cp176

I agree with you in general. I was a History/English guy so I know that I am guilty of over reacting when I focus on words. It is obvious that they aren't hitting as a group like they did last year. I'm just not all that surprised. I truly felt that they were apt to be substantially less productive this year than last. I felt the new influx of pitching could very well make up for it. The choice was made to not bring in bats capable of at least coming close to replacing Papi. I don't think that anybody could have really predicted that this is the most that we were going to get from third to date (that might change).

I'm focusing on career stats and I'm seeing Bogaerts and Bradley outperforming career norms. It is a matter of perspective. There is no question that a number of these guys aren't hitting like they did last year. Maybe for some of them it just isn't who they really are. I like career averages. Down for sure but as a group, I don't see it as massive under production.

Are they really that far off their career norms? Of the guys that are in there daily for the most part, yes it does look like Ramirez is off the mark but recently has been able to on occasion hit it where most of our other guys can't .

I've go no argument I guess- Are you surprised that Leon is down? What are Hanley's career numbers? I'll Pedey as is. Bogey down that much really? What did people expect? Beni - Who really knows where he should be just yet? JBJ - just doesn't seem all the off to me Betts - yup - I guess Young - infrequent player - Holt - pretty much same as Young Vaz - doesn't matter still can't hit

I don't think that things are really all that bleak but I will say that I'm not sure I ever understood where the euphoria was coming from with this team's future hitting prospects. Betts - I still like but maybe he won't be quite as good going forward as last year made us think he would. Third base is what it is and maybe it is about to start to be straightened out. Moreland was never meant to replace Papi. Ramirez's career has been an up and down one. I like Benitendi but once again he is a lot smaller than the stats say he is. He will have a good career just not Fred Lynn like. JBJ is playing like he always has. I'm not sure where the power projection for Bogaerts ever come from. A lot of people hoping I guess. We have known for years really that we have two pretty good catchers who really aren't likely to hit much and Pedroia just keeps on going. If we move along this year it will be primarily due to our pitching which is not a bad thing at all. We still are on top in the east. I still think that DD has a plan. You can't solve every problem in a heartbeat.

Hey - you should know by now that batting average is a uselessly outdated statistic - lol

#3 works for me - in general, I don't think that collectively they are as good as most of us think they are.

I agree with everything here. My guess is that Eck does even fewer road games now.

animal lover=can't be all bad

There is something about this story that bugs me. What we know is that Price runs his mouth. I'm not sure that that bothers me all that much. When Shaughnessy alludes to others applauding Price for defending teammates (I guess) is he talking about one, two, or 10 other guys. I love Eck but hey I like Johnny Miller as well. I'm not uncomfortable at all with their outspoken comments. They entertain me but I'm not the one being talked about. I'm not sure that this story is even news worthy. We aren't talking Watergate here. If the point is that this team lacks leadership, maybe it isn't telling an accurate story. If the team in general is behind Price (which I have no way of ever knowing), we might not like his style but maybe he is their leader. I would think that if you are asked to accurately and honestly comment on team or individual play and the team or individual plays poorly, you would not be expected to lie about it. Having these guys travel together doesn't make any sense to me. I would also think that if I was the teammate being criticized, regardless of how poorly I had played, I would probably still appreciate my teammate's support - right or wrong. Ultimately I guess I think it would have been nice if Farrell had done or said something. Maybe he did, I don't know.

hope that you are right - I don't necessarily think that almost everyone is under performing though. Anyway keep the faith I guess.

yup - anybody who actually pays to go see them play. When real fans go to fenway, they will be ok as long as they understand that most of the people there are just going for entertainment purposes. Who cares about the outcome of the game.

somehow i'm going to catch hell for you saying this - lol

Although I do agree with you about the pitching - particularly the starting pitching, I think there needs to be a balance. I think we lack that balance with this team. I also think that doing anything too drastic this season really isn't called for. Maybe Devers will give us a little more of what we lack.

A lot of truth in what you have said here. Being a player's manager doesn't mean that you let the players do all of the managing.

I was aware of the JBJ situation and of course now Price. Sounds like maybe you have heard that the disgruntlement is more widespread than just these two. What else have you heard?

I have given this one some thought and I think that I am with you here. Initially I guess I saw this as a trade to really strengthen the bullpen - a weakness that needed to be addressed but when I look at this as possibly giving up on a player like Shaw I guess I agree. I really liked Shaw at third base for this team. He showed excellent power at the plate and a very strong arm at third. The general feeling of the people posting here was that based on his poor end of season performance he was expendable. I also liked the fact that he was a big athlete. I think we need some guys that at least look like imposing at the plate.

For me I guess I have it figured out. It is about the choice of words. Words like panic and desparation do not apply here for me. I understand very well why people might not like the move but dissecting it with words that connote something really serious I guess confuses me. Maybe a lack of patience but not panic to me anyway. But you see I have also read that many people think that with the deals that DD has made that he was all in for this season. I never saw it quite like that. I saw them as moves to strengthen our team. I understand the value of defense - it enabled me to play.lol I agree that we might be giving up something here on the defensive end but I really don't think in my world anyway anything was done that resembles panic or desperation. It's good I guess that we all don't see things the same way.

Damn them all.

And herein perhaps lies the rub. is this really a sign of changing times? Is this what happens when you load up a room with very rich, very young, entitled (in their minds) people? There continues to be something about this team that I just don't like in general.

Come on SS - I understand why you might not be in favor of making this move right now but do you really think that this is a move that could in any way be considered panicky? I sure don't. I respect your opinion as always but a panic move?

I know that you are right. I really just wish that I liked them a little more. There is just something missing here for me.

I agree. A panic move would have been giving up prospects for a part time rental. Looks to me as though the big decision was to at least try to turn the third base position into something that might give us offensive production or staying the course with decent defense and next to no offense. I'm hoping that Devers will be adequate in the field. I'm pretty sure that he will give us more offense than we have ween to date at third but we shall soon see.

I do think that he is elite. He would be the one that (imo) the big money should be spent on going forward. Personally I have been guilty of thinking that many of our players are better than what everyone else has. I've been very protective of them. I am beginning to think that most of our everyday players could be replaced. I'm not particularly attached to any of them.

imo - a panic move would have been to give up any prospects for a one year rental third baseman with Devers sitting at the AAA level. This move makes sense based on team needs. I hope that it works out.