Official Red Sox offseason thread

[Dojji]

A righthanded version of the same guy would be nice off the bench right now though

[Dipre]

A righthanded version of the same guy would be nice off the bench right now though

 

You mean Rocco Baldelli?

 

Health issues aside he's exactly that.

[Dojji]

A healthy Rocco Baldelli would be a huge asset, but we don't have one.

 

Failing reasonable efforts to find a healthy version, i wouldn't mind at all if we brought Baldelli back next year.

[jacksonianmarch]

A healthy Baldelli gets a starting nod on some teams.

[Dipre]

A healthy Baldelli gets a starting nod on some teams.

 

Yeah but David Murphy's a better fit for this team than he is, right?

 

Right?

[BSN07]

Listen this may be a dumb question, but what were Rocco's injurys this season? I remember something with the quad when he was at 3B(running), and there was something else I believe. Non of it had to do with his medical issues did it? Was he never not available because of it this season?

[jacksonianmarch]

Yeah but David Murphy's a better fit for this team than he is, right?

 

Right?

 

Yes, he is. Because JD Drew usually needs a few days off to a week off when he gets dinged up. And Baldelli isnt equipped to play on consecutive days

[Dipre]

Yes' date=' he is. Because JD Drew usually needs a few days off to a week off when he gets dinged up. And Baldelli isnt equipped to play on consecutive days[/quote']

 

Oh.My.God.

 

LOL.

[Dojji]

Speaking of backup outfielders has anyone heard anything about Jon Van Every? he's a nice piece of depth to have on hand and if he hadn't gone down with an injury or something they probably would not have had to rush Josh Reddick this year. It'd be nice to have him back to provide a few at bats and defensive appearances around the edges the way he's done in the past couple seasons.

[jacksonianmarch]

I thought they had to DFA him?

[BSN07]

Speaking of backup outfielders has anyone heard anything about Jon Van Every?

 

He rates about a 3 on the "DS".

[a700hitter]

Come on' date=' I didn't say that. You used his 1 win against .500+ teams as a negative, when in reality he's much better against good teams. That's all.[/quote']He has just not shown any consistency at the ML level. Until he does, I'm not going to be crowing about the improvement of our rotation.

[Dojji]

I thought they had to DFA him?

 

They do that to him every year and for some reason he keeps coming back.

 

DFA doesn't mean a guy's in the trash can. He can accept assignment after all. And a guy like JVE or Nick Green could find himself back on the team if there's a need so sometimes they decide to.

 

BTW I want to say that as mediocre as Green was as a starting shortstop I hope he's somewhere in the system next year. For a guy who was originally signed as an MLFA and was better known as a second baseman, he really didn't embarrass himself for the most part. And for all the talk of errors his final UZR/150 for the year was +6. Which isn't awful.

 

It got bad towards the end for a number of reasons but I would hope we have him or someone like him available to call on. Especially if we keep Gonzo, because you KNOW he's going to have at least one back-related injury next year. Throw Lowrie's wrist in there too and that AAA infield spot could actually become important.

[Cocos Disciples]

JVE was released in July.

[Dojji]

Meh. They'll find someone else, but I always thought the guy got a raw deal. He seemed far more talented than he ever got any credit for and if minor league numbers are any guide he could have cracked a lot of rosters if given a chance.

[Cocos Disciples]

I'm not too heartbroken. He's almost 30 and we have better options.

[Dojji]

Yeah, but you know me, I'm always rooting for that guy who works hard and never got his chance to get it and excel. Probably why I like Tim Thomas so much.

 

Someone tell me though, why a centerfielder who hit 26 HR's in AAA at age 25 wasn't given at least a bench role by SOMEONE before the age of 30. JVE's a competent defender in CF so there isn't exactly a ton to lose -- worst case scenario, he's a defensive guy. if he blows up, what exactly have you lost?

[SCM33]

Yeah, but you know me, I'm always rooting for that guy who works hard and never got his chance to get it and excel. Probably why I like Tim Thomas so much.

 

Someone tell me though, why a centerfielder who hit 26 HR's in AAA at age 25 wasn't given at least a bench role by SOMEONE before the age of 30. JVE's a competent defender in CF so there isn't exactly a ton to lose -- worst case scenario, he's a defensive guy. if he blows up, what exactly have you lost?

 

He hit 26 HR in AAA at the age of 28, not 25. Someone who hits 26 HR at the age of 28 has Joe Vitiello syndrome. An all star career in the AAAA range (except Vitiello was three times the hitter Van Every is).

[Dojji]

Sorry, my bad. He hit 27 HR's in AA at age 25 in 2005, and instead of getting a shot at a bench role or even at least promoted to AAA was asked to repeat the level.

 

And the answer is that he was an older prospect who struck out a ton, but those are the guys you put on the bench, especially if they're competent centerfielders who can hit for some power. At the very least, you MAKE THE EFFORT TO FIND OUT if he can be useful in a role like that. If he can't, so be it, at least you know that, but if he can, a guy like Van Every can be danged useful.

 

Oh well. It's hardly like JVE's case is in any way unique. There are guys just like him in pretty much every minor league system. I just feel like he did have a better than normal shot to be useful because he plays a fairly premium position and has the downside of a competent defender.

[SCM33]

Sorry, my bad. He hit 27 HR's in AA at age 25 in 2005, and instead of getting a shot at a bench role or even at least promoted to AAA was asked to repeat the level.

 

And the answer is that he was an older prospect who struck out a ton, but those are the guys you put on the bench, especially if they're competent centerfielders who can hit for some power. At the very least, you MAKE THE EFFORT TO FIND OUT if he can be useful in a role like that. If he can't, so be it, at least you know that, but if he can, a guy like Van Every can be danged useful.

 

Oh well. It's hardly like JVE's case is in any way unique. There are guys just like him in pretty much every minor league system. I just feel like he did have a better than normal shot to be useful because he plays a fairly premium position and has the downside of a competent defender.

 

Easy bud, I wasnt attacking your post. I like the underachiever too. One of my favorite players was a "older" minor leaguer who put up big minor league numbers: http://www.baseball-reference.com/minors/player.cgi?id=daubac001bri

[TheMino007]

Didn't know where else to post this but........ it looks like Kelly will finally be exclusively pitching from now on in the minors. http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/extras/extra_bases/

[BSN07]

It's already in the minor league forum

[ehaz]

Angels are reportedly very intrigued by Bay as are the Seattle Mariners. Both teams have had conversations about Bay.

 

What this means for the Red Sox: If Bay walks, and the Atlanta Braves do not sign another type A free agent, the Sox hold the 20 (Wagner), (18 or 28 if Bay signs with LA or SEA) and two 1st round sandwhich picks around the 30-40 pick range. These picks are guaranteed, no matter how many type A's the Sox sign, we will get these picks if Bay walks. This is partly why I've always preferred Holliday>Bay. (that and he's just a better player IMO)

[TheMino007]

I always thought a rebuilding year was a year you were expected to be terrible, a year in which you shed a lot of salary and your old guard of players and trot out there young guys and get them experience for the years beyond that year. This is not that. The old guard that was in peak form during are World Series runs are in decline or gone, guys like Schilling, Rameriz, Ortiz, Lowell, etc. and the problem is we don't have any prospects that are Major League ready to take their place next year. All our best prospects are in Double A and Single A. So what are the Sox gonna do, stick with our very good core and just put in a rentals for the next couple of years and be satisfied with barely making or missing the playoffs and having a winning record? I think that is a terrible waste of our core talent. This could be the last year of Papelbon, Beckett, and Martinez in a Sox uniform, these guys are very talented and it would be waste to just surround them with mediocrity. Also, you want to waste some of Pedrioa's, Youkilis's, Lester's, best seasons on team that isn't going anywhere if it stands pact by making small splashes in the offseason? Sounds stupid to me. Also, these kids in Double and Single A, guys like Kelly, Westemorland, Iglesias, Anderson, etc. are at least 2, even three years away from being productive major league players. You want a stop gap solution and above mediocrity for that long? 2 years of that? No way. You make a a couple of tweaks to this team and your right back atop the American League. Money should be no objective and trading these young prospects for young guys who only in their 20's and proven or a dependable guy like Roy Halladay is the way to go. Theo shouldn't sit on his hands and do nothing, this transitional year thing is a load of crap.

[Dipre]

I always thought a rebuilding year was a year you were expected to be terrible' date=' a year in which you shed a lot of salary and your old guard of players and trot out there young guys and get them experience for the years beyond that year. This is not that. The old guard that was in peak form during are World Series runs are in decline or gone, guys like Schilling, Rameriz, Ortiz, Lowell, etc. and the problem is we don't have any prospects that are Major League ready to take their place next year. All our best prospects are in Double A and Single A. So what are the Sox gonna do, stick with our very good core and just put in a rentals for the next couple of years and be satisfied with barely making or missing the playoffs and having a winning record? I think that is a terrible waste of our core talent. This could be the last year of Papelbon, Beckett, and Martinez in a Sox uniform, these guys are very talented and it would be waste to just surround them with mediocrity. Also, you want to waste some of Pedrioa's, Youkilis's, Lester's, best seasons on team that isn't going anywhere if it stands pact by making small splashes in the offseason? Sounds stupid to me. Also, these kids in Double and Single A, guys like Kelly, Westemorland, Iglesias, Anderson, etc. are at least 2, even three years away from being productive major league players. You want a stop gap solution and above mediocrity for that long? 2 years of that? No way. You make a a couple of tweaks to this team and your right back atop the American League. Money should be no objective and trading these young prospects for young guys who only in their 20's and proven or a dependable guy like Roy Halladay is the way to go. Theo shouldn't sit on his hands and do nothing, this transitional year thing is a load of crap.[/quote']

 

Roy Halladay is not a good investment of this team's top prospects. Simple as that.

[GWSoxFan]

I always thought a rebuilding year was a year you were expected to be terrible' date=' a year in which you shed a lot of salary and your old guard of players and trot out there young guys and get them experience for the years beyond that year. This is not that. The old guard that was in peak form during are World Series runs are in decline or gone, guys like Schilling, Rameriz, Ortiz, Lowell, etc. and the problem is we don't have any prospects that are Major League ready to take their place next year. All our best prospects are in Double A and Single A. So what are the Sox gonna do, stick with our very good core and just put in a rentals for the next couple of years and be satisfied with barely making or missing the playoffs and having a winning record? I think that is a terrible waste of our core talent. This could be the last year of Papelbon, Beckett, and Martinez in a Sox uniform, these guys are very talented and it would be waste to just surround them with mediocrity. Also, you want to waste some of Pedrioa's, Youkilis's, Lester's, best seasons on team that isn't going anywhere if it stands pact by making small splashes in the offseason? Sounds stupid to me. Also, these kids in Double and Single A, guys like Kelly, Westemorland, Iglesias, Anderson, etc. are at least 2, even three years away from being productive major league players. You want a stop gap solution and above mediocrity for that long? 2 years of that? No way. You make a a couple of tweaks to this team and your right back atop the American League. Money should be no objective and trading these young prospects for young guys who only in their 20's and proven or a dependable guy like Roy Halladay is the way to go. Theo shouldn't sit on his hands and do nothing, this transitional year thing is a load of crap.[/quote']

 

This team is still probably going to win 85-95 games even if they do nothing. The free agent class this year is very shallow. There is not one person in this class that is worth $100 million. I'd be unwilling to spend more than 60-70 million on any of Holliday, Bay, or Lackey, and I think the Red Sox feel the same way. Considering the Angels will take a bit of a hit this year in losing Figgins, Guerero, and possibly Lackey, and the AL Central is wide open considering Detroit is selling off some of its players, the Sox could keep the team they have right now (finding a platoon for Hermida in left and keeping Lowell at third) and still have a decent shot of making the ALCS as the wild card. You pool the money that you would have spent this year and use it to re-sign Beckett and Martinez, or look into signing Halladay, Mauer, Crawford, or another of the plethora of free agents available next year. Especially since the money may go even further next year if the economy doesn't rebound. Its really not a bad strategy.

[jacksonianmarch]

Its a losing strategy. If the sox do not resign Bay and let Holliday walk while not filling the offensive hole then you are essentially giving up on the season. A season where you have Pedroia, Youkilis, Ellsbury, and VMart in their primes while also having a top two in the rotation that is ace1 and ace2 and a lights out closer. The sox dont need a major overhaul, they just need some reinforcement

[Dipre]

Re-sign Bay/sign Holliday, sign Beltre, get a starter who can eat innings. /offseason.

[TheMino007]

Its a losing strategy. If the sox do not resign Bay and let Holliday walk while not filling the offensive hole then you are essentially giving up on the season. A season where you have Pedroia' date=' Youkilis, Ellsbury, and VMart in their primes while also having a top two in the rotation that is ace1 and ace2 and a lights out closer. The sox dont need a major overhaul, they just need some reinforcement[/quote']

 

Exactly. Its wasting our core group of guys by just signing rental players for a year. If all the other teams are getting weaker, why don't we take advantage of that and get stronger?