FredLynn

Duquette got it started; Epstein finished the job. That is a matter of fact. I never said Epstein sucked as a GM; I think he was mediocre. As to how these two produced a winner: "Even a blind squirrel occasionally finds a nut"

I guess I am not understanding you. If Hamels pitched in a league where there is a DH, his ERA would be higher, right? The use of the DH does make a difference. Right now the AL is scoring about a quarter of a run per game more than the NL. So if you add that .25 to Hamels' ERA its up to 3.64. He is still better than Shields, but not by much, as I said.

Crawford is overpaid, but you guys have given up on him too soon IMO. I think he is going to contribute in a positive way to the team, once he is healthy.

There is no doubt that Duquette was even worse than Epstein. That does not make Epstein a good GM. When you are compared to someone who is incompetent, unless you are also totally incompetent, you are bound to look good.

That should be done only if we can sign Garza to a deal longer than the one more year he is signed for now. Otherwise we are giving up a prospect for a one and a half year Garza rental. Since, realistically, this season is likely lost in terms of making the playoffs (no, I am not completely throwing in the towel just yet), they have to be careful about tossing away our top prospects for what could already be a lost cause.

He is someone I probably would not sign to a long term deal because of that statistic. Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me. The Lackey deal should be a learning experience for our FO.

Thanks. I will look at that in more detail later on. Baseball is a relatively simple game. Its runs scored/runs prevented. I think you can get bogged down too much in overanalyzing the game with countless ways to look at data. In the end, a good pitcher is one who prevents the other guys from scoring runs, be it in Boston or in Tampa Bay or anywhere else, so I think that the single (but not the only) best indicator of that is ERA. If others want to use ERA+ to support their positions, thats fine. And for hitting its OPS because I want a guy who can hit for both average and power on my team. There are lots and lots of statistics, and which ones you feel best give you a true picture is a matter of personal preference. I would rather not have to dig up 20 different ways to look at performance; a couple of data points are sufficient for me to form an opinion, and until hard proof is presented that a different approach is better, I'll stick with what I believe. Others are free to do the same.

Maybe Kalish just the first of the Pawtucket kids to be brought up. I would also like to see Lavarnway up, and if Aviles continues to suck, Iglesias as soon as he is healthy enough to come up. My guess is that these kids will be fun to watch, that they will inject a little enthusiasm into what is now a lifeless character of the team, and that we will probably win more games than with some of the deadwood we have now. In any event, its time for the youth movement to take hold.

Look at it this way. If ERA+ measures runs scored in your home ballpark, does it also account for the fact that in Boston we have had one of the top offenses both at home and on the road for several years, along with one of the worst pitching staffs both at home and on the road? We do play half our games on the road, do we not? ERA+ is only minimally useful in measuring a pitcher's real value. Roy Halladay's OPSa at Fenway Park, for his career, is .684. A good pitcher is a good pitcher wherever he pitches.

BBQ to go to Emmz...said so on page 2 or so. No one here is a fairweather fan or they would have left long ago.

The season lives on to see another day. Every game is a big game from here until the end of September. Thats the kind of hole this team has dug for themselves.

Not a hitter at all right now. You guys enjoy the game. Got a BBQ to attend; no Sox fans there, just divers. To VA: its safe to enter the game thread now.

Guess he is the best we have. Sad, isn't it. That game is a testament to all those fans who thought we had a chance if our top 3 SP remained healthy all season. It was never going to happen, and its not over yet. It would take incredible luck for that to happen, yet we stocked our lower tier in the rotation with untested question marks. One worked out; one failed miserably. Now Beckett is down, probably for a long time. And we get Morales. Or Cooke. Or Germano. And some people think its still early and remain optimistic for the team. I just don't see how that can be justified with the reality of our situation.

I know exactly what ERA+ is. I do not think it is as useful as simple ERA because I think that good pitchers get hitters out no matter where they pitch.

SFF, I admire your optimism, I really do. But to say "its only June" is a joke. Next month are you going to say "its only July"? This team has been in last place or close to it every day of this season so far. They are a MESS, and they are far less talented than a lot of people think. Thats WHY they are in last place. If they were a highly talented club, they would be in the hunt for a playoff position. The Jays won today; they Yankees are about to win too. If we lose tonite and go 9 games behind the Yankees its time for everyone to wrap their arms around the fact that we are not going to make the playoffs this year. This is a team on the precipice. One more false step and they jump into the abyss. Sorry, but thats the way it is.

Thats a little off. Hamels vs Shields: Hamels, but not by much. His ERA is lower, but he also pitches in the NL. Lester vs Price: Price. Not even close. Price career ERA is 3.33; Lester at 3.61-and he is five years older than Price. Price any day. Beckett vs Hellickson: Hellickson. Not really that close either. Beckett has a career ERA of 3.85, but 4.05 (very very mediocre) with the Red Sox; Hellickson has a career ERA of 3.14 in the ALE-and he is 7 years younger. Moore will be very good very soon; he and Buchholz right now: CB. Soon it will likely be a tossup. Doubront is an unknown quantity still, and has an ERA in his first 2 1/2 months as a SP of 4.39; Niemann: 4.11. Lower ERA, more experience. I take Niemann. In summary, if you look at the actual statistics, the Sox have a better top pitcher, are losers at the #2, 3, and 5 spots even if we get Hamels. Thats looking at it objectively rather than overestimating the value of a player simply because he plays for the Red Sox. That has been done too much and has lead to the current level of expectations of this team over the past few years. They simply are not as talented as many people think; thats why they are a last place club.

The statute of limitations on complaining about Epstein will expire when the team fully extricates itself from the mess he left it in, and that will be defined as after we win the next World Series. Until then, Epstein is fair game.

And the Red Sox are about average for a baseball team. Is that sufficient? We need above average players at as many positions as possible. If Aviles cannot hit the baseball better than he is hitting now, he can be jettisoned along with all the other deadwood on this team, and we can bring up Iglesias or Ciriaco. If we are not going to make the playoffs and if we are going to be a .500 team this year, I would much rather watch the kids than the overpaid spoiled veterans who still think this is a country club.

Welcome back. Not everyone here is an apologist Just to comment on a previous post of yours, the team really doesn't suck. It infuriating, for sure, but its more of a mediocre team than a sucky team. The Twins suck. So do the Royals and the Cubs. When you hover around .500 all year your team is ordinary and mediocre. As I recall, you are the mod of TalkPats, right? They are loaded this year. Should be a very good season for the NE Patriots.

The Yankees found a way to beat Gio Gonzalez. We didn't. We didn't even get a single run off Dempster. We just took the day off. These are the Cubs; we should be beating them like a rug.....if we had a good team, that is.