FredLynn

OK. Its an excuse. Dempster is not that good. Even if he is a decent pitcher we ought to be able to match up with him. Thats the problem: we can't match up with decent starting pitching. If we aren't hitting then the pitching has to pick up the team. But they aren't good enough to do that this year....or last year.....or the year before that. See the trend?

Don't you know that Youkilis is being "showcased" to prospective trade partners? I heard that the "Titleist" company has made an offer for him and that the Boston Disposal Service is considering doing the same.

More bad news: all the other ALE teams but the Orioles are winning, and they are just down a run. Getting close to time to throw in the towel for this season. Probably one or two more games behind the leaders and thats it for me for this season.

Lester is a serviceable #3 SP. I would not trade him either unless he is part of a package to get a better pitcher because pitching is our Achilles heel. The idea is to get a good #1 and 2 SP ahead of him. And those kinds of pitchers will become available at the end of this season.

With all due respect, those two guys are idiots. Who the hell are they anyway? Youkilis coming into this game (he went 0 for 4 today) was at .219/.655, which is similar to what he hit after the ASB last year. He is FINISHED; and he is owed a lot of money. The idea that we will haul in a ML ready player who can contribute in a trade for Youkilis can only be made with a moron of a GM. Its not going to happen. Period.

There is an entire forum to discuss the Patriots. Even if the team stays at .500 there are still things to discuss and argue about.

Truth is, its getting close to the time to admit that, as Bob Ryan said, the Red Sox are not very good this year. Thats just looking at it objectively. So planning for next year and the year after is in order. And that does not involve surrendering any of our prospects; it involves obtaining more prospects because the more we have the more likely it is that one of them will pan out. Also, its nearing time to think about dumping the deadwood on the team as quickly as possible. We all know who that is. We won't get much in return, but at least we get rid of the leeches on the roster. Not quite there yet (giving up on the season), but its close. Getting close to July and we are still in last place two games under .500 and our pitching, overall, stinks. Lose Beckett for a couple of months=season over. Get 10 games behind the leaders=season over. Fail to make a move in the next couple of weeks=season over. This team is on the precipice and our FO has its version of baseball ops constipation.

:lol: Its a f'ing joke. The more other teams see of Youkilis the less they are going to want him. Same about Morales. Its probably time to dump these two for whatever we can get for them because the longer we wait the less we get in return-and its already close to zero.

Right. Lavarnway, a prospect who has proven nothing, Youkilis, an expensive washed up 3B/1B, and Matsusaka who has already proven that he sucks. I doubt the Cubs would take two of those guys for free.

Sure. Like they are showcasing Youkilis?

Bob Ryan said it best: "The Red Sox just aren't very good this year". Simple. Elegant. True.

Wow. A loss to the Cubs. I would say its embarassing except its not really unexpected. The Cubs are a tough team if your team is mediocre. I expect that we will take one of the next two games....because although the Cubs are a tough team when your team is what it is, they are, after all, the worst team in baseball. This should be a wakeup call for anyone thinking we have a good shot at the playoffs. We don't. We have an outside shot and only if our FO wakes up and makes some moves within a week or two. Otherwise, forget it. The season will be over. Oh-noticed that Youkilis and Gonzobum got no hits today. At least we can get rid of one of them; we are stuck with the other bum.

We are going to be lucky to get a bag of golf balls for Youkilis. Who else would you include in that package, since Youkilis is a worthless piece and certainly not the main player?

Larger than three games I would guess. Here is the first response I got from one of the Sawxheads historians. Admittedly, it contains a lot of assumptions. I do believe the part about Lucchino not giving Epstein free hand in the Schilling signing because Epstein was still so new on the job-just like Cherington is being used as a marionette by LL now: First thing you have to remember is that in 2003 when the Sox brass went to Schilling's house at Thanksgiving--Theo, despite the GM title, was still Larry's apprentice, with Larry still having total veto power over anything Theo wanted to do. So that's a huge point that's been forgotten in folklore. Here's the main points: 1. Schilling and D'Backs owner Jerry Colangelo became very close during his stay in AZ. They won the WSC in 2001. In 2003 Colangelo decided to unload some contracts and asked Curt if he'd be willing to waive his no-trade. Curt told him two teams only--Yankees or Phillies. That went public with Curt publicly laughing off any Sox possibility, calling the Sox "A piece of ****, loser organization." 2. Colangelo began talks with Steinbrenner and the Yankees. Now, mind you, a year or so previous to that Colangelo had reached a handshake agreement with David Wells to pitch for the D'Backs, only to have Steinbrenner swoop in and take him away at the last minute. So there was bad blood between the two, but they initially tried to civilly reach an agreement for Schilling to head to NY (which was Curt's preference at that point). The Sox made overtures, but were told "No way," by Curt and Colangelo. Things quickly went sour again between Colangelo and Steinbrenner, becoming increasingly nasty to the point where Colangelo refused to deal Curt to NY. Not only did he cut off talks, he now wanted revenge. 3. Colangelo appealed to Curt, as a friend, to help him exact the ultimate revenge against Steinbrenner by considering Boston. There were unconfirmed reports that Colangelo paid Curt off to change his mind, but whether or not that's true it was only a matter of days until Curt acquiesced, agreed to at least listen to the Sox brass and allowed the Sox contingency to his home on Thanksgiving. Henry, Werner and Larry and Theo all went. Henry and Werner left Larry and Theo behind after a day and two days later Larry announced they had the deal done. The Sox had Curt and Colangelo had his revenge by trading Curt to Steinbrenner's hated rival. A few days later Curt was in Boston spewing, "I hate the Yankees. The Yankees suck." Go figure. 4. It's also important to remember that, at the time of the announcement, Larry was deeply committed to building up Theo's credibility after having taken some criticism for handing Theo the job at such a young age---so Larry, in essence, gave birth to all this Theo folklore by embellishing Theo's role in the Schilling trade. Larry really kind of purposely took a back seat and had Theo take the bows. That's how a lot of this crap got started. In the end, Pumps---whether it was really Theo or Larry or Henry or whoever who people claim engineered the Curt deal is inconsequential. It's all moot. At least that's what I found when I researched it very thoroughly back in the day. The whole deal, and the Sox involvement, was conceived and consummated, not out of any mastery, sheer determination or professional artistry by the Sox brass, but due to Colangelo being consumed by hatred for Steinbrenner and being willing to take as little as a bag of balls in return if it meant he could screw Big George all the way with the red hot poker--which he did. This was purely payback, with both Schilling and the Sox being nothing more than pawns in a rich guys' ongoing spat. The Sox were merely the right team, in the right division, at the right time. Nothing more, nothing less. They could have sent Trot Nixon down to Schilling's with a six pack and the result would have in all probability been the same. The rest of course is history, with Theo's role becoming increasingly embellished by the year. My guess is that the truth really won't come out until Larry writes his book at some point after he retires. That's the basic summary. I hope this helps. PM me if you have any more Qs.

Small sample size, and you know it. What was his career ERA at Fenway before he got there? Was it under 5? If not, why pay him like a King?

Almost everyone here gives Theo substantial credit for 2004 and 2007. Those who don't are dilusional. He was the GM or chief personnel person during those years. The moves he made--the team he put on the field--won the World Series. Twice. He deserves credit. The list of players he added who actually won the World Series was substantial. I don't know of anyone who won't give Epstein some credit for those rings. You are right: anyone who gives him NO credit is delusional. That said, there are those who give him too much credit, especially for the 04 ring, as much of that team was already assembled by Duquette, as I documented earlier. And there are also those who ignore the lengthy list of mistakes he made and anyone who puts Epstein on some sort of pedestal is just as delusional. IMO he was mediocre. Thanks for the rings; and screw him for hobbling this team for another 2-3 years as we try to undo the damage he did to the franchise before left town.

Thats his JOB Youk. He isn't getting a pass on this one, not from me. Lets use some real life examples so that I can better get my point across. When I attended UMass undergrad many years ago they built the library on campus. Shortly after it was built it was shut down. The reason given was that the engineers forgot to include the weight of the books in their calculations of how much stress would be put on the flooring. Does that engineer get off because, really, how was he supposed to know that the weight of the books needed to be taken into consideration? When the Big Dig was constructed the contractor used substandard tiles and as a result some of them fell down, I believe killing some people. Does that contractor get off too because he thought the cheaper tiles would work? In my own business there are decisions made about patient care that I have to live with. Do you think that the courts are going to accept from me "Well, how was I supposed to know that that baby would die if I didn't intubate him?" Or "How was I supposed to know that kid had appendicitis? I thought it was a stomach virus." Similarly, Epstein is supposed to be a professional and be able to judge talent on the FA market better than you and me. He is allowed some mistakes, but the sheer number of errors in judgement that he has made over the years makes him a very mediocre GM. In the case of Lackey there was evidence that he would fail at Fenway: his ERA at that park was already horrendous. Why did Epstein expect that to change? And in the case of Crawford he could have noticed that while 2010, his contract year, his OPS was .851, his career OPS was just .773. Why hand out such a huge contract for that kind of hitter, one, I might add, with a weak arm in the OF. The bottom line is that its HIS job to judge talent, and he didn't do a very good job at it at all.

I said I would give him about 40% of the credit for that team. No more. I'll attempt to get in touch with the people who know about the Schilling deal. They are on the other board.