Pitching Staff "07

[Cityofchampions33]

While I don't trust Matsuzaka until he does it in the major leagues, the Sox have to take a shot at him. He's 25 and obviously has good stuff. He MAY become Irabu, but even if they get a Nomo-esque production from him he'll be worth the money.

 

I say get a veteran to mentor Craig Hansen in the closer's role and turn the job over to him mid-season. Then have that veteran set up for Hansen for the rest of the year.

 

I'd say if you're in a predicting mood, put more money on them getting Meche or someone his caliber than Schmidt. I don't see the Sox outbidding the other teams needing an ace.

 

I agree, Matsuzaka coudl be great or bad, though fiw e could work out an incentive laden deal for the money he wants, Im all for it, As for Hansen, i think we already ahev the veteran in Foulke, and if both can be solid next eyar, then our bullpen will be much better. Schmidt woudl be awesome, and wierd because I know him personally, so who knwos maybe I coudl get everyoen some free s*** fi we sign him.

[ksushi]

Foulke is gone at the end of the season. I don't know why anyone would want him back.

[riverside sluggers]

I agree' date=' Matsuzaka coudl be great or bad, though fiw e could work out an incentive laden deal for the money he wants, Im all for it, As for Hansen, i think we already ahev the veteran in Foulke, and if both can be solid next eyar, then our bullpen will be much better. Schmidt woudl be awesome, and wierd because I know him personally, so who knwos maybe I coudl get everyoen some free s*** fi we sign him.[/quote']

 

Ive said it before, but check out this guy. Thats the veteran Id like to see added to the Boston Pen

 

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/players/6015/career;_ylt=Ai2cCSJQ9JonF1fQ2uc7DwOFCLcF

[Cityofchampions33]

Foulke is gone at the end of the season. I don't know why anyone would want him back.

My abd, I thought he ahd a year left on his contract, forgot. And eyah, Speier is a gerat pickup if we can, he's last eyars Farnesworth.

[example1]

My abd' date=' I thought he ahd a year left on his contract, forgot. And eyah, Speier is a gerat pickup if we can, he's last eyars Farnesworth.[/quote']

 

I thought Foulke had a player option for next year.

 

I also heard he was thinking retirement.

 

:dunno:

[ksushi]

The option situation with Foulke is pretty complicated I think. At the end of it though, the Sox can and will wash their hands of him at the end of the year. He was wonderful in '04. He will always have my respect for that. He was a true pitcher and the way he pitched in the playoffs was very admirable. He isn't that Keith Foulke anymore though and there really isn't any room for him on a team that wants to win a world series anymore because it seems like he just doesn't have the commitment and he has had some unfortunate health issues. I love him still though.

 

Speier would be a good pick up, so would Coco Cordero.

[a700hitter]

If Speier is available, the Red Sox should jump on it.

[mar_022]

I live in milwaukee, and i agree completely with KSUSHI...Frankie Cordero would be a great acquisition. He has been lights out here since he was given the closer job...i think he just needed a change of venue. He can really get out of jams too...i saw him save the game with todd helton on 3rd with no one out...struck out the side...i'd love to see him...he could even close if Paps moves into the rotation, which seems to be a growing possibility and likelihood, at least according to him

[mar_022]

i really hope the FO goes after a solid closer (or two and put one in SU role) like Joe Borowski and Frankie Cordero (if available). There are a lot of options out there...Kerry Wood, Eric Gagne (i'd love an incentive-based deal for him)...and i bet the FO would like the cheaper price for many of these guys since there is such a demand. plus, i want paps in the rotation. my pen:

 

gagne

borowski

speier

corey

MDC

hansen

tavarez

breslow

[jacksonianmarch]

I guess I'm thinking of those fans that Mr. Crunchy refers to as the "pink hats and cell phones" when I think about the FO playing with house money.

 

The stream of revenues flowing from these "fans", many of whom jumped on the bandwagon after 2004, is strong..and those folks seem to care less about the product...as long as they can "see and be seen" at Fenway and do the wave and sing "Sweet Caroline" they'll plow their dough into the Sox coffers.

 

Eventually, as you point out, that goodwill will fade if the team goes on a prolonged slide. I just don't want to see the Sox muddle through 90 win seasons with 'fair' teams that have a $100m+ payroll and maybe make the playoffs now and then but aren't equipped to go anywhere.

 

I can stand a rebuild...or I can take them going all out after FA to try and win it...but I'd like to be able to tell which direction they're going in.

 

 

That is exactly the point I was making on another site. The FO is totally bipolar. In one instance they wont deal their prospects and in another they will. They have gutted their entire farm system and have got nothing to show for it except for Papelbon. Sanchez and Gonzalez are excelling in Pittsburgh, Sanchez and Ramirez are nasty in FLA, Meredith and Bard are excelling in SD, and Marte looks like he will be a cornerstone of their franchise for years to come. While the sox refused to deal guys like Lester (granted, cancer is something you cannot predict, but he will be set back for a long time), Hansen who is a total headcase, DelCarmen who looks like he could be a pretty good MR one day, and Pedroia who the early polls are insufficient to make a judgement on him. Their dabbling in dealing has left them with one high end prospect at AAA next season (two if Hansen is there for the year) in Ellsbury and nothing else above single A ball. They got nothing to show for it. At the same time, they let their top dogs walk and replaced them with less expensive options at the time, but became more expensive headaches when they totally blew and needed to be replaced. I am completely dumbfounded by the direction of the team. They have an old core whose window is maybe 1-2 yrs long with a bunch of green guys who even if they hit all projections will never be core players. If the sox FO does not want to go for the homerun this offseason and do a complete (and expensive) overhaul until the single A crop is ready to reap, then they wont have a good MLB team with no reinforcements on the way for 2 yrs. That is why I said that the sox would be better off with a full force explosion of the team. It will hasten their rise to power instead of slowly see them drift from 2nd to 3rd to the league's basement with nothing to show for it.

 

Here is my position.

Deal Manny to the angels for Wood, Colon (contract swap) and McPherson. Have Colon pitch once he is healthy and then deal him for something further down the line. Send Schilling to Texas for one of the trio of Diamond, Danks, or Volquez. Deal Papi to the Tigers for Humberto Sanchez and Cameron Maybin. Send Lowell to the Padres for Linebrink and then deal Linebrink to the Braves for one of their young prospects (maybe Saltamacchia?) along with Coco (if they are willing to toss Davies into the equation). That would leave the sox with an infield of Vaitek (with Kottaras not far behind, although he is not uniformly considered a high end prospect either defensively or offensively), Youks at 1st, Pedroia at 2b, Wood at SS, McPherson at 3b, an OF left to right of Pena, Ellsbury, Maybin and a DH of Saltamacchia. The rotation would be Beckett, Papelbon, Danks/Diamond/Volquez, Davies, and Lester (if he gets better). The bullpen can have Emart, MDC, and Hansen in it to essentially have a low pressure season. Take all the pressure off these guys, bill it as a rebuilding year, tell the fans that the mission is to progress to the future rather than win now and essentially hope that the team can come together by the end of 2008. Then make a few splashes in the FA period and be ready for a long run of internally built success for 2009, when those high end prospects in single A are ready. I know it is not reality, but I think that would help give direction to a completely lost FO. One that is enjoying the profits, but falling asleep at the wheel of a 125 mil team. This team needs an overhaul, whether it is going to be for right now and expensive or for the future and cheap is up to them. Putting this garbage on the field is unacceptable

[riverside sluggers]

Bard shouldnt even be considered a "top prospect" that was traded away needlessly by the Red Sox

 

-- before this season, he played 3 years in the big leagues with the Guardians. Known during that time as a weak hitting catcher who's best served as a backup. No one & I repeat no one could have predicted the offensive outburst he has had with San Diego.

 

-- 10 passed balls in the month of April (most coming with runners on 3rd) got Sox execs flustered of the thought of this happening season long for Wakefield. At the time, getting Belli back was the better option

 

Ok back with a f***ing EDIT here... yes lets deal Papi, one of the most ridiculous Sox fan trade proposals I have heard yet. IMO there will be riots in the streets of Boston if the Sox FO trades him away.

[Mr Crunchy]

i think foulke has a buyout of 1.5M and a player option of 3.5M

his contract is 7M if he stays and it appears it would cost us 5M to cut him loose

 

hes been pretty decent since they brought him back and maybe an offseason to heal his knees properly and he may have a something left in the tank

that being said

what are our viable options??

hansen??

mdc??

matt clement!!!

 

the entire world knows we'll need a closer come november

they wont be cheap

[TheKilo]

Barry Zito please. Dude has proven he can do it in the AL for years.

[riverside sluggers]

i think foulke has a buyout of 1.5M and a player option of 3.5M

his contract is 7M if he stays and it appears it would cost us 5M to cut him loose

 

hes been pretty decent since they brought him back and maybe an offseason to heal his knees properly and he may have a something left in the tank

that being said

what are our viable options??

hansen??

mdc??

matt clement!!!

 

the entire world knows we'll need a closer come november

they wont be cheap

 

He has a 2.45 ERA since the All-Star Break, including 8.1 scoreless innings in September. Its beyond me why Timlin is the closer in Papelbon's absence, even though Timlin seems to be having a mini-rebound. If Foulke continues his recent success, maybe in the best interest to give Foulke a second chance. The free agent closer's market is pretty much bare

[Mr Crunchy]

agreed

it was obivious foulke didnt have it in march and thats why paps got the gig

and not to sound like a sceptical prick but when youre on the roids and suddenly get off them it takes a long long while for your body to heal

giambi and bonds are 2 of the obvious cases

but

nomar nixon and foulke i suspected here in boston amongst others

(damon and petey have much bigger hat sizes than they did as rookies)

no proof

nor do i give a s***

but its merely an explanation for their sudden frailness and lack of productivity

 

if foulke has his control and can hit 90 on the gun

then he'll be effective enuff to win the closers job and regain some credibility he lost during the last 2seasons

 

as i said

if we cut him its 5M?

if we keep him its 7M?

it would be worth it in my opinion to keep him here and see what hes got in march

[Beckett95]

1. Schilling

2. Matsuzaka

3. Papelbon

4. Beckett

5. Wakefield

 

 

long--John Thomson/Clement

lefty--Breslow

6/7th--Tavarez

6/7th--Justin Speier

8th--Hansen/Delcarmen

8th--Fransisco Cordero

CL--Brad Lidge (trade some package with Crisp, maybe Clement, and Delcarmen/Hansen)

 

If Lidge sucks, work Papelbon back into the closers role and put Tavarez/Thomson/Clement into the rotation. Lester, if healthy, can take over for whichever one of our starters either sucks or gets injured (probably Wake) at the time he comes back.

[a700hitter]

1. Schilling

2. Matsuzaka

3. Papelbon

4. Beckett

5. Wakefield

 

 

long--John Thomson/Clement

lefty--Breslow

6/7th--Tavarez

6/7th--Justin Speier

8th--Hansen/Delcarmen

8th--Fransisco Cordero

CL--Brad Lidge (trade some package with Crisp, maybe Clement, and Delcarmen/Hansen)

 

If Lidge sucks, work Papelbon back into the closers role and put Tavarez/Thomson/Clement into the rotation. Lester, if healthy, can take over for whichever one of our starters either sucks or gets injured at the time he comes back.

If Lidge sucks, you could move Cordero into the closers role. Cordero, Lidge, and Speier would be three major additions to the bullpen. I think the FO could make this happen. The only problem is that each of these guys might want the closer's job.

[riverside sluggers]

No doubt Cordero would be a great choice, but he does have 2007 as an option year. Id be surprised if the Brewers dont pick that up.

[jimmycarter05]

I'd like to see the FO go after guys like Brad Hasley, Kevin Gregg, and Gavin Floyd for the 5th starter spot and bullpen jobs, they wouldn' t cost much to get.

[AirPantapas]

Schilling

Mussina(two year deal)

Beckett

Papelbon

Wakefield

[ImissPedro]

Schilling

Mussina(two year deal)

Beckett

Papelbon

Wakefield

 

sign mussina at 38?? He'd to it cause he's said that he wants to make it to 300 wins, I doubt cashman would let him walk though

[Papelbon58]

1. Schilling

2. Matsuzaka

3. Papelbon

4. Beckett

5. Wakefield

 

 

long--John Thomson/Clement

lefty--Breslow

6/7th--Tavarez

6/7th--Justin Speier

8th--Hansen/Delcarmen

8th--Fransisco Cordero

CL--Brad Lidge (trade some package with Crisp, maybe Clement, and Delcarmen/Hansen)

 

If Lidge sucks, work Papelbon back into the closers role and put Tavarez/Thomson/Clement into the rotation. Lester, if healthy, can take over for whichever one of our starters either sucks or gets injured (probably Wake) at the time he comes back.

 

If we can get Cordero, forget about Lidge, he is a headcase. Plus, I would say we have about a 1 percent chance of getting both

[AirPantapas]

sign mussina at 38?? He'd to it cause he's said that he wants to make it to 300 wins' date=' I doubt cashman would let him walk though[/quote']

 

So, Schilling is a year older and he can still pitch, besides its only a two year deal so its not like he would Randy Johnson us.

[mar_022]

So' date=' Schilling is a year older and he can still pitch, besides its only a two year deal so its not like he would Randy Johnson us.[/quote']

 

agreed, i'd take moose for 2 years anyday...but as previously noted he probably will resign w/ yanks

[a700hitter]

agreed' date=' i'd take moose for 2 years anyday...but as previously noted he probably will resign w/ yanks[/quote']Only a clearly incompetent FO would let one of its stars walk to the competition.

[jsinger121]

Significant damage found by Dr. James Andrews in Clement's shoulder.

 

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/redSox/?p=737

[Sox Fan on Cape]

Significant damage found by Dr. James Andrews in Clement's shoulder.

 

http://www.bostonherald.com/blogs/redSox/?p=737[/quote

 

That's interesting. But it does beg the question of why it wasn't done earlier in the season ?

[jsinger121]

Because I don't think it showed up on the MRI. They found tears in his rotator cuff and his labrum.

[adam123]

i think we just need to admit we made mistakes breaking up the o4 team we would have no pitching problem and still have our core of player .. we could use dlowe pete and arroyo we would still be in lead in al east but no ... come on d lowe did not even get a contract offer .. and he was probably are most solid pitcher gave us saves middel relief and starts ... imagine schill , pete , beckett, dlowe wake , arroyo now thats what a staff should be

[schillingouttheks]

It's very hard to read one very long post with multiple elipses. Please try to be more coherent in the future, your points become abnormally clearer by simply using correct grammar and punctuation.

 

D-Lowe was not our most solid pitcher. Not by a long shot. He was big in the post-season, but if he was actually a "solid" pitcher during the season we wouldn't have had any trouble getting into the playoffs. It was a race until near the end of the season for the final playoff spot, and D-Lowe during the season dragged us down some.

 

If you think having D-Lowe and Arroyo would keep us in the AL East lead this year, you have another thing coming. Just about everyone went down at the same time and that helped our team crumble towards the beginning of the stretch run to the playoffs. D-Lowe and Arroyo would have been getting lit up in the AL East. You can say whatever you want about his quality starts and whatnot, but once the batters in the NL Central figured him out he was a steaming pile of crap over in Cinci.

 

The only 2 people that I miss from breaking up the '04 team are Petey and Damon, bar none. Those were mistakes. I swear, if Damon is still hitting at approximately a .290 clip scoring runs like mad for the Yankees in his final year on his contract, that will not settle nicely at all with me. In fact, I almost hope it does happen, because I want the front office to get slapped in the face and learn that they don't mess with talent. You keep it. It's ok though, because this year the FO will be watching Pedro and Damon in the playoffs this year, possibly even facing off in the world series. I can feel the sting on their cheeks already.