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Everything posted by notin
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When Ohtani is done and retired from the Dodgers in the not-to-distant future, how much money will they have paid him, assuming no incentives are reached? And how much are those incentives? I get if you don’t know the incentive stuff. I don’t either. But bottom line, how much are they on the hook for total? Is there a possibility that within his lifetime, Ohtani collects $700mill from the Dodgers?
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Creative accountancy aside, the bottom line is the Dodgers committed $1.1BILLION DOLLARS to TWO BASEBALL PLAYERS who I am being told had something other than money as their primary motivation. Gee, how much would these two players have cost if they got greedy?
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Let’s say they didn’t. Probably true. Why do you think they didn’t? 1. Not interested in pitching. 2. Couldn’t afford him. Which reason is most likely?
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Fair argument the Astros have been as successful as the Dodgers. Why were they not finalists? They didn’t get Ohtani, but they did jettison Yuri Gurriel…
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I am. Granted it’s one metric Of course for your “winning over money” argument to work, you need to explain why the Mets have been more successful than the Phillies…
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The bottom line is he still prioritized the teams with the top offers and eliminated the lower ones, regardless of how good those teams were. The Phillies were clearly interested and even made an offer. In the last two years, they’ve played in a World Series and an NLCS. The Dodgers have been to neither. The Mets were abysmal last year. Why were the Phillies not a finalist? Their offer was reportedly substantial ; their team has been more successful than the Dodgers. So why were they not even in it? Instead of the Mets?
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At what point does your argument boil down to “he took the $325mill over the Dodgers instead of the $325mill from the Mets! Clearly because he wants to win!”? So if the far more successful Astros came in at $250mill, does he go to a Houston? Better track record for winning than either of those teams…
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I doubt he Makes a lateral move for less money, but that is what is being postulated. Equal money and opportunities? Maybe. Better at both? Definitely…
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I don’t think he ever intended to give up in either season. He was just so indecisive and did nothing either way. He didn’t trade Sale, but he didn’t add to a fringe team, either. (Hosmer absolutely doesn’t count.) and it was actually worse in 2023. Bloom got fired for what he didn’t do. And it was his fault…
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Maybe. Doesn’t help your argument much if that’s the case however. Maybe the west coast aspect need not be overlooked, either…
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I thought the reason abloom was fired was obvious. He had teams in the hunt for the postseason and gave up. Twice. Once without even saving money by getting under the threshold (assuming this was possible). That’s my theory. He want a sacrificial lamb. He was a sheep that was outright slaughtered for not doing the job he was brought in to do…
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He left long before that was found out…
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If winning was the priority, why were the Mets a finalist and not the Phillies?
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So the first two reason you cite (Career advancement and money) are EXACTLY why I’m saying he has reasons to stay in Boston. Don’t forget this is people saying he wants to leave because of the organization’s (perceived?) commitment to win, and SOLELY FOR THAT REASON…
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Even in these two cases, money was a CLEAR PRIORITY over winning. Either of them could have taken less money, but both went for bidders at or near the top. It’s not like he took the lesser offer from the Phillies, who have been more successful the last two years than either the Dodgers or Mets (using postseason as a metric). I don’t fault them for taking as much as they can get; I just don’t pretend winning is any where near as important. And as for Cora, it’s not even just the money; the Sox are offering career advancement. This is his livelihood; why would he not take advantage everything being offered to him? Because the team isn’t signing the way the fans want? If winning was so important to Cora, why didn’t he stay in Houston? If the Dodgers offered Cora less money to manage (and never do anything else), do you think he goes out stays?
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I do isn’t single him out as a failure; I just wouldn’t single him out as a success either…
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Well, yes and no. Hernandez is a cheap “quick fix” outfield solution that potentially frees up another outfielder to be dealt for a pitcher. At least that is my assumption, and the only reason pursuit of him makes sense. But unless the Sox have some pitcher-for-Duran/Rafaela/Abreu deal already lined up, it seems a bit complicated and risky…
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Fair point. But his next two were not worth $35mill by any method of creative accounting…
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Unlike fWAR, which is kinder to Lackey, bWAR is useful when a player spends time in a season on multiple teams…
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So for evidence about money and winning in tandem, you supply the biggest contract and biggest pitcher contract in MLB history?
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Yes it is. The season isn’t even close to starting yet and you’ve already started a thread for ownership to sell. Doesn’t sound to me like you blame Bloom and Breslow…
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But also Lackey’s first 3 years were disastrous, especially considering he was the highest-paid pitcher in Sox history at the time. Year one was average, far below what was paid for. The next two were horrible by any standard. He was go Kelly good in 2013 (apart from his bland and meaningless W-L record) and he delivered big time against Detroit. But over 5 years, he was a hit who has his moments but didn’t live up. And the reason is what it always is. Lackey was already 30 and had some 1500 MLB IP in his career. In his 4.5 years in Boston, he was worth 3.8 bWAR. THAT is a good free agent signing?
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Has that happened? If he gets offered more money, why do you leap to the conclusion that the Sox not being competitive was why he left? And not, you know, the money? The Sox are coming off back-to-back 78 win seasons. Did they make Cora start his job hunt?
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Again 1) His $8mill salary is among the highest for MLB managers 2) The Red Sox have already offered him a CBO-esquires position, which he put on hold. I’m sure when managing games, he does his best to win. But why do you think he places team results ahead of his own personal career? Is being on a high payroll team really his top priority? And are the Red Sox not trying to compete? Or not trying to spend? There’s a big difference. Bloom was brought in to be competitive cheaply. But just because he failed doesn’t mean it’s impossible; it just means it might not be possible for Bloom. The Sox gave him a few chances and moved on. If they were really not trying to compete, why for Bloom at all?
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He’s under contract for another year as one of the highest paid managers in the game and has been offered chances to move into the front office role. Is another team offering that?
