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Everything posted by notin
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The 3.89 ERA is over 9 innings, which he probably never pitched in a No Decision. (Maybe once or twice?) That means Montgomery averaged 2.1 ER in those 5.1 IP. Had he actually averaged giving up 3.89 ER per those 5.1 IP, his ERA would be 7.00…
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There was a time when that’s all they had. And the inability to really tell how good a RP was using nothing but W-L led to the creation of ERA…
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No, I’m not doing the same thing. I’m providing evidence and examples. And quit pretending old schoolers aren’t countering. The repeated counter argument just never changed. It was always “but he’s never won more than 10 games.” Go back through the thread and see how many times that was used as sole support. Really it looked more like the Old School point was never to support their side as much as it was to make sure they got the last word…
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Nobody has ever said that your opinion is W-L record is the only thing that matters. That defense you keep repeatedly using is a Strawman Argument. The contrary opinion to yours is much simpler - that it really doesn’t matter. Numerous examples supporting this position have been cited. Numerous explanations why have been provided. And no counter argument has ever come back beyond blanket statements and accusations of stubbornness. And everyone gets BTV is a useless little toy. Of course, the critics of the site always fail to mention the incredibly obvious reason why - that it’s used by fans and not the executives who make trades. Does it provide realistic trades? Its history indicates that it does. But that means very little as it can be countered by questionable executives working for MLB teams. It’s one true purpose is shedding some light on all the insane trade proposals fans made before that sight that often boiled down to “let’s trade our garbage for All Stars” and occasionally questioning why the GM just would not do so…
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You clearly don’t get it. You’re posting from a position of “I have my opinion and anyone who disagrees is being stubborn.”
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Greg Maddox was another with post season struggles. Heck the 2014 Tigers trotted out Scherzer-Price-Verlander in three consecutive games against the Orioles in the ALDS and lost all three. Everyone always labeled these guys as chokers, but I always noticed they do worse in the postseason when they have higher IP during the regular season.
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Is this really a matter of opinion? Statheads have said “W-L doesn’t matter” and provided lots of examples and data. Old Schoolers have said “W-L does matter” and then blatantly refused to support that position. You can claim all you want about their right to their opinion, but that doesn’t make the statistic more relevant. It just means they like it more. Of course dgalehouse did in one post overtly say that W-L matters. He has said it is statistically relevant. All anyone wants is some reason why. And while you REPEATEDLY call out people who question his viewpoint, you’ve never once called him out for overriding anyone else’s…
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Also he’s an *******. But he does openly and brashly admit as much
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Clevinger should be swimming in a shark tank filled with AB+. He’s one those guys I like less and less every time I google him. It’s actually unfair that that primate is allowed to play while Bauer is cancelled…
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Also does this mean the Sox should focus instead on Mike Clevinger (60-39) instead of Jordan Montgomery (38-34)?
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It also tells you what an incredible bargain hunter Chaim Bloom really was, when he was able to get Rich Hill (90-73) for only $5mill when his equivalent Aaron Nola (90-71) costs $172mill…
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That’s to be expected, since Wacha is used to being hurt…
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So it’s a fact and it matters, but no one will tell my why it matters…
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And the bottom line - no one disputed Montgomery was not credited with a lot of wins. So why was it worth repeating so many times?
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I think you’ll find this kind of split is common. For example - Blake Snell In his 71 wins, 1.13 In his 55 losses, 6.94 In his 66 no decisions, 3.07 But this is also not what I asked. A lot was made yesterday of his low season win totals. Several said it didn’t matter, and provided data in various forms. But even then, it was repeatedly pointed out it was a fact. But why was it ever worth mentioning, let alone repeated so often?
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If a pitcher gave up 3.89 ER over 5 innings, his ERA would be 7.00…
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But what does it say about Montgomery as a pitcher when you notice that in the last 3 years, he has started 94 games and pitched 524 innings, but only has 25 wins in that timeframe?
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In road games, you need your team to score those 3 runs in 7 innings. Small clarification…
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But what is the significance of him never winning more than 10 games?
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I think the goal of OBP and BA and SLG is to pretend it’s all about the hitter. But then why does getting thrown out at 2b trying to stretch a single into a double count as being on base? You’re not. You’re out…
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Or your defense to not blow the lead. There is a lot that can go wrong...
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It actually does. And it should. He stepped up to the plate and didn’t get on base…
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No. They are always plate appearances. They just are not always at bats...
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But the bottom line is - if a pitcher gives you innings and doesn’t give up a lot of runs, he’s done his job. In the last 3 years, Montgomery has pitched 524 innings with an ERA of 3.48, which translates to an ERA+ of 121. He’s pitching a lot and holding opposing runs down. What else is he suppose to do? At that point, if he isn’t getting credit for wins, the three most likely reasons are poor run support, poor defense and ineffective relief pitching. None of these factors involve Montgomery…
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But… but… but… the object of the game is to win!!
