moonslav59
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Everything posted by moonslav59
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I have not lost hope, but the Sale-Gio flip looks more sideways to me than others. I do see it as a gain, but we still have two major holes in the rotation and less and less options to fill them. I was fine with Sale as our 4/5 with Pivetta or Crawford on standby.
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When some posters say we blew it, t they sound like they think it is certain. Maybe I’m wrong on that. Maybe they just think it was way more likely Bogey would have said yes tganks I do, which of course is fine. Maybe a poster or two will chime in and say hey think it’s a fact, the Sox blew it with Bogey or even Betts. On Betts, I suggested we offer $400M/12, and I think he’d have taken that but im still not certain.
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Agreed. I actually wish it means this: $37Mmskes it hard to add 2 very good SPers, unless one is by trade. $47M makes it easier to add 2 very good SPers without trading top prospects for one.☝️
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Are you assuming we spend to within $5-6M of the tax line again? I’m not. I think we can and should. Hell, I think we can and should spend up to $1M below the second line, but we can never count on JH and expect a healthy winter spending budget.
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I state my hypotheticals as such. When people say “The Sox blew it by not extending Bogey, when they could have,” it sounds like a factual statement. I do think several posters still see it as a fact.
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I hope so. It does look like we finally filled the 2B hole, but that’s not really a certainty. IMO, we still need 1 SPsignificantly better than Gio and Sale (Monty, Snell or trade?), and one as good or better than Gio (Stroman or Imanaga?)
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I can certainly see your point, and don’t disagree. Giolito will likely pitch way more in ‘24 and could maybe pitch better than Sale. We basically traded Sale for Giolito and Grissom at a cost of $9M ($19M for Gio- $10M saved on Sale.) That does look good, on paper based on a few assumptions, of course. If we don’t add 2 more SPers, it won’t matter anyway. We aren’t going anywhere nice in’24. Maybe adding one really good SP might be enough, but I doubt it. We do y know how much we will spend or who we might trade in the next month or two, but this roster still has two big holes I throw rotation. We did not address that with the Sale- Gio flip. Adding two more would improve how these two moves look.
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Because Sale is better than nothing. Unless we add a better SP, we just subbed Gio for Sale and still have not one but 2 holes in the rotation. Fine, Gionis s better bet than Sale. We got better at the number 3-4 slot. It’s still a punt if we don’t add 1-2 more SPers better than a #3, IMO.
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Maybe, maybe not. Maybe for 5 starts, maybe for 20, maybe with some luck 28-30.
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I meant to say did not miss some golden opportunities
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I think everyone agrees we should have offered $162M/6 at any point that Bogey would have taken it. No dispute. My dispute is people assume he’d have taken it, and we blew it. I don’t accept that assumption. I do think he would have taken $200M/8 a couple years ago, or maybe NOV ‘22, but even that is an unfounded assumption. I’m not saying the Sox missed some golden opportunities. I’m just saying we cannot state for a fact what Bogey would have accepted, so maybe it doesn’t even matter that we did not offer $162 or200M.
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I think hate is a strong word. If we had no Sale, I’d have been fine adding 2 good SPers and then paying a FA Sale $10M to be my 4th starter and knocking Crawford or Pivetta to the pen. We’d be better with Sale as our 13th pitcher over Mata. Let’s not act like he’s worth nothing. I like the Grissom addition the more I know about him. I do think spending that$10M in2024 matters to balance the trade. If we end up significantly below the tax line, that $10M was useless.
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A certain poster is against these big FA signings, so adding $27M to the 30 we already have would mean 27 more for JH.
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Let’s see if we spend that $10M before counting it as a big part of the trade. When we traded Betts and Price, we never replaced their contract cost savings. When Porcello left-same. Last season we were $6M under, so didn’t spend all the Bogey bolting money, either. If we get a 1-2 pitcher with that money plus more, the trade looks fine. If we end up almost $10M under and left a hole unfilled or a position not upgraded, then the “savings” mean nothing, except to JH’s already fat wallet.
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I’d still rather have Sale in my 5 than Crawford or Pivetta, so I’d prefer getting a 1-2 AND keep Sale. If they money saved in the trade is the difference maker in getting a 1-2, fine, otherwise no.
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He did start more games than Paxton and was 3 away from being second to Bello, this year.
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fangraphs had Grissom ranked 3rd in the ATL system in 2022. 1. Harris 50 2. Strider 45+ 3. Grissom 45 I .
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It’s really about what they do with the $10M saved. If we end up under the tax line by $10M or more, we gained nothing
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Great post. Sure, Sale could get hurt. Sure Giolito might pitch like he has before. Too many ifs. We are basically paying $36M for Giolito and a 2Bman over Sale & Reyes/EValdez. I guess one could think Sale was useless, so we saved $10M and in a sense are paying $9M for Giolito and Grisham, which looks pretty good. These two deals look puzzling, unless we spend big on a SPer.
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Watch Sale start 30 games in ‘24! But seriously, if we spend the $10M on someone else, it could be fine, but will we see about that. Spending up to or over the tax line would likely make this trade better, assuming Brez spends wisely. Lots of ifs in this deal. I’m not sure who said it, but this does look like positioning for something big.
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Who has said wait for Yorke? I don’t like the deal either. I’d have liked signing Sale for $10M/1. I get the injury issues and the Grisham promise but adding Giolito and then paying Sale $17M to play in ATL does not look good, too me. Yes, Giolito takes the ball every 5 days, and that has real value, but I don’t see these two moves as an improvement.
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No way I’d give that for 1 year of Burnes. Sub Pivetta for Anthony and yes.
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That was kind of my point. All w know for sure is that Bogey did not agree to any number we offered or floated or hinted at. We don’t know what those numbers were or what Bogey would have said yes to. For all we know he might have said no to $200M/8, unless offered 3+ years ago. Maybe $220/9 was his number. Unless or until we know for sure, I’m not sure we can call it a mistake. Maybe, if we knew the number we’d have been glad we let him go, assuming we’d spend that Money elsewhere. (Yeah right.)
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He was kidding.
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Okay. I would have flipped them.
