moonslav59

He was a winner as a "nibble," but he could be a Cy Young winner if he could pitch like last night more often. I still can't believe someone wanted to trade him earlier this year. The only low cost starter we have.

I'm not sold on Duran being ready by next year (or ever), so I'd rather spend $1-3M on a known great defensive CF'er. That would save $7-10M by trading or non tendering JBJ. I like the chances of our system depth at 1B and 2B over the OF. 1B: Chavis, Travis, Dalbec, Ockimey (JD?) 2B: Chavis, Marco, Lin, Chatham OF: Duran and nobody I like all of the guys listed at 1B and 2B over Duran, in terms of 2020 only.

$10M would have gotten us Ottavino. It's not squat. "Going all out" likely means still staying under the max line. That means the budget is limited and we have to pick and choose where to spend. Do you really think a year older JBJ is worth $10M? Spending large is one of the reasons we won a ring, yes, but it's also part of the reason we are at or near the breaking point.

I couldn't stay up last night to finish watching, but just finished now. Wow for ERod. 93 pitches for 7 innings. Is that a record for him? Bats are strong as ever. Top MLB OPS Leaders 1. Yelich 2. Trout 3. Bellinger 4. Rendon 5. Devers 6. Blackmon 7. Bregman 8. Freeman 9. Santana 10. Soto 11. Alonso 12. Martinez 13. Marte 14. Springer 15. Bogaerts

We can reset by trading JBJ and not signing any FA to more than $2M a year. Keep just about all the arb players, including Betts. We can easily reset by trading Betts & JBJ. We could even sign a couple FAs that could be part of the future plan, and stay under the first tax line. Reset and go larger in 2021. I want to keep Betts, but I trust the Sox to know his true value and offer him that or a little more. It's the one area the Sox have always been very good at.

Even if JBJ hit .800 in 2020, there's no way I feel secure that is the JBJ for 2021 and beyond. There's no "non tender" after 2020. He'll be a FA just like Betts. He won't get a QO like Betts. He's not worth $10M. He's not the only top defensive CF'er available this winter. Even if we bite the bullet and go for one more shot at a ring, I doubt we go over the max line. I still think it makes sense to not pay JBJ $10+M. We'll still be up against the max line without JBJ and will need money to build up the pen and 1B or 2B. I say just get a cheaper but still great defensive CF'er and build up the pen & 5th starter slot. Also, we can always sign JBJ as a FA (after we trade him this winter) for 2021, if we lose Betts. Or, sign some other defensive CF'er. I'm a huge JBJ fan, but he's not the only great defensive CF'er in MLB. He's also getting older and seems to be on the down swing curve.

No doubt, but there would not be the flashes of brilliance that drive us crazy. My thought is many here would rather have a steady .650 guy than one who hits .500 for 3 months, .650 for 2 months and 1.100 for one. (Not me)

It all depends on the reset or not, but if we reset after 2019, I think we'd only have to lose JBJ and not replace Porcello, Moreland, Pearce or Cashner with any costly FA. We'd have to go with some sort of mix of Chavis/Dalbec/Ockimey/Marco/Chatham/Lin at 1B-2B (back up DH/SS/3B) and cobble together the rest of the pitching staff for just one year, then, perhaps we spend large on Betts and pitchers or someone else and pitchers' if Betts wants more than we are willing to pay. I'm not saying our future is rosy, but I'm trying to think of ways to minimize the down years while keeping our essential young and prime core players onboard. The damn budget just does not allow for spending $10+M on a .730 GG CF'er who is starting to decline.

You mean signing JBJ long term or for just 2020? It's not so certain Betts will be traded, if he doesn't extend or seems contractually out of reach beyond 2020. One main reason I am for resetting after 2019 and NOT 2020, is that we'd have a better chance at keeping Betts. The side issue would be to find a much cheaper but near equally great defensive CF'er. Both are FAs after 2020, so I just don't see the insurance argument like you do, but we both want and demand great D up the middle.

I've named quite a few several times but can only remember Billy Hamilton and Ligares. I think Dyson might be available, too. All will cost way less than JBJ's arb.

I love JBJ, but I would not pay the likely $10M arb. If we can non tender him and then re-sign him for cheaper, fine. Even if we don't reset, $10M is too much. I think we can find a great defensive CF'er for a fraction of the cost. I'm not sure how he is "insurance" for Betts, since they both are FAs after next season. Maybe you meant, if we trade Betts this winter, but what kind of insurance would that be? I put JD in Keepers, because we cannot really trade him. I assume he does not opt out this winter. A good bet. I should have said he had an option to make it more accurate, but I still see him as certainly being here next year.

Bogie, Devers, Vazquez, Workman and when used, Marco have done well. Walden & ERod, too. All the rest fell short of my hopes or expectations.

The season is not even over, but for some, like myself, looking forward to next year (and beyond) offers more to think and talk about than the remainder of the 2019 season. There is a lot of unknowns about next year. Who will be the GM? Will we reset the luxury tax and begin some sort of rebuild? Will we re-sign any of our free agents to be or try to extend Betts? Will JBJ, Leon and others still under team control be back? How good can we be under each spending plan we choose? If we choose to rebuild, how long might it take to become a top contender again and will anyone on the team now be here to see it? Here's a look at the specifics of our current roster and how it relates to next season: Free Agents: Brock Holt (perhaps the only one who may be back) Rick Porcello (the innings eater departs) Mitch Moreland (the oft-injured one departs) Steve Pearce (We hardly knew ya!) Andrew Cashner (Just didn't work out here) Likely Deadwood: Dustin Pedroia (Chances are just too slight for hopes.) Rusney Castillo (Not on 40 man- last year of contract) Possible Trade Fillers, Non Tenders or DFA Candidates: Jackie Bradley Jr. (Will hate to see him go.) Steven Wright (How much more can we take?) Sandy Leon (Is being Sale's caddy enough?) Ryan Brasier (pre-arb) Brian Johnson (No options left) Hector Velazquez (pre-arb) Mike Shawaryn (pre-arb) Colten Brewer (pre-arb) Sam Travis (pre-arb- may keep around) Tzu-Wei Lin (pre-arb- may keep around) Ryan Weber (pre-arb) Travis Lakins (pre-arb) Bobby Poyner (pre-arb) Trevor Kelley (pre-arb) Joey Curletta (pre-arb) Chris Owings (pre-arb) 1-2 Arbs left (Trade if Rebuilding or Keep if Not?) Mookie Betts (1 arb left) Brandon Workman (1 arb) Eduardo Rodriguez (2 arbs) Matt Barnes (2 arbs) Heath Hembree (2 arbs) Certain Keepers (Hard to trade due to Contract Cost): Chris Sale David Price JD Martinez Nathan Eovaldi Certain Keepers (Build Around the Core/Promising pre-arb Players)) Raphel Devers (pre-arb) Xander Bogaerts Andrew Benintendi (3 arbs) Christian Vazquez Michael Chavis (pre-arb- could be traded or be handed 1B or 2B) Marcus Walden (pre-arb) Josh Taylor (pre-arb) Marco Hernandez (pre-arb) Rule 5 Candidates: Christopher Acosta Fabian Andrade Yoan Aybar Roldani Baldwin Eduard Bazardo Gary Calvo Marino Campana Pedro Castellanos Rusney Castillo CJ Chatham Jake Cosart Ricardo Cubillan Bobby Dalbec Enmanuel De Jesus Chad De La Guerra Jhonathan Diaz Jerry Downs Devon Fisher Matthew Gorst Kyle Hart Trenton Kemp Matt Kent Adam Lau Nick Lovullo Everlouis Lozada Tate Matheny Samuel Miranda Oddanier Mosqueda Josh Ockimey Angel Padron Yorvin Pantoja Keibert Petit Roniel Raudes Austin Rei Hildemaro Requena Jeremy Rivera Kleiber Rodriguez Jake Romanski Jagger Rusconi Alberto Schmidt Andrew Schwaab Nick Sciortino Kevin Steen Cole Sturgeon Kervin Suarez Luke Tendler Josh Tobias Marcus Wilson It might be a hard winter to debate, until we know what the spending choice will be. I'm leaning towards re-setting this winter, but going for one more ring in 2020 and re-setting after 2020 might be more likely. Then again, maybe we never re-set. Let's keep it real, and keep personal attacks on other threads. I'll do a budget analysis, soon.

Okay, but trading for Greinke would have done that.

Yes, the tight budget was DD's doing, but I don't hold it against him, since it worked. We have a ring because of his spending and trades. That doesn't mean he's not to blame for the mess we're in, now. A great GM plans to win without sacrificing so much of the future. DD went overboard to win. Perhaps, he had to do it. Perhaps not. Theo did a pretty good juggling act and Ben tried to do both, and actually did get one ring due to some bold moves (like the Dodger dump), but he was too close to the 10 last place finishes for one ring for most fans' liking. I have no issues with DD, but I knew what was going to happen. It's pay the piper time. A little history: I've been a Sox fan since the early 70's. We had some very good teams but never did what it took to put us over the top. (We had some bad luck, too, but that's not part of my point.) I used to argue with my friends and relative that I'd gladly have us finish in last place 10 times for just one ring. I know, I was young then. That's not good business, and I might have stopped watching after 5 years of horrible play, but the sentiment has merit. Finishing so close for many years might keep fans in the park, but it sucks. Once we won a ring, of course, I didn't want us to suck for 1 year, let alone 10, but winning it all is what makes me most happy, and I'm okay with a few off years here and there, as long as I feel like there is a plan to get better--way better--ring winning better. Currently, there is a a big challenge in regards to our future. I don't think DD is the guy to initiate and implement a rebuilding plan. I'm hopeful the rebuild will not take long and we can keep a few core players along the way, and they'll still be here for the next ring (Devers, Bogey, Sale and maybe Betts). Let's see.

Exactly. We criticze DD for tying up our budget for years to come then criticize Cashman for not doing the same. (This is why I had hoped the Yanks signed Machado AND Harper last winter, and people called me nuts!)

If you won the spelling bee 3 years in a row, maybe you could yell it after losing this year. They'd probably ban you for life, though.

Since pen additions are crapshoots, he may have had little chance but not no chance. Not getting anyone is "no chance." He also had a chance to sign different players than Eovaldi and Pearce, although he had valid reasons to sign both. He could have spent the money on 3-4 players. He had "chances."

Trading Bauer didn't help for this year.

True, but we had a few million and at the deadline, you only owe a player about 1/3 of his salary. We could have tried.

That's assuming he guessed right on the additions and was able to go over the max line. He did acquire Cashner for the 5th spot- he just sucked for us. No pen help was criminal negligence.

Can we trade all 13 for 2-3 decent and reliable role players?

I didn't even mention JBJ, who may very well be traded or non tendered this winter. The shorter list would be the likely keepers (listed in order of seniority on the 40 man roster): (only 15-17 players!) Pedey (because we have to) Vazquez (2 years left + option) JBJ (last arb- may be traded or non tendered) Workman (last arb) Bogey (locked up) Betts (last arb) Barnes (2 arbs left) ERod (2 arbs left) Marco (still pre-arb) Price (3 years left) Beni (3 arbs left) Sale (locked up) Devers (still pre-arb) JD (options remaining) Walden (pre-arb) Chavis (pre-arb) J Taylor (pre-arb) Maybe 19-23 total keepers, if you add these 4 ... Hembree (2 arbs left) Wright (1 arb) Johnson (pre-arb) Brasier (per-arb)

I'd love to see the Rays beat the Cubbies. I'm with you.

Cashman- starters. DD- relievers.