticipation of other 'options' that may or may not become available? As opposed to a reliable on-base machine (something you clearly don't understand) in right field that doesn't require platooning, since he can lefties as well as righties? Brilliant.

 

It had nothing to do with this "Dirt Dog" issue that you are obsessed with. I was very critical of Drew's performance in 2007. At the end of July that year, he was batting under .250, with 6 Hrs and a .728 OPS. No one was happy with that.

 

No one was happy with that? No, people that were expecting him to a power hitter/average hitter/RBI machine weren't happy with that. His OBP was fine that year. His power was a little bit lacking, but didn't end up with much less HRs than he normally does.

 

Being disappointed with his performance just shows misguided expectations and a misunderstanding of the player.

 

In the middle of that summer, I read an article about his son who had a disease or condition that required surgery where they had to break his bones or something horrendous and that he had to be in a full body cast for months. At that point, I realized that something else was probably affecting his play, so I didn't criticize his play for the rest of that year.

 

Except he was getting on base pretty normally. So the most important part of his game was still going strong. Just the oh-so reliable stats known as batting average and runs batted in were seeing dips. Oh what to do.

 

You can't blame the player for the price tag the front office slapped on his forehead. Should he have been a good soldier, thought to himself 'ya know, I might not be worth this money', and told the Red Sox to lower the offer to whatever level, just so he can earn the label of 'living up to his pay'?

 

So, again you are 100% wrong about both of your assumptions about me being anti-Drew and Pro-Nixon, but you continue to beat that drum anyway. My continued ownage of you on this makes me giggle to myself.

 

Your continued, misinformed yapping to yourself about how much of a pwnag3 machine you are makes me giggle as well. As does your off-target analysis.

 

So the FO office will not consider that his advancing age might go hand in hand with an increased probability of injury resulting from physical wear and tear, including his prior injury problems to his knee and wrist? You don't think that would reduce his market value?

 

Next year is the last year of Ortiz's contract, he's shown flashes this year and could end up with 25 HR, several teams out there could use lefty bats, when on the ball he's better than a lot of other DH's... no, I don't think it will affect his value too much. Only his play can do that, since he's played in about 95% of the games this year after that catastrophe of an injury.

 

This theory probably makes Victor Martinez damaged goods as well, since he got hurt and played in 73 games in 2008. Amirite?

 

Well, I am glad that you are not running the organization.

 

Back at you. Forgoing proven commodities with skills that are valuable to a baseball team in favor signing over-the-hill dirtdogs on the short and cheap to temporarily fill the created voids, essentially creating an annual revolving door at the given position, and stashing every single inexperienced prospect in AAA doesn't sound like a great gameplan. But what do I know? I don't play beer league.

 

An admission of mocking. Would that be against our rules too?

 

Mocking your ideas is against the rules?

 

Is it part of baiting?

 

Apparently not, since the mods haven't attempted to put the kabosh on it.

 

Nothing you could come up with would be over my head.

 

Aside from common sense, maybe.

 

It's likely to go under my head. So, why don't you just stop baiting me on this topic and find something else to do like riding your Big Wheel.

 

But I'm just FUNNING with you!

[Dipre]

Holy s***, drop it already.

 

(Still, the Trot Nixon bit was fantastic, 5 stars).

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Kill some terrorists in Call of Duty 4

 

Clean

Halo > Call Of Doodie

[a700hitter]

lol

Oh? The same Trot Nixon that spent 2007 platooning with the immortal Franklin Gutierrez and found him out of the majors the following season for all but eleven games? That Trot Nixon? You wanted to sign him to play right field on the cheap, in anticipation of other 'options' that may or may not become available? As opposed to a reliable on-base machine (something you clearly don't understand) in right field that doesn't require platooning, since he can lefties as well as righties? Brilliant.

And what has any of this got to do with your accusations that I think Drew is a "pussy" and the whole "dirt dog" angle of yours? You can't even stay on the topic that you have been baiting me about. I never said that I was right about wanting to keep Nixon on the cheap in 2006. I'm just telling you as a fact that that was my opinion at the time (2006) and it had nothing to do with grit and toughness and all that stuff that you have been accusing me of. Triple owned for you not even being a consistent baiter.

 

No one was happy with that? No, people that were expecting him to a power hitter/average hitter/RBI machine weren't happy with that. His OBP was fine that year. His power was a little bit lacking, but didn't end up with much less HRs than he normally does.

 

Being disappointed with his performance just shows misguided expectations and a misunderstanding of the player.

 

Except he was getting on base pretty normally. So the most important part of his game was still going strong. Just the oh-so reliable stats known as batting average and runs batted in were seeing dips. Oh what to do.

In my post, I mentioned what his performance was like by the end of July 2007 and the criticism he was getting at that time. He was hitting .248 with an OBP of .354 SLG .375 and OPS .725. All were well below his career averages, which were our expectations. Even his OBP was down 36 points from his career average. I never even mentioned RBI in my post, but put more words in my mouth. The logic in your posts is in a death spiral

 

Next year is the last year of Ortiz's contract' date=' he's shown flashes this year and could end up with 25 HR, several teams out there could use lefty bats, when on the ball he's better than a lot of other DH's... no, I don't think it will affect his value too much. Only his play can do that, since he's played in about 95% of the games this year after that catastrophe of an injury.[/quote']So, being mid-30's with major injuries over the last two seasons would not cause you to put a different value on him when negotiating his next contract. I realize that you are in such a rage that you can't think straight about now, but you can't be serious. No matter what he does from now until the end of the season and next season, he'll be worth less than if he was age 30 with the same productivity and no injury history.

 

But what do I know? I don't play beer league.

You probably can't.

[Dipre]

Drop it, Clint.

[a700hitter]

Drop it' date=' Clint.[/quote']I don't mind getting engaged in a discussion where someone challenges my views, but I don't like being repeatedly baited about an opinion that I don't adhere to. Jr. needs to let it drop, because I'm not going to let him put words in my mouth or tell me what I mean. I post here plenty. If people want to know what I think, they need only read my posts. If they are not clear on something, I'm more than willing to clarify, but no one is going to tell me what I mean.

[soxfan17881]

Holy s***, drop it already.

 

(Still, the Trot Nixon bit was fantastic, 5 stars).

 

Yeah. Please.

[a700hitter]

Yeah. Please.

Done

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

And what has any of this got to do with your accusations that I think Drew is a "pussy" and the whole "dirt dog" angle of yours? You can't even stay on the topic that you have been baiting me about.

 

Epic copout.

 

I never said that I was right about wanting to keep Nixon on the cheap in 2006. I'm just telling you as a fact that that was my opinion at the time (2006) and it had nothing to do with grit and toughness and all that stuff that you have been accusing me of. Triple owned for you not even being a consistent baiter.

 

Except that Nixon theory that you now acknowledge as wrong, falls in line with many other asinine propositions you blurt out to this day and seem to have plenty of confidence in.

 

In my post, I mentioned what his performance was like by the end of July 2007 and the criticism he was getting at that time. He was hitting .248 with an OBP of .354 SLG .375 and OPS .725. All were well below his career averages, which were our expectations. Even his OBP was down 36 points from his career average. I never even mentioned RBI in my post, but put more words in my mouth. The logic in your posts is in a death spiral

 

And most of us knew he could and would do better. On-base players like Drew aren't streaky players. It stays consistent. It was his first year in Boston, the most intense market he's ever played in. His performance wasn't premium, but all the signs were there that he would improve, and he has. So no one was really 'unhappy' as much as 'patient', and knowing that he'll rebound.

 

*waits for defiant 'but that's all I was saying and what I meant all along' retort, when it obviously wasn't*

 

I never said you mentioned RBI in your post, so your reading comprehension continues to be laughably terrible. Possibly you're getting antsy and defensive over being called out on your massacre of analysis, and are that much more prone to pointing fingers.

 

So, being mid-30's with major injuries over the last two seasons would not cause you to put a different value on him when negotiating his next contract.

 

No, only his performance would dictate that, SINCE 2008 IS THE ONLY f***ING SEASON SINCE 2003 WHERE HE'S MISSED EXTENDED TIME FOR ANYTHING. Yes, that includes this season. Players get injured, and they recover. I know, what a f***ed up concept that is.

 

I realize that you are in such a rage that you can't think straight about now, but you can't be serious.

 

Lol, classic a700. SEE, UR ANGREE RITE NAO, U SAID FUK, AND THIS IS WY U HAVE NO KREDIBILLITEE ON THIS ISSUE.

 

Aren't you the guy that normally slams people for playing internet psychologist, too?

 

No matter what he does from now until the end of the season and next season, he'll be worth less than if he was age 30 with the same productivity and no injury history.

 

Oh no, he missed time in 2008 (which, by the time it's for anyone to talk contract with him, will be two years in the past). This whole health thing applies to V-Mart too, right? He'll be lucky to get any sort of good contract with all that missed time in 2008.

 

You probably can't.

 

And don't want to.

[a700hitter]

Epic copout.

 

 

 

Except that Nixon theory that you now acknowledge as wrong, falls in line with many other asinine propositions you blurt out to this day and seem to have plenty of confidence in.

 

 

 

And most of us knew he could and would do better. On-base players like Drew aren't streaky players. It stays consistent. It was his first year in Boston, the most intense market he's ever played in. His performance wasn't premium, but all the signs were there that he would improve, and he has. So no one was really 'unhappy' as much as 'patient', and knowing that he'll rebound.

 

*waits for defiant 'but that's all I was saying and what I meant all along' retort, when it obviously wasn't*

 

I never said you mentioned RBI in your post, so your reading comprehension continues to be laughably terrible. Possibly you're getting antsy and defensive over being called out on your massacre of analysis, and are that much more prone to pointing fingers.

 

 

 

No, only his performance would dictate that, SINCE 2008 IS THE ONLY f***ING SEASON SINCE 2003 WHERE HE'S MISSED EXTENDED TIME FOR ANYTHING. Yes, that includes this season. Players get injured, and they recover. I know, what a f***ed up concept that is.

 

 

 

Lol, classic a700. SEE, UR ANGREE RITE NAO, U SAID FUK, AND THIS IS WY U HAVE NO KREDIBILLITEE ON THIS ISSUE.

 

Aren't you the guy that normally slams people for playing internet psychologist, too?

 

 

 

Oh no, he missed time in 2008 (which, by the time it's for anyone to talk contract with him, will be two years in the past). This whole health thing applies to V-Mart too, right? He'll be lucky to get any sort of good contract with all that missed time in 2008.

 

 

 

And don't want to.

.and I'll let you have the last word.