moonslav59

Did we used to draft pitchers more highly? I know Clemens and Hurst were both #1s and Lester a #2. I'm not sure if the percentage of pitchers taken in round 1 or round 1 plus 2 has gone down, or not. That could be part of the drop, but I do think the pipeline/development aspect of our system has declined.

That was the sham. They tried to spend just enough to fool the fans into thinking we'd be competitive. The 2021 season allowed them to "prove it." I think they used that season to pretend they were doing the same, when really, we had no business contending in 2021. It was an outlier year. Signing Story and Yoshida, and now the Devers extension may be a sign they truly want to get relevant, but I'm not falling for it, until I see concrete changes.

I certainly think it's all been a smokescreen or sham, but it's wrong to say JH has stopped spending big. Not "as big," but he has spent a lot since the Story signing, and we haven't even seen the Devers extension kick in, yet. Did we spend wisely? That's debatable. Also, a big reason we have dropped in the spending rankings is that other teams have turned up their spending, big time. We went over the tax line in 2022, after major slashing before the 2020 season. That cannot happen without some major new spending. Arb raises happen every year. That's not the reason we went over. I'm not trying to apologize for JH. I think he made a major blunder by not making sure we kept Betts. I also think that once he left, we could have made a better financial effort to stay relevant, but to say we are not still spending a lot is hyperbole, at best or just plain wrong, at worst.

Even if our pipeline was average, I think SS's have a better success rate, overall. Draft a pitcher, when the estimated success rate and upside potential warrants it.

How about HRam for Beckett? Moncada for Sale? (Yes, a pitcher was included, but the major piece was a non pitcher.)

Agreed. I'm not trying to diss Mayer. I'm just super high on Anthony and Teel, plus it seems like Mayer has more trade value.x I also see a big gap between my #3 Mayer and my #4 Bleis or Cespedes.

Pretty close to soxprospects.com I think the top 3 have a pretty big gap between them and the next set of 2-3 prospects.

Even in 2022, more than half the player payroll budget was Bloom's.

He just extended Devers. Story, Yoshida and many others were signed after DD. While the 2020 budget did not come close to replacing the money spent under DD, and the 2021 came close, the last 2 seasons have been bolstered by new spending. If all JH cared about was making money, why sign Devers, Story and Yoshida, among others? Why not spend like PIT or TBR? The 2023 budget had one big contract left over from DD: Sale. That's it. Others from our system, that were here before Bloom, except for Devers, made peanuts. Tax budget numbers: DD $25.6 Sale $ 17.5 Devers No other DD player made over $3M in 2023. Bloom 23.3 Story 18.0 Yoshida (plus posting fee) 16.0 Jansen 10.8 Turner 10.0 Kluber 10.0 Kike 7.5 Martin 7.0 Duvall 6.3 Dugo 5.4 Pivetta 4.0 Paxton 3.0 Bleier (from carry-over Barnes, who was extended by Bloom) 3.0 Mondesi The total player budget was about $200M. Under $44M was on DD. Look, I wish he'd spend more, too, but it's just not true to act like he's stopped spending big.

Like every business, right?

I doubt we were ever seriously thinking of him, so I don't think the word "pivot" applies, here.

We sign one or promote one of the two dozen we drafted. Who plays OF, when Dugo bolts after 2024? Yoshida should DH. Duran, Abreu, Rafaela and Refnsyder are all either unproven, better used as a platoon or both.

I have Anthony significantly above Mayer. If I had to trade one of our top 3: Anthony, Mayer or Teel, it would be Mayer.

So, spending over $200M per season over the last 2 years was for what reason?

I have always felt letting a generational talent like Betts go was a huge mistake. I still do.

So the angry mob gets to laugh it off and maybe not stay so angry?

I understand the control years and contract part of the value, but I still think the Astros players I mentioned are way undervalued. Walter could have 10 years of control and is not worth 4.4. I've been one of Scheiber's biggest cheerleaders, but I don't see him worth more than Javier or Garcia, let alone both combined.

True, but they could have spent half his money and kept the claim somewhat valid.

Good point. I didn't realize he missed so much time. sxoprospects has him starting out in AAA, and Penrod starting in AA, so maybe Gambrell is more ML ready.

I don't think anyone expected im to "fall off" by now. I think the thought was for the last 4-5 Years

They didn't, though. They traded Betts and Price, and not only did not replace their salaries for 2020, but they cut even further. By 2021, they had replaced some of the massive budget cut from 2019 to 2020, but not a big percentage of it. According to cots, the CB Tax budget was slashed by $59M from '19-'20 (pro-rated) Betts and 1/2 Price did not equal that. 2021 was still $36M below 2019, which was still less than the anual cost of Betts. Had the Sox traded betts and at least come close to the same spending levels, maybe fan anger would not be so intense.

Not the "next 5 years." The 5 year rebuild plus the jump ahead to 6-10 years is More like it.

That decision couple with not even trying to give the impression of replacing him with a few quality players made it even worse.

No doubt.

I think they can get better than that offer. IMO, BTV is undervaluing Bregman and the two pitchers. The Astros are the one other team I've seen play more than a handful of games, each year. IMO, all these guys are undervalued: 8.5 JP France (I'd give 13.3 Yorke or 9.7 Schreiber + 4.4 Walter) 3.1 L Garcia (I'd give Schreiber for him- straight up, or 8.1 EValdez + 4.4 Walter) 3.1 Javier (I'd give Schreiber for him- straight up, or 8.1 EValdez + 4.4 Walter) I'd give up Yorke & Schreiber (22 value) for Javier & Garcia (6.2 value.) No way is Walter better than Garcia or Javier. They also have Perales as better. (3.2 to 3.1) Mata 2.3 + Drohan 2.2 for either one would be a steal.