Mike Napoli performance thread.

[seabeachfred]

I am not sure if the Sox are just trying to test how far off his lofty horse Beltran is willing to go but that guy scares me. I really would not want to see him in a Sox uni unless on a very short deal. Even then, I would have to think he would represent some sort of stop gap measure for the Sox and nothing more.

 

We're on the same page with that jung. Beltran wants a three or four year contract and for us to go along with that would be nuts, especially since his speed is practically gone and his range along with it. He still can hit but we need a first baseman, not another outfielder. I'm not completely sold on Bradley but the Red Sox say they are and they know more about him than I do. If so give the kid the shot. Besides, don't we have Brentz close to being ready down in Triple AAA?

[marklmw]

We're on the same page with that jung. Beltran wants a three or four year contract and for us to go along with that would be nuts, especially since his speed is practically gone and his range along with it. He still can hit but we need a first baseman, not another outfielder. I'm not completely sold on Bradley but the Red Sox say they are and they know more about him than I do. If so give the kid the shot. Besides, don't we have Brentz close to being ready down in Triple AAA?

 

Brentz is near being MLB ready. It will be interesting to see how he does in Florida this coming Spring. Sox have enough outfielders why go after someone as old as Beltran who could lose it all anytime now. Right ... eventually it happens to ever MLB player.

[redsoxfan3]

Brentz is near being MLB ready. It will be interesting to see how he does in Florida this coming Spring. Sox have enough outfielders why go after someone as old as Beltran who could lose it all anytime now. Right ... eventually it happens to ever MLB player.

 

I didn't forget about Brentz, but I didn't really think about him factoring into the majors next year. You are right, a lot of it will have to do with how he does in Spring Training. He has a lot of power. His plate discipline is not that good. He chases a lot of breaking balls out of the zone. He strikes out a lot too. If he improves his plate discipline, it would be interesting to see what his chances are in Spring Training. He has a good arm too.

 

If we do not sign another OF and our OF is as it stands, Bradley could take over CF and Victorino will be in RF, but it would also be interesting to consider shifting Victorino to CF and having Brentz in RF. I would say that is a long shot, but he might get some reps in the majors if we do not sign anyone else. He needs to have a great Spring and try to work on his plate discipline. I imagine he doesn't break camp on the big league roster, but if we have an injury to Victorino, then I could see him in the majors. If anything, he is probably going to get called up in September. A lot of things can happen between now and then.

[marklmw]

I didn't forget about Brentz, but I didn't really think about him factoring into the majors next year. You are right, a lot of it will have to do with how he does in Spring Training. He has a lot of power. His plate discipline is not that good. He chases a lot of breaking balls out of the zone. He strikes out a lot too. If he improves his plate discipline, it would be interesting to see what his chances are in Spring Training. He has a good arm too.

 

If we do not sign another OF and our OF is as it stands, Bradley could take over CF and Victorino will be in RF, but it would also be interesting to consider shifting Victorino to CF and having Brentz in RF. I would say that is a long shot, but he might get some reps in the majors if we do not sign anyone else. He needs to have a great Spring and try to work on his plate discipline. I imagine he doesn't break camp on the big league roster, but if we have an injury to Victorino, then I could see him in the majors. If anything, he is probably going to get called up in September. A lot of things can happen between now and then.

 

Depth Chart as it stands now:

Left Field - 1. Gomes- LHP / Nava- PHP, 3. Carp

Center - 1. JBJ 2. Victorino 3. Berry

Right Field 1. Victorino, 2. Nava 3. Brentz

 

I think that we can get by with this. Beltran does not add anything at this stage of his career defensively. Love his bat but we do not need him in the field or on the base-path.

[Dojji]

Brentz is near being MLB ready.

 

Uhhhhh....

 

How about we wait until we see whether brentz can actually learn to handle AAA before we start talking about the big leagues.

[RedSoxNC84]

Depth Chart as it stands now:

Left Field - 1. Gomes- LHP / Nava- PHP, 3. Carp

Center - 1. JBJ 2. Victorino 3. Berry

Right Field 1. Victorino, 2. Nava 3. Brentz

 

I think that we can get by with this. Beltran does not add anything at this stage of his career defensively. Love his bat but we do not need him in the field or on the base-path.

 

Wouldn't it be a better idea to put Vic in center? After all he is going to be the superior defender to any of those guys, but his CF uzr is nothing compared to his RF uzr.

 

What about Kalish? Whatever happened to that guy?

 

I still think if they can land Beltran at 1/2 years for a decent salary, it would be a smart play. His bat would make up for his defense. He could play center, his uzr in center is not that terrible career-wise.

[redsoxfan3]

Wouldn't it be a better idea to put Vic in center? After all he is going to be the superior defender to any of those guys, but his CF uzr is nothing compared to his RF uzr.

 

What about Kalish? Whatever happened to that guy?

 

I still think if they can land Beltran at 1/2 years for a decent salary, it would be a smart play. His bat would make up for his defense. He could play center, his uzr in center is not that terrible career-wise.

 

He gets injured, he has surgery, he gets injured, he has surgery. It is a never ending process. Kalish has had no luck going for him and it has gotten to the point where he contemplated retirement. I think he just recently had surgery, but I honestly have no idea about any time table for him.

[SoxSport]

Beltran sounds like an idea floated by the media with nothing else to talk about.

 

The Cardinals have lucked out incredibly on this guy. How much longer can he last in the OF? Don't push your luck on him. He's 4 years older than Vic--and wants more Boras money. Pass, please.

 

If you want to break the bank after you've signed Nap, Ben, break it on a catcher like McCann. Though Ruiz would do just fine.

[iortiz]

Yup, our offseason has two names. McCann and Napoli.

[jung]

McCann is going to command huge money...don't see Red Hose in his future. Napoli however is coming back I think....I hope!!!

[Dojji]

Do not want McCann. I don't think it would be a disaster if we did sign him but I'm not seeing the need to go for a big contract at catcher.

 

I think the franchise is committed to making Napoli happy as long as Napoli's demands aren't completely unreasonable.

[Station 13]

Cory Hart should be an ok guy to sign if Napoli goes elsewhere.

[win red sox]

Corey Hart 1/12 plus what is essentially is a late first round draft pick in what is expected to be a deep draft or Napoli 3/40 and his ridiculous k rate. If Hart's knee checks out and you can get him on a 1 yr deal this appears to be a no brainer.

[sk7326]

Corey Hart 1/12 plus what is essentially is a late first round draft pick in what is expected to be a deep draft or Napoli 3/40 and his ridiculous k rate. If Hart's knee checks out and you can get him on a 1 yr deal this appears to be a no brainer.

 

Corey Hart who has not had a major league at bat since 2012 and a sandwich pick. Napoli at 3/40 gives me pause but I can't imagine the Red Sox won't get some sort of basic protection - whether it be a Lackey clause (the contract goes down hard if Napoli has a serious hip injury) or a simple vesting option. His strikeout rate doesn't matter a drop.

[SoxSport]

Depth Chart as it stands now:

Left Field - 1. Gomes- LHP / Nava- PHP, 3. Carp

Center - 1. JBJ 2. Victorino 3. Berry

Right Field 1. Victorino, 2. Nava 3. Brentz

 

I think that we can get by with this. Beltran does not add anything at this stage of his career defensively. Love his bat but we do not need him in the field or on the base-path.

 

agreed.

 

Priority should be in the infield--at catcher and 1B. Nap has to be re-signed. He's part of the team's new identity. catcher--somebody defensive to go with Ross. In wonder if Salty could be an even better hitter platooning at 1B?Mauer says 1b will improve his hitting. Don't see Salty as a prime-time catcher.

[Dojji]

I don't think we need to go overboard on catching defense. You want balance at the catcher position and there's nothing wrong with an offensive guy as long as he knows how to compensate for his worst weaknesses.

[marklmw]

Wouldn't it be a better idea to put Vic in center? After all he is going to be the superior defender to any of those guys, but his CF uzr is nothing compared to his RF uzr.

 

What about Kalish? Whatever happened to that guy?

 

I still think if they can land Beltran at 1/2 years for a decent salary, it would be a smart play. His bat would make up for his defense. He could play center, his uzr in center is not that terrible career-wise.

 

Is it not better to have the younger legs in center ... don't you think?

[jung]

Buster Olney claiming that the Sox have made an offer to Salty but it sounds like the kind of offer I was describing earlier...very team team friendly....sounds like the kind of deal that Salty might take but only if there is nothing better out there for him.

 

Olney also claimed to have talked to as many as twelve GM's that thought Drew should have taken the QO. Who knows though...maybe just the right 12. That does sound like a pretty high number although it does only take one GM to make a deal and two to make a market.

 

Sox also apparently chasing Ruiz pretty hard according to Olney. However he also said that there are reports that some team (not the Sox) offered Ruiz 2/20.

[seabeachfred]

Buster Olney claiming that the Sox have made an offer to Salty but it sounds like the kind of offer I was describing earlier...very team team friendly....sounds like the kind of deal that Salty might take but only if there is nothing better out there for him.

 

Olney also claimed to have talked to as many as twelve GM's that thought Drew should have taken the QO. Who knows though...maybe just the right 12. That does sound like a pretty high number although it does only take one GM to make a deal and two to make a market.

 

Sox also apparently chasing Ruiz pretty hard according to Olney. However he also said that there are reports that some team (not the Sox) offered Ruiz 2/20

 

QUOTE]

 

Just follow the money because IT'S ALWAYS ABOUT THE f***ING MONEY!!!!!!!!

[jung]

Bradford reporting this evening that the Sox have offered Naps a one year deal at slightly more than the QO money. As much as I have been convinced of the Sox direction and approach to FA's, this one even surprises me a bit. I would have expected that there would be three year deals out there for Naps pushing the Sox to at least two years. I guess not...not yet anyway. At any rate, it should be clear that the Sox will be dragged to year's of term kicking and screaming.

[jacksonianmarch]

Guys, landing 3 supplemental picks allows the sox to spend on whomever they want. Think about it. They're going to have the #30 pick in the draft if they sign no QO guys. If they lose Ellsbury, they'll have the #32 pick as well. If they lose Napoli and Drew, they'll get two more in the 30-40 range. It makes too much sense for them to let Napoli, Ellsbury, and Drew walk, collect the picks and sign a bunch of protected players. They already have 3 picks replacing the ones they would otherwise lose

[marklmw]

Guys, landing 3 supplemental picks allows the sox to spend on whomever they want. Think about it. They're going to have the #30 pick in the draft if they sign no QO guys. If they lose Ellsbury, they'll have the #32 pick as well. If they lose Napoli and Drew, they'll get two more in the 30-40 range. It makes too much sense for them to let Napoli, Ellsbury, and Drew walk, collect the picks and sign a bunch of protected players. They already have 3 picks replacing the ones they would otherwise lose

No doubt that they will be restocking their farm big time. They can use some of their savings on signing bonuses.

[SoxSport]

The Sox are in a pretty good position with Naps. They know his hip condition better than anybody, and have the advantage in dealing with him. He'd be foolish not to prefer to come back to Boston, and he has indicated as such. But he has to play the market, because it could have some bearing on what he can get out of the Red Sox.

[seabeachfred]

The Sox are in a pretty good position with Naps. They know his hip condition better than anybody, and have the advantage in dealing with him. He'd be foolish not to prefer to come back to Boston, and he has indicated as such. But he has to play the market, because it could have some bearing on what he can get out of the Red Sox.

 

I'm sorry SoxSport but that's ********, pure ******** and nothing but ********. Low balling Napoli will do nothing but get the guy angry. He has already proved his hip is fine; he had a solid year for us and developed into a very good defensive first baseman. The idea of replacing at first with a mediocre power guy in Nava is ridiculous and I don't like to think we may get stuck with a inferior player like Loney or Morneau or Kendrys what's his name because the front office was trying to be clever by half. As for being foolish not to come back to Boston, that may be true but you have to understand it IS about the money, and just because he wants to stay in Boston does not give the Red Sox the right to take advantage of him. We have replaced good players with inferior players repeatedly in the past......Vaughn with Offerman, Damon with Crisp, Bay with Cameron. We have to stop this kind of s***.

 

Right now we have nothing to bitch about. Our team won it all and we are all basking in their glory but it only takes a couple of personnel mistakes in roster composition to sidetrack a team. I have a friend out here, unfortunately for him a Dodger fan, who still moans about how they let sparkplug Steve Sax walk after their title 1988 season, replaced him with an over-the-hill Willie Randolph, and never won another title. That's a long time to complain about something and we don't ever want to see our team in that kind of state. Cherington has to stay smart and get those players who know how to win, and, especially, how to play in the charged Boston atmosphere.

[jung]

There is the possibility that along with some of the other decisions they have made about how they are going to deal with this year's batch of FA's, the Sox may have decided that they are not going to make the market for any FA. By offering Naps a 1 year deal, they have not moved the needle on Naps one bit. Some other team is gong to have to do that. If he ends up with a legit offer at two years, I am pretty sure the Sox would meet that. The Sox might balk at three years but might at the same time offer two years at a larger per annum plus an option...maybe even vesting.

 

The Sox may have even signaled Naps agent such that there is a mutual understanding that the Sox do have interest in signing him and that they should keep the lines of communication open during the process. I think Naps wants to stay and I think the Sox want him. Looks to me that they are just not going to be market drivers for any FA whether they want the player or not.

[sk7326]

With Napoli, the key will be entirely in the structure of the offer. If a team offers 3 guaranteed years at his implied value ... something like $40-50 million, that will be very hard to justify matching. Even if he did not have a hip condition, buying a guys 33-35 years (especially with a body which is not a great candidate to age well) is generally poor business.

 

But I suspect all of the bidders for Napoli will want some sort of buyer protection. Whether or not the injury is a problem for him - it IS a thing which is part of his valuation. The question is whether the Sox and Napoli can come to some consensus on a deal which hits all the marks there sufficiently so he doesn't have to shop it around.

[redsoxrules]

I wouldn't give Naps 40-50 MIL. I also wouldn't give more than a two year deal.

2/24 sounds about right.

[sk7326]

I wouldn't give Naps 40-50 MIL. I also wouldn't give more than a two year deal.

2/24 sounds about right.

 

Just looking at what he did last year relative to what that production is worth to the Sox, 3/40-50 is a fair price for him to ask. But yeah going deep into his 30s without some assurances is a bad idea.

[marklmw]

Just looking at what he did last year relative to what that production is worth to the Sox, 3/40-50 is a fair price for him to ask. But yeah going deep into his 30s without some assurances is a bad idea.

 

3/40 yes but only guarantee 7M per.

[SoxSport]

I'm sorry SoxSport but that's ********, pure ******** and nothing but ********. Low balling Napoli will do nothing but get the guy angry. He has already proved his hip is fine; he had a solid year for us and developed into a very good defensive first baseman. The idea of replacing at first with a mediocre power guy in Nava is ridiculous and I don't like to think we may get stuck with a inferior player like Loney or Morneau or Kendrys what's his name because the front office was trying to be clever by half. As for being foolish not to come back to Boston, that may be true but you have to understand it IS about the money, and just because he wants to stay in Boston does not give the Red Sox the right to take advantage of him. We have replaced good players with inferior players repeatedly in the past......Vaughn with Offerman, Damon with Crisp, Bay with Cameron. We have to stop this kind of s***.

 

Right now we have nothing to bitch about. Our team won it all and we are all basking in their glory but it only takes a couple of personnel mistakes in roster composition to sidetrack a team. I have a friend out here, unfortunately for him a Dodger fan, who still moans about how they let sparkplug Steve Sax walk after their title 1988 season, replaced him with an over-the-hill Willie Randolph, and never won another title. That's a long time to complain about something and we don't ever want to see our team in that kind of state. Cherington has to stay smart and get those players who know how to win, and, especially, how to play in the charged Boston atmosphere.

 

I think you're seeing some initial posturing here. You know that Cherington is a cautious kind of a guy. You can tell that by just listening to him for 5 minutes. LOL. He's also a guy who is probably a good listener, and takes a lot of input from the manager, coaches and the rest of the FO.

 

The important thing is to understand your chemistry--which players are important to keep. I think Nap is one of them. They will probably work something out if he really wants to stay. But teams are known to make ridiculous offers to pry away players from competing teams. Happens all the time. Then you have to let them go. I recall the Rangers got Beltre that way. But he turned out to be worth it. Usually it isn't.