offseason moves

[pats55sox45]

1b- Paul Konerko - would be great to get this guy

2b-Mark Grudzielanek - would be nice fit waiting for young guys to develop

CF-Preston Wilson - if we let Johnny go, could be nice player in Fenway

RF-Brian Giles- the perfect fit for the Red Sox, such a moneyball guy, we know they love him, if johnny goes (which i think he will) could move trot to cf and giles to rf

3b-Joe Randa-my top pick

-Abe Nunez

-Wes Helms

 

The obvious team for Manny is the mets, but who do we get for him?

the only thing that makes sense is beltran, theyd have to move floyd to cf

it would let us let johnny go, and have beltran at leadoff

he wouldnt be asked to produce as many runs

but i dont feel like it would benefit us greatly, cuz beltran is gettin too much money

i know were not gonna sign all those guys WITH manny but its fun to project:

 

Renteria

Grudzielanek

Ortiz

Manny

Konerko

Giles (maybe at the two spot)

Tek

Trot

Randa/youkilis

 

or

 

P. Wilson

Renteria

Ortiz

Manny

Konerko

Tek

Trot

Grudz.

Randa/Youk

 

some pitchers that we could go after:

Matt Morris

AJ Burnett *

Jeff Weaver

Paul Byrd*

Tony Armas Jr

Kirk Rueter

Jarrod Washburn

Kenny Rogers

relievers:

BJ Ryan

Kyle Farnsworth

Tom Gordon

(some others, just got lazy searchin)

 

id like byrd, good pitcher could be had for much less money than burnett and morris, maybe even weaver, even though hes a better pitcher than all but burnett in this fa class

 

these red sox like their fair share of bargains (ortiz, millar, mueller, jeremy giambi-failed, walker, bellhorn) but they will pay for players they believe in: renteria, varitek

i think konerko is a MUST, it allows us to spend less at 3b

grudzielanek would be a nice addition at 2b

brian giles would be amazing to have, such a great moneyball guy, man im salivating at the chance

career numbers for giles: 299 ba, 413 obp, 542 slg, 954 ops

last year for giles a lil worse: 301 ba, 423, 483, 905

man, that obp is ridiculous

but thats cuz of petco

hed be such a nice add while we wait for brandon moss and others to develop

wouldnt mind havin preston wilson at cf if johnny goes either

but, giles, man that would be awesome

if they can find a way to get konerko, byrd, and giles ill be happy

if they can do that while keepin manny: our 3-6 or 2-5 would be ortiz, manny, konerko, giles

wow

WOW

of course not sure we can do that with mannys salary

i feel like the best thing that can happen to our pitching is the young guys developing

cuz we have too much money invested in matt clement (knew it was a stupid move)

clement, schill, and wake are def in the starting rotation

so if we can get byrd, hed be a fourth

i dont wanna overpay for burnett, cuz we know hell get hurt

but as we saw, u need two dominant pitchers to win it all

if papelbon can start next yr great

but im not sure hes ready to be a starter

hansen will def contribute in the pen soon

delcarmen will be in the pen next yr

if papelbon doesnt start hes either our best setup guy or our closer

i still have some faith in foulke, and were not tradin him, too much money, didnt do anything this yr to get value for him

anyway thats all my thoughts

heres the link to the fa's

 

 

http://www.mlb4u.com/teamfa.html

[He Hate Me]

I;d be surprised if they trade for Beltran's salary. Probably a more likely deal would be trading for David Wright and a couple of young arms, and have the Mets split manny's salary with Boston.

[pats55sox45]

I;d be surprised if they trade for Beltran's salary. Probably a more likely deal would be trading for David Wright and a couple of young arms, and have the Mets split manny's salary with Boston.

i hate the idea of splitting the salary

i always feel that the team that gives up the player better be givin a player that is totally underachieving, which is not manny

which is why i would really like to NOT trade manny

i know we cant have our cake and eat it too, but id love to be able to have a manny, trot, giles of, while getting somebody to play 1b, and getting another sp

[He Hate Me]

I personally dont see why you have to trade Manny in the first place. The guy produces regardless of the potential distracitons. You will never get equal value for Manny, so whatever you get back in return is gonna be a downgrade. At least you get a player with huge upside in David Wright, plus he fills a hole in your offense and defense.

 

And if you lok at it another way, if the Mets pay 14 mil a year for remainder of Manny's contract, that would make Wright's salary equal to about 6 or 7 mil a year, since he isn't eligible for arbitration for a few years I believe. Not a bad price to pay for a young guy with .306 BA 27 HR 102 RBI and 17 SB. Holy smokes, I didnt realize he was that good. The Mets would be nuts to trade that! LOL

[User Name]

HHM is right. Manny produces no matter what he's saying, I think they should keep him.

[26 to 6]

I;d be surprised if they trade for Beltran's salary. Probably a more likely deal would be trading for David Wright and a couple of young arms, and have the Mets split manny's salary with Boston.

yes, people around here feel that the trade will more likely involve Cameron, Millege, and a pachake of other needs of the Red Sox'.

 

and pats55sox45...you are horribly mistaken if you think the Mets would EVER move Floyd to CF...if we did trade Beltran we would just move Cammy back to Center.

[Soxfan1]

The cubs and pads are going to fight real hard for giles so count him out.

[bighurt]

I'm always amused at how some baseball fans look at free agents / trades. Like there aren't 29 other teams out there. Konerko, Grudzielanek, Preston Wilson, Giles, etc.......yeah, I'll bet no other GM's were looking at those guys. Maybe trade Graffanino for Grudzielanek, then give Konerko 10 million, give AJ Burnett 10 million, trade a bag of balls for Cy Young, yeah, that's it. Do you think Grudz is going to leave a team that won 100 games in a baseball-crazy town like St. Louis to come to Boston who got in on the last day ?? Trust me, if everyone wanted to go to Boston they'd be there by now.

[riverside sluggers]

dude "bighurt", we're just putting our wish lists in here

 

and there is no hell of a reason to gloat on us on how the sox got into the playoffs, yes we know it came down to the last day. As it was for the Astros, and Yankees made it second to last day of the season. your point being? I'll take a look in my book about how 95 wins is a disgrace

 

Do you think Grudz is going to leave a team that won 100 games in a baseball-crazy town like St. Louis to come to Boston who got in on the last day ??

 

um yeah by the way boston is more of a baseball crazy town that St Louis will ever be, and you can quote me on that

[bighurt]

I'm not gloating ..... good lord I've been waiting 50 years to see some White Sox success. People do that in Chicago, too, especially the North Side fans (ie. cubs). They propose these God-awful trades that Stevie Wonder could see through. A month ago a guy wanted to trade two guys they sent back down to the minors (because they couldn't play) and a crappy minor league pitcher for Johnny Damon. Yeah, the Red Sox would be lining up to take that deal, sure. That's the kind of logic I'm talking about. For some reason, fans all over think that every other team is dying to unload their stars for garbage.

I'm not a St Louis fan, but that town is over-the-top for the redbirds. I've seen it first-hand. Never been to Boston, so I have no way to compare.

[bighurt]

Mr. R. Sluggers

To answer your question with another question - Why would Grudz leave one of the best and younger teams to go to a slightly lesser and older team with way less pitching ?? That was my point. I meant no slight to the Red Sox, but they are not as good as the Cardinals. 95 wins is nothing to sneeze at, but it's still 5 less than 100 (which the Cards got). By the way, the Cards are the only team in the NL that can play with 5 or 6 of the best teams in the AL, but they may be the best team in baseball.

[stocker323]

Mr. R. Sluggers

To answer your question with another question - Why would Grudz leave one of the best and younger teams to go to a slightly lesser and older team with way less pitching ?? That was my point. I meant no slight to the Red Sox, but they are not as good as the Cardinals. 95 wins is nothing to sneeze at, but it's still 5 less than 100 (which the Cards got). By the way, the Cards are the only team in the NL that can play with 5 or 6 of the best teams in the AL, but they may be the best team in baseball.

$$$$, but I don't want him.

[riverside sluggers]

Im not really opting for Mark Grudz, next season he will be 36 and I dont see Cards ever passing up on him. Im hoping to see the Sox resign Tony Graffanino to be the regular 2nd baseman

[bighurt]

They pay well in St Louis - a big market team in a smallish city. I agree with you - Graffanino used to play with the White Sox. I think Grudz is looking for rings more than a boatload of money, because he could have extorted the cubs for big bucks. The cubs could have Babe Ruth and let him go, they're so clueless. Now cubs fans are the ones I will gloat to ...... loudly, obnoxiously, and continually.

[RedSoxRooter]

Here's a question.. There's all this talk of Manny being traded - and specifically to the Mets because they could eat the contract and continue that whole latino thing going on over there.

 

The Red Sox would like piching in return.. What the Sox could really use is an ace... You think there's been any chatter about a Manny for Pedro swap??? The Sox could get him back and that deal buster "fourth year" in his contract is effectively gone now.

 

Then we'd have Pedro back!

 

Oh, wait.

 

Forget about it.

[ORS]

Here's a question.. There's all this talk of Manny being traded - and specifically to the Mets because they could eat the contract and continue that whole latino thing going on over there.

 

The Red Sox would like piching in return.. What the Sox could really use is an ace... You think there's been any chatter about a Manny for Pedro swap??? The Sox could get him back and that deal buster "fourth year" in his contract is effectively gone now.

 

Then we'd have Pedro back!

 

Oh, wait.

 

Forget about it.

I think the end of your post shows realization to this fact, but I'll mention it just in case.

 

The deal breaker wasn't the length of Pedro's contract. It was paying him that kind of money that last year when he was 4 years older (and most likely very much less effective). If we get him, then the Mets would have gotten 1 of the 3 years we were willing to pay for.

[example1]

Why would someone want to come to Boston right now? I mean it seems like otherwise good guys like Damon, Foulke, Lowe, Pedro, Millar, and even Schilling really struggle to keep their heads above water in Boston. The media is out of control and there is so much infighting its not funny. Teammates calling each other out for their play on the field of the fans' reaction to each other. Its a toxic environment with management that doesn't think it needs to take that stuff. Management is right.

 

People like Pedro and Manny draw other players to want to play in Boston, but when they get HUGE contracts and want to LEAVE LEAVE LEAVE its not a good sign. We'll see how the sox do in a) signing Theo again and landing a good pitcher (like the malcontent Burnett, whom I think Varitek could knock some sense into). If we get a good pitcher then other players know we're serious about winning and soon, not just waiting for Lester and Sanchez to get to the bigs. the front office will need to make a tough decision about our middle guys, who produce above or at their means, which aren't that good to begin with. What are the benefits of keeping Wakefield? Arroyo? Wells? Mueller? Nixon? Obviously Millar? I love those guys, each of them, but at what expense do we keep them and not go after potential cornerstone guys instead?

 

They will basically take up a space that could be occupied by another, perhaps more consistent player with a better upside.

[riverside sluggers]

Wakefield was signed to a $4 million contract for 2006, and has club options for years after...

 

Lets see, why should the Sox keep Wakefield? Maybe just because he was their Ace of 2005 leading in wins, ERA, K's, innings pitched (also 3 complete games). If not for lack of run support in September and Mirabelli being out for several weeks early in the season, Wake couldve been a 20+ game winner and candidate to win the AL Cy Young award. Ortiz carried the offense on his back, but Wakefield had carried the pitching staff on his back

[example1]

Okay, I'll buy wakefield (I wouldn't have gotten rid of him, but he's not a #1 starter and we shouldn't WANT him to be). When this team is where it should be Wakefield should be a #4 caliber starter. He's great, I love him, he's a veteran and a leader but he WASN'T a 20 game winnerand he's not going to win the CY Young. And carrying THIS pitching staff isn't that great of a claim. He's a great pitcher, I hope he retires from the sox when he's done, but unless we're willing to lose some decently effective pitchers we're going to have a mediocre staff for awhile.

 

Okay, so I'll keep Wakefield. Who else?

[riverside sluggers]

i know he wasnt a 20 game winner and cy young award candidate. wow you didnt even read my post right. if wakefield had gotten the run support in september and mirabelli was healthy all year, i said he couldve been a 20+ game winner. its not just me who was saying that, on espn, foxsports, weei, etc.

[Ray10]

I'd like to see Konerko come here as well as Morris. Im pretty sure the Mets said that they wouldn't trade Beltran and he's not worth Manny Ramirez anyways he doesn't come close to Manny with the bat which is what we need.

[pats55sox45]

i know i just dont see anyone making sense for manny

i really hope we dont trade him

but if we do we better get giles in town for his obp

[jimmycarter05]

face it!!! konkero isn't coming...stop talking about him because he's not going to come...and if we do trade manny, do you really think big papi will be protected with huff as the only home run threat in the line up by resigning tony g as our 2nd baseman? HELL NO!!! say thank you for the great 2005 year and forget about him(no offense to tony g)...soriano(was GREAT under pressure in new york) and huff are the guys that theo should pursue ONLY IF manny is traded...hopefully we can get a good YOUNG pitcher like jeo seo wang, a good BULLPEN guy like heilman, and an above average hitter with some speed in mike cameron...we don't need a veteran pitcher in traschel...we already have schilling and wake to do that....we need to develop our young players by starting youk at third and forgetting about bill mueller...say thank you for your years here and bye....sign ONE good bullpen guy; farnsworth, reyes, or taverez...and sign another good pitcher; morris or washburn......trade matt clement for some good minor league hitting talent(hmmm texas maybe) because we won't need him in our rotation...use the young guys in the pen again; hansen, dinardo,declarman...theo shouldn't have to feel he HAS to resign anybody..he makes the desicions..not damon or anybody else

[example1]

i know he wasnt a 20 game winner and cy young award candidate. wow you didnt even read my post right. if wakefield had gotten the run support in september and mirabelli was healthy all year, i said he couldve been a 20+ game winner. its not just me who was saying that, on espn, foxsports, weei, etc.

 

Yeah, he COULD have won 20 games. He DIDN'T win twenty games and it isn't something you can blame entirely on run support. If you want to make Wakefield your #1 then go for it, but don't turn around and look shocked when we lose in the first round. I don't think its an insult to say that Wakefield is a #4 on this Sox team. The guy is 39 and throws a 75 mph knuckleball. He's great, but if we're going to win the world series its not going to be relying on Wakefield as a one or two guy. Sorry to break it to 'ya. If we were going to do that then we should have won in 99 and 03 when he was our #2 guy.

[example1]

face it!!! konkero isn't coming...stop talking about him because he's not going to come...and if we do trade manny, do you really think big papi will be protected with huff as the only home run threat in the line up by resigning tony g as our 2nd baseman? HELL NO!!! say thank you for the great 2005 year and forget about him(no offense to tony g)...soriano(was GREAT under pressure in new york) and huff are the guys that theo should pursue ONLY IF manny is traded...hopefully we can get a good YOUNG pitcher like jeo seo wang, a good BULLPEN guy like heilman, and an above average hitter with some speed in mike cameron...we don't need a veteran pitcher in traschel...we already have schilling and wake to do that....we need to develop our young players by starting youk at third and forgetting about bill mueller...say thank you for your years here and bye....sign ONE good bullpen guy; farnsworth, reyes, or taverez...and sign another good pitcher; morris or washburn......trade matt clement for some good minor league hitting talent(hmmm texas maybe) because we won't need him in our rotation...use the young guys in the pen again; hansen, dinardo,declarman...theo shouldn't have to feel he HAS to resign anybody..he makes the desicions..not damon or anybody else

 

 

Rant like, but yeah, I agree. Especially with the Konerko thing. There is no chance and I am happy to even hear that huff is a possibility.

 

I don't really like Soriano at 2nd, even if Manny is gone, but whatever. I don't think that Theo would give up Manny without the possibility of a great trade-off.

[jimmycarter05]

Rant like, but yeah, I agree. Especially with the Konerko thing. There is no chance and I am happy to even hear that huff is a possibility.

 

I don't really like Soriano at 2nd, even if Manny is gone, but whatever. I don't think that Theo would give up Manny without the possibility of a great trade-off.

 

 

here's a great trade off for manny; jeo seo wang, heilman, mike cameron, and maybe lasting milledge

 

with a healthy curt schilling coming back, our new great pitcher john papelbon, and jeo seo wang(8-2, 2.59 ERA) we have our selves a excellent 3 man staff right there....wake and boomer(if he doesn't retire, but if he does we could get matt morris or washburn) are my other 2 choices...thats a quality staff right there...trade matt clement for some young, good hitters(hmmm,texas maybe)

 

with heilman, he can be a sp/rp, so if one of our pitchers go down, we got a 6th one and he'll be great in the pen....hopefully keith foulke can come back and be healthy....we can also use our young guns too(dinaro, decarlman, hansen), keep ONE submarnier(bradford or myers), and sign ONE of the following; julian taveraz, al reyes, or kyle farnsworth and use them as a set up man/secondary closer

 

we won't have the most potent line up in the league, but it will definately be right up their..the lineup with manny traded;

 

damon-(resign for 3 years/30 million max)

renteria

ortiz

soriano-(36 homers/102 RBIs/104 runs scored/30 SBs/2 CS)

huff

tek

nixon

cameron/juan encarnaction

youklis

 

Back Ups

matt lecory-1b

lenny harris-3b(replace millar as the cheerleader)

jeff conie-OF

cora/hanley-2b/SS-if cora is too much, let him go, otherwise develop hanley

 

damon is the only guy we really need to resign

[pats55sox45]

is huff def gonna be a fa?

[riverside sluggers]

on WEEI: Huff is on the list of players Sox hope to take on board. He is under contract by the D-Rays for 2006 at $7.5 million. Which would acquire the Sox to trade such prospects as Kelly Shoppach, Abe Alvarez, Brandon Moss, or even Anibel Sanchez.

[pats55sox45]

i would not trade brandon moss, no way

we aready traded matt murton, we need to keep some of prospects

[example1]

here's a great trade off for manny; jeo seo wang, heilman, mike cameron, and maybe lasting milledge

 

with a healthy curt schilling coming back, our new great pitcher john papelbon, and jeo seo wang(8-2, 2.59 ERA) we have our selves a excellent 3 man staff right there....wake and boomer(if he doesn't retire, but if he does we could get matt morris or washburn) are my other 2 choices...thats a quality staff right there...trade matt clement for some young, good hitters(hmmm,texas maybe)

 

with heilman, he can be a sp/rp, so if one of our pitchers go down, we got a 6th one and he'll be great in the pen....hopefully keith foulke can come back and be healthy....we can also use our young guns too(dinaro, decarlman, hansen), keep ONE submarnier(bradford or myers), and sign ONE of the following; julian taveraz, al reyes, or kyle farnsworth and use them as a set up man/secondary closer

 

we won't have the most potent line up in the league, but it will definately be right up their..the lineup with manny traded;

 

damon-(resign for 3 years/30 million max)

renteria

ortiz

soriano-(36 homers/102 RBIs/104 runs scored/30 SBs/2 CS)

huff

tek

nixon

cameron/juan encarnaction

youklis

 

Back Ups

matt lecory-1b

lenny harris-3b(replace millar as the cheerleader)

jeff conie-OF

cora/hanley-2b/SS-if cora is too much, let him go, otherwise develop hanley

 

damon is the only guy we really need to resign

 

 

Please, please, please STOP with the Soriano batting 4th thing. It was nice at first, but its just craziness. Nobody cares how many stolen bases he has if he's batting 4th, but OBP and OPS are much more important. Finally, if Soriano came to Boston you would have to realize that his days of stolen bases are OVER. The sox don't believe in SB's, they aren't about to start believing in them. Soriano is the exact kind of player the front office DO NOT WANT. He has inflated power numbers, very, very, very, very (howmany times do I have to say this) poor plate discipline and is not a very good fielder. POSSIBLY as a leadoff hitter, but not ever, NEVER as a 4 hitter. Please stop.