David Wells question

[elsrbueno]

Do any of you guys out there get the impression that we may have just rounded out our roster right now and will be giving the young players a chance to make the team in Spring Training. I cannot fathom why it has taken so long for the front office to pull the trigger on a trade for a CF and to trade Wells, who has demanded a trade. Someone sleeping in the office?

 

Nobody REALLY knows what's going on (except the real insiders who don't go blathering to reporters usually) but my guess is that the right deal hasn't come along yet. Teams like the Devil Rays have ALWAYS asked for too much, which is why they don't make a lot of trades. Lugo and Gathright, a couple guys who would seem to make sense for the Red Sox, are commanding way too much talent from the Devil Rays so the Red Sox moved on.

 

If talks with Seattle started with Lester or Papelbon, they probably stopped there. Keep in mind that the Red Sox supposedly balked at trading Lester for Johnson a few years ago, and again when the Beckett talks came about. Papelbon is going to be on the team THIS YEAR, and Lester's not far off.

 

My guess is that teams are simply asking for too much for their guys. The Red Sox are obviously trying to hold out for the right solution, not the quick solution.

 

As far as giving the young guys a shot.... I see it obviously with first base (where Youk will be starting) and MAYBE shortstop (if Pedroia impresses in spring training), but I seriously doubt our starting centerfielder this season will be any one of the following: Ellbury, Murphy, Stern.

 

I think the team sees Alex Cora as a capable shortstop for the short term, but they've got to be looking to at least add a centerfielder who's capable of playing every day.

[ksushi]

Agreed, Cora is very underrated. To me it seems like a lot of the fan base is hungry for a big name and this dissatisfaction with Cora comes from that - because he has about the same name recognition Mike Mordecai.... who has none. Yeah anyway, if you look at Cora closely, he offensively is going to give about the same output as OC would and Cora is reputed around the majors as being among the most intelligent and aware players in the game. He's got a nice glove and plays the game smart, nothing wrong with that guy. He might not be the face of the franchise, but he sure helps out the pitching staff with that glove of his. With our re-vamped infield defense the pitching staff will look great this year.

 

My money is officially going on Jason Michaels to play centerfield for the sox. I think a Michaels and Clement and cash deal will happen sooner than later.

[riverside sluggers]

true about Cora

 

I saw this assinine poll on ESPN "Will the Sox reach the playoffs with Cora as their shortstop?"--58% said no

 

They cant base it just on one player. Pokey Reese in 2004 ended up playing shortstop for the most innings of 2004, and guess you could say we did fine with the little offense he gave shadowed by his gold glove caliber D he performed every chance he got. Cora is sure to give just about the same quality defense, while easily outslugging my boy Pokey who had hit .221 with the Sox.

[ksushi]

Defense at short helps a pitching staff big time. I really think the sox have an even better chance for making the post season with someone who plays the kind of D and hustles like Cora, rather than Edgar. I'm not going to lie though, I did like Edgar more than most, but I don't see any problem with Cora outside of his lack of star power.

 

I do see a problem with Stern however, and I wouldn't be overjoyed with Michaels - more relieved to just have a CFer. My happiness would come from Dejesus or Jim Edmonds on the cheap. Well, it isn't like I have dreamless sleep, so I guess I can just go to bed early when I want to think about that for longer. That might be the only way those two pipe dreams will ever happen.

[seabeachfred]

E, I think you hit the nail on the head. Those other teams are trying to hold us up and if we have to go with Cora at short and Stern in center that could hold us for a year since our pitching and defense will be much stronger than last year, and we should have more power in the lineup as well if Lowell returns to form and Trot can stay healthy for a full season. The other teams think they have us over a barrel but they really don't and in the end they will be the ones who will be muddled in the lower depths of their respective leagues.

[seabeachfred]

If we finally get a CF, I think it will be Michaels as well. All signs point to him because he is tradeable, is up for arbitration and wants to play regularly. In two or three years when Ellsbury is ready to take over CF and maybe Moss in left, Michaels could become a fourth outfielder off the bench. He did very well in that capacity for the Phillies and now, at least, deserves a chance to be a regular for a couple of seasons. He could just be the ticket for us.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

I'd doubt the Cleveland Guardians would be interested Wells at this point but a Clement, Mota, and Marte deal would work (IMO) for both sides.

 

If The Red Sox then keep Wells in the rotation, their bullpen should be deep enough. They'd have Papelbon and Arroyo fighting for the #5 spot and whoever doesn't get that job is in the bullpen. (Tavarez, Seanez, Timlin, Foulke, Arroyo/Pap + Hansen/Delcarmen/DiNardo/Alvarez/Van Buren/Vermilyea)

 

Keep in mind that Vermilyea has to stay with the big club or else we lose him, and if the Sox decide in spring training to give him a roster spot there would very simply be too many arms (without having made a trade) that are MLB caliber:

 

Schilling, Beckett, Wakefield, Wells, Clement, Arroyo, Papelbon, Mota, Seanez, Timlin, Tavarez, Foulke. That's 12 arms without Vermilyea. They should carry 11 at most (IMO) which means it makes sense to trade 2 arms.

 

You lose Marte, think about what you're getting. A 23 year old shortstop who's proven his power at the major league level and a 26 year old potential all star centerfielder.

 

I understand that your idea is speculative-- but if the Red Sox could get this done-- they should definately do it.

 

I can see from the Guardians' angle why they might do it, because they could 2 good arms to their staff, but this would significantly weaken their offense and without Peralta they'd have Brandon Phillips and Ramon Vazquez as options at shortstop.... so I can easily them simply telling the Red Sox no on this deal, too.

 

Amazingly we may have been on the right track to a degree. The Andy Marte for Coco Crisp trade is getting mentioned but I think the Guardians are walking away with a better deal. They still need a pitcher to take the place of Kevin Millwood and we have that in Matt Clement. Sources did mention other names could be included so what would be the chances of Peralta being mentioned? Perhaps we have a reliever involved with the deal as well. Lots of possibilities in Cleveland due to there need at pitching and our need at SS and CF. I'm starting to feel something could be worked out in the end.

[a700hitter]

Amazingly we may have been on the right track to a degree. The Andy Marte for Coco Crisp trade is getting mentioned but I think the Guardians are walking away with a better deal. They still need a pitcher to take the place of Kevin Millwood and we have that in Matt Clement. Sources did mention other names could be included so what would be the chances of Peralta being mentioned? Perhaps we have a reliever involved with the deal as well. Lots of possibilities in Cleveland due to there need at pitching and our need at SS and CF. I'm starting to feel something could be worked out in the end.

Let's not forget that it is Marte + $11 million.

[riverside sluggers]

San Diego Tribune

 

Coincidentally, besides Piazza, the one piece of unfinished business this winter with the Padres is Wells. Towers is negotiating with recently reinstalled Boston General Manager Theo Epstein for Wells, who has said he doesn't want to return to the Red Sox. The Padres have offered Boston outfielder Dave Roberts and right-handed pitcher Woody Williams for Wells. The Red Sox have balked at accepting Williams as part of any trade.

 

Good to hear the Sox are holding their ground on not accepting Williams whatsoever. Maybe a couple of quality prospects can be had in this deal

[KeepTheFaith1229]

Ummm...do we need Roberts anymore? We have our CF. We would be trading Wells for a 4th outfielder, and I think we can get more than that for him.

[Rdsxmbnt]

I dont see much point in aquiring Roberts anymore, he would be a nice 4th OF and give some of our OFs some rest but the price of taking on Williams isnt worth it. Trade wells for prospects but if all were getting is C level prospects than dont bother trading Wells and stick him in the rotation and see what he does.

[stocker323]

Ummm...do we need Roberts anymore? We have our CF. We would be trading Wells for a 4th outfielder, and I think we can get more than that for him.

 

I agree. At this point I just say we try to get quality prospects from San Diego or worst case scenario, we try to convince him to stay for 1 more year.

[guapo34]

Let's not forget that it is Marte + $11 million.

 

no, its not. The $11 million was to get rid of rentaria because he was overpaid. We can replace him for the difference between the $11 million we gave up and the $30 we owed him. So we saved money at short and got a good prospect. That $11 million is rediculous to include in what we gave up for Crisp.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

I think we should be trading David Wells for prospects. Now that Andy Marte is gone and we technically have a 26 man roster, SS is our one real weakness. I think dealing with San Diego kinda sucks cause there farm system is pretty weak.

 

Now that Theo is back perhaps he can get more involved with Josh Byrnes. They have a real log jam at SS and 2B. They recently got Orlando Hudson and for SS they have Justin Upton, Stephan Drew, and Sergio Santos. Perhaps we could work on getting Stephan Drew somehow. Joel Guzman in LA is there best power hitter and he can play SS.

[stocker323]

I think we should be trading David Wells for prospects. Now that Andy Marte is gone and we technically have a 26 man roster, SS is our one real weakness. I think dealing with San Diego kinda sucks cause there farm system is pretty weak.

 

Now that Theo is back perhaps he can get more involved with Josh Byrnes. They have a real log jam at SS and 2B. They recently got Orlando Hudson and for SS they have Justin Upton, Stephan Drew, and Sergio Santos. Perhaps we could work on getting Stephan Drew somehow. Joel Guzman in LA is there best power hitter and he can play SS.

 

Well Hudson is a 2B and Santos went the other way in that deal. So really they have Drew and Upton for the future at SS. I think they are going to want to wait and watch the development of Drew and Upton before deciding which one they want to trade, or they could always move one to 3rd. So I don't see either of them moving soon.

[KeepTheFaith1229]

Yeah, they just got Upton first overall last year. Don't they still have Cintron, Clayton and Counsell though?

[Cityofchampions33]

I'd love to get either, Drew sounds great, bt i doubt theyd give him up

[stocker323]

Yeah, they just got Upton first overall last year. Don't they still have Cintron, Clayton and Counsell though?

 

They don't have Clayton anymore as he's a FA. Counsell is now going to start at SS now that Hudson is at 2B, but Drew is expected to take over by midseason. Cintron is currently a utility guy right now so they could acquire him for SS but I wouldn't expect him to start or anything.

[riverside sluggers]

A Wells trade had almost at one time neared completion with the Dodgers for pitching prospect Yhency Brazoban, which resulted to the Sox turning their attention to Julian Tavarez. It was due to the Dodgers worries about lack of qulity setup men in their bullpen.

 

I wonder if this deal could be brought back considering the Dodgers have since acquired Baez and Carter from Tampa.

[Cityofchampions33]

Yhency Brazoban progressed so quickly that GM Paul DePodesta felt that he had the depth to include valuable setup man Guillermo Mota in the Brad Penny trade with the Marlins. Brazoban's ERA after the deal was 2.48, while Mota's was 4.81. Pitching, Defense & HittingBrazoban was converted from the outfield because his fastball routinely hits 95 MPH. He backs that up with a hard slider in the mid- to upper 80s. Though he sometimes struggles with his command, Brazoban ended up with a strikeout-walk ratio of almost 3:1 over three levels last season. While he still has a lot to learn with regard to holding runners, Brazoban should have no trouble fielding his position. As a reliever, he will seldom be asked to handle a bat, but the big guy looks like he could do some damage if he ever gets ahold of one.

 

I wouldn't mind getting him but I think we're almost log-jammed in the bullpen now. Though Timlin, Seanez might not be around much longer. We would have perhaps the most promising future reliever-wise in Hansen, DC, Big Edgah, and than Yhency. I would prefer to gain some solid hitting prospects out of it.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

I'll always take young arms in any deal. You can never have enough pitching; especially young talents that can develop.

 

As far as hitters; we are only lacking at SS and believe it or not Dustin Pedroia is one of the top middle infield prospects. We could always use another though since I'm not sure what Jed Lowrie will become. There are lots of names on the west coast I would be interested in: Stephan Drew, Justin Upton, Orlando Cabrera, Howie Kendrick, Brandon Wood, Chone Figgins, Cesar Izturis, Bobby Crosby, Joel Guzman.

 

A lot of those names are expensive but they are guys I would be interested in.

[riverside sluggers]

True that our major league pen is stacked, but still can keep Yhency along with Manny & Hansen in Pawtucket for insurance in case somebody goes down or cut/traded. In the end, Im sure Theo will do whats right for the team.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

I like Brazoban but I might be more interested in Jonathan Broxton. He has the teams best fastball and best slider according to baseball america. He was built to be a reliever and has a real high ceiling. Craig Hansen is said to be the best relief prospect in minor league ball. Broxton isn't far behind him. Since moving to the bullpen his fastball reaches high 90s and his strikeouts last season in the majors: 22 k in 13.2 innings (holy crap!). I would love to add that to the bullpen of the future.

[Rdsxmbnt]

I like Brazoban but I might be more interested in Jonathan Broxton. He has the teams best fastball and best slider according to baseball america. He was built to be a reliever and has a real high ceiling. Craig Hansen is said to be the best relief prospect in minor league ball. Broxton isn't far behind him. Since moving to the bullpen his fastball reaches high 90s and his strikeouts last season in the majors: 22 k in 13.2 innings (holy crap!). I would love to add that to the bullpen of the future.

 

Yes Please! Maybe LA would do it but it would depend on how badly they need a SP, maybe cash would swap hands here also.

[ksushi]

I think to get Broxton you'd be talking about wells plus somebody.

 

Think of it this way, if we needed a SP, lets say we only had four and we were looking to compete, would you give up Jon Papelbon or Craig Hansen to get David Wells? I doubt it. If you say yes, you're insane. The for Brazoban fell apart which is why we have Tavarez, Broxton would be a Wells and Ellsbury sort of thing or something along those lines.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

I think to get Broxton you'd be talking about wells plus somebody.

 

Think of it this way, if we needed a SP, lets say we only had four and we were looking to compete, would you give up Jon Papelbon or Craig Hansen to get David Wells? I doubt it. If you say yes, you're insane. The for Brazoban fell apart which is why we have Tavarez, Broxton would be a Wells and Ellsbury sort of thing or something along those lines.

 

I was reading more about Broxton and I was wrong saying he is close to Craig Hansen. Apparently Broxton has control problem but still has a high ceiling. He isn't close to the same class as Jonathan Papelbon or Jon Lester. We declined to trade Lester for Randy Johnson and both are top 10 pitching prospects if not top 5 with Francisco Lariano and Matt Cain. If I was going to compare him to a reliever in our system he is deffinitly more like Manny Delcarmen. Two excellent pitches with big velocity....just lacking control.

 

Craig Hansen was mentioned as a faster developing Brad Lidge and better than Houston Street.

[Rdsxmbnt]

Broxton has hte potential to be good but hes not really on a Papelbon/Lester level, Lester being hte 2nd best LHP prospect in the game, period. And Papelbon being right up there with him among hte top SP prospects in the game. So for broxton yes hes good but its not out of the realm of possibilites he gets dealt for a guy like Wells, but in this case were probaly talking Wells+cash/prospect but i think its possible and has been mentioned in hte media before.

[KeepTheFaith1229]

Wells for Broxton would be pimptastic.

[Cityofchampions33]

But what woudl we use him for? Hansen is our closer, DC and Edgah are our set-ups and that isn't bad at all. Sure I'd lvoe Broxton, but I want tot ake advantage of a desperate team and get a high-quality hitting spect that could serve us in the future, poreferabley at C, or 3b.

[SchillingIsTheNatural]

But what woudl we use him for? Hansen is our closer, DC and Edgah are our set-ups and that isn't bad at all. Sure I'd lvoe Broxton, but I want tot ake advantage of a desperate team and get a high-quality hitting spect that could serve us in the future, poreferabley at C, or 3b.

 

Well you can never have enough. You need to play the numbers with prospects. No matter how good they are...for every top prospect there are 3 that don't. Having Hansen, Delcarmen, Broxton, and Edgar Martinez sounds good. There is always room for relievers. They come and go all the time but whats hard is finding the ones that can stick around.

 

I wouldn't be against getting a top hitter either. The Dodgers have two good hitters in Andy La Roche and Joel Guzman. The Dbacks have a bunch of good hitting prospects. We just have to see what the Red Sox do but thats the direction I would go....young prospects...hard to do with a 42 year old pitcher.