moonslav59

LOL. Which one or two would you have wanted, if only 1 or 2?

I guess the pro-Giolito people point to 2019 through 2021, his nice first half of 2023 and his age of 29 as major factors in his support. I'm not so sure his last 2 years are an outlier. Let's hope we finally get one of the reclamation projects to work for us. $19.25M x 2 is a lot of money for a high risk pitcher, but he does take the b all every 5th day, which has real value. (Wacha and Hill kinda worked.)

My choices: I'd have paid Yamamoto what he got with LA and Nola with PHI, but I doubt they'd have come here at equal cost, so I'm not listing them. (Yamamoto would be my #1 choice and Nola would maybe be my #4- after ERod and before Lugo.) Yes 1. Gray $25M x 3 2. ERod $20M x 4 3. Lugo $15M x 3 Maybe 4. Giolito $19.25M x 2 5. Wacha $16M x 2 6. Montas $14M x 1

Yamamoto $325M/12 A Nola $172M/7 E Rod $80M/4 S Gray $75M/3 S Lugo $45M/3 Giolito $38.5M/2 Wacha $32M/2 Mahle $22M/2 Montas $14M/1 Flaherty $14M/1 None of the above I tried to post a poll, but I could not get it to work.

Updated Sox CBT Budget for 2024 (from cots) 29.1 Devers 23.3 Story 19.3 Giolito 18.0 Yoshida 17.0 to ATL for Sale 16.0 Jansen 8.00 Pivetta (arb est) 7.50 Martin 5.85 O'Neill (arb est) 4.69 Whitlock 2.00 McGuire (arb est) 2.00 Refsnyder 1.50 Schreiber (arb est) 1.00 Criswell 0.75 Hosmer (0.76 in 2025 and then it's done) 17.0 Est Player Benefits 9.69 Pre-arb players 5.22 Injured List 2.25 40 man roster in minors 1.67 0-3 year bonus pool TOTAL: $191.78M $45.22 under Tax Line If the reports are true that we are looking to trim more salaries, whether to make room for other salary or to line JH's pocket, maybe we might try to trade Jansen (16.0), Pivetta (8.0), Martin (7.5), Refsnyder (2.0) or McGuire (2.0) and replace them with in system players or not.

Grissom has only 64 games in MLB under his belt, and those are spread out over 2 seasons. His 236 PAs are 106 more than needed to graduate from official rookie status. I wonder where he'd be placed on the Sox prospects rankings, if he did not graduate- maybe... 1. Anthony 2. Mayer 3. Teel 4. Rafaela 5. Bleis 6. Grissom (maybe as high as 4 or 5) 7. Yorke 8. Perales 9. Abreu 10. Wikelman or Cespedes

Agreed. However, giving details, assuming they made a fair offer, might be perceived as throwing Betts under the bus, and then we'd hear fans saying "this is why nobody wants to play for Boston." I doubt we made a formal offer of $300M, but maybe Betts knew that's about what we were prepared to offer, but never did, because the agent said "not enough." The one consistent thing about the Sox, under Henry is the idea that we are very firm on the valuing of our own players as they approach or reach free agency, and we never seem to budge above the amount we set, no matter how much the market changes. It's worked a number of times, most notably with Pedro and Ellsbury, but also with some less glitzy players like Porcello. We traded some before they became FAs that worked out fine- as well, like Nomar, Manny, Beckett, Price, Lackey, Vaz. There is a sizable list of ones that did not work out so well with us, but none like Betts.

There is so much gray area in these negotiations. Sometimes numbers are "floated," but no firm offer is ever made. For example, Betts' agent might ask, what numbers are you thinking about, and the Sox might have said, "somewhere around $300M/10," and the agents says that's not enough. Maybe the agent never countered with a price they'd accept, and the Sox never tried to find out what price it would take, but my guess is that the agent said a ballpark number Betts wanted, and the Sox never bothered to up their initial amount floated. End of negotiations. Just my guess. I could be way off on what happened, but this could explain the Merloni statement, without contradicting the Betts statement that no offer was given, as no formal offer was actually given.

The bad D reports are for SS. I think he will be an average defender at 2B, at worst, and could easily be a plus by season's end. Our D was horrible, last year, at 2B. I can't see him being worse than the carousel we watched, last season. We were 29th at 2B in Outs Above Average at -13. Bal was 30th at -14. -4 EValdez -3 Urias -2 Reyes -2 Kike -2 Arroyo -1 Turner Way different sample sizes on this list. Their success rates tell a better story on who was the worst: -7% Turner (gone) -4% Kike (gone) -4% Reyes -3% Urias (gone) -3% Valdez -1% Arroyo (gone) Grissom has been at -4% from 2022-2023, combined, but the sample size is small. In 368 innings at SS, his DRS is -3. (It's -7 at SS in 168 innings.) UZR/150 -7.6 at 2B (-0.9 Range, -0.7 Error Rate, -0.5 DP Rate) -52.5 at SS Maybe I'm being a homer thinking he can be a plus on D at 2B.

I really enjoyed watching Sale pitch, too. It was sad knowing these injuries were frustrating to him as much as us. He was one of the top 3 Sox pitchers I have ever seen (Pedro & Clemens.) I liked the extension we gave him. Not many did or will admit it, now. I felt better about him being ready to pitch in 2024 than I did before '23, '22, '21 and '20. I like this Grissom guy, though, and if Sale does not pitch much, next season, I'll feel better about this trade, but I will miss Sale.

We don't have many big arb raises, though. cots estimated salary bumps 2023>2024: 5.4>8.0 Pivetta (3rd of 3 arbs) 1.2>2.0 McGuire (2 of 3) .75>1.5 Schreiber (1 of 3) (We traded Dugo and Urias before their last arbs.) This looks like the least amount of arb raises in a long time for the Sox.

The same, last winter, despite spending a ton. One caveat about 2024, the devers extension is not counted.

I have to think, if nobody has told their side of the story in detail, by now, we may never know.

Yes. he's almost 23 and maybe can improve his power. A nice OBP is pretty damn good, too. The 236 PA sample size in the majors, spread out over 2 seasons, is not enough to get a good read on this kid, but he did have a .339 OBP. His SLG is .407, but he did average about 14 HRs and 30 2B+3B per 650 PAs. That's not great, but not horrible, either. He had a .501 SLG in AAA (.477 career in 4 years of the minors.) OBP often does not transfer over from the minors to the majors all that well, but his .419 OBP in AAA and .407 overall is really nice.

Oh, you know the budget limit? Do tell.... (I don't drink.)

Pivetta is a workhorse, too, and nobody wants a rotation of 5 Pivetts or even 5 Giolitos. Well, maybe the pen might. Look, I get the point. It is a plus to have innings eaters, as long as they pitch well enough to keep their slot, all year. (Pivett lost his slot for part of 2023.) I'm glad not having to pray for Sale's health, this spring. I hope Giolito can regain his form. He was pretty damn good from 2019-2021. I'm glad we have a promising young 2Bman with some real upside ceiling. We've added some pitching depth beyong Gio, and more depth it always a plus, but I was really hoping on improving quality more than quality- just once. Yes, Gio can outpitch Sale in 2024 in quality, but that is far from a given. The more IP is pretty damn certain.

LOL! There have been a lot of under the radar moves, and one article says we have spent in the top 10, so far this winter. Overall, not counting FAs lost, I think we got more than we gave up. I like O'Neill more than Dugo. I like Grissom more than Urias I like all the pitchers we got more than Sale: Giolito Campbell Fitts Weissert Criswell Judice Max Castillo Nick Robertson, Victor Santos, Drohan and R Fernandez for Slaten, Oilveras, Benitez

I agree, and Walmart should pay their employees enough to not qualify for food stamps.

I'm assuming he has options. 4.4 K/9 in 2023 4.0 BB/9 in 2023 20 IP

I hoped we'd go up to the second line, this year, but I never expected it or even going to the first line. All bets are off on our budget and have been for years, including the year we went over, when it looked like we did not want to do that. When Werner said "full throttle," it did get my hopes up on the budget area, but it's all been lies upon lies. I call it a sham.

It's not just about ending up $10M below the tax line and saying that was the money saved by the Sale trade, and they did not spend it. Or, if we end up $5-6M under and saying we only spent half of the "savings." Many feel, we have a secret budget for 2024. Did this trade mean we will spend $10M more, based on those savings, or will we adjust that budget $10M lower. It's hard to know. Personally, if we end up $5 or more million under the tax line, I'll view it as not spending that money. Remember, we also "saved money" by trading Dugo and Urias, too. Whose money will we have spent. That's what I meant by contorting ourselves deciding, if we end up spending it, or not. When we traded Beni, some felt like the money saved went to sign Renfroe. Others pointed out that we could say it was spent on Marwin.

Prospects Live had him #2: https://www.prospectslive.com/prospects-live/atlanta-braves-2022-top-30-prospects PHYSICAL Tall and physical frame with room to add good weight. Has above-average athleticism and twitch, but is likely to lose some as he ages. This portends a move to third base or second base long term, but it’s not a body that will require a substantial amount of maintenance long term. STRENGTHS Cool, calm, and collected at the plate. Radiates a maturity beyond his years, makes good swing decisions, has an above-average rate of contact, and gets on-base at a plus rate. Best contact is still center-oppo but will show the ability to turn on inside pitches and drive them to his pull-side. High amount of barreled line-drive contact. Shows plus raw power in game, should translate to above-average to plus power production long term. WEAKNESSES Fringe-average defensive player, likely not a shortstop long term, limited speed and range. Likely ends up elsewhere in the infield long term. Still learning to drive the ball to his pull-side, makes best contact center-oppo. Likely a fringe-average runner at maturation. SUMMARY One of the most exciting young players in the Atlanta system. Shows feel to hit, a discerning eye at the plate, and the ability to drive the ball to all fields. He has versatility defensively and an above-average arm. Has true star upside with an everyday player floor. Not a freak twitch athlete but a player with good baseball skills and a fair amount of polish for a younger prospect with little pro experience entering 2021. Showed well across two levels of A-Ball. Likely to end up a bat first third baseman long term with the ability to get on base and impact the ball.

I am certain nobody would take him at his full contract cost. It's interesting that BTV had the value of Grissom at $17M, and the Sox with a net gain of $5.8M balance on the deal. The more I read about Grissom, the more I like him, but we all know about the good things we read about Downs, too. The part of the trade that upsets me the most is about the idea we will not really be spending the money saved on the trade, unless we contort our thinking to convince ourselves we will. If the club was thinking we are losing Sale's full contract, next year and we could add $10M AAV to what we thinking we could pay for a FA SP'er in AAV for 2024, it could make a big difference, but sadly, it does not look like that is how the team budget thoughts are like, right now. I certainly had grown tired of wishing and wishing on Sale's return. Then, we never knew if he ever did return, what would he look like? He did look pretty good in his last 15 starts to the season- a pretty significant sample size, but not really enough to know for sure, he can pitch really well for a whole season. I wish him luck. I liked how he seemed to be a fierce competitor. We seem to be lacking in those types of players. If he does great in 2024, the deal might look real bad, but Grissom has many years to balance out of plus side this deal. Another factor might be about what we might or could get by trading from our 2B depth. BTV has these values for our middle IF'ers: 44.5 Mayer 17.1 Grissom (29.7 AFV) 13.3 Yorke 8.1 E Valdez (20.3) 7.1 Cespedes 4.2 Romero & Zanetello 3.3 Meidroth (3B, too) 2.6 Alcantara 2.3 Paulino 2.3 Reyes (8.5) 2.0 DHam (5.9) & A Anderson I could see us trading EValdez and or Yorke, perhaps as part of a larger package.

I think someone had him as the Braves #3 prospect in 2022.

Name one in "out in force." Business owners all over the world try to maximize profits and don't even care if their products kill or harm people. Telling it like it is does not mean we defend it, approve of it or even apologize for it.