Why not keep Ellsbury and Bradley together for years to come?

[Lord Snow]

The Sox are in an excellent position with Ellsbury.

 

So far Ells is off to a strong, start, if he continues and has a good season I think he gets a good contract.

 

If he misses loads of time the Sox make him a 1-year offer for cheap money.

 

If he plays out the whole year and is below average (.270/.310/.400) he gets an offer that reflects that performance.

 

The power in 2011 was for real, I have no doubt about that. He just needs to rediscover that stroke he had in the second half.

 

I'll predict Ellsbury at .300/.370/.480/.850 with 20-25 HR, 30+ SB, 80+ RBI and gold glove defense. If he does that I'll be okay with $20 million/year for 5-7 years.

[Lord Snow]

The Angels and Dodgers might have their days of repentance in a few years when some of those monster contracts are being paid for guys on the slide.

 

I think the Dodgers are already feeling it with Zack Greinke. The guy hasn't even thrown a pitch for them in a game that counts and he is already having elbow issues. That contract has the potential to turn out worse than Lackey's!

 

That team just looks bloated.

 

No contract given to a player like Pujols will ever be worthwhile, the Yankees are seeing that first hand with A-Rod, the Angels should have taken notes. Pujols is too old and on the decline and now LAA owns him for what, NINE more years? Pujols would have made more sense on a Josh Hamilton-like contract a bloated AAV in exchange for shorter term.

[jung]

Ellsbury's power is dependent on perfect health. The only times he has exhibited home run capability is when he is in perfect health and can employ his optimum swing. He must hit the ball perfectly to get it out unlike true power hitters that can simply muscle the ball out of the park. When they hit is perfect, it lands in another zip code.

 

Unfortunately, Ells is rarely in perfect health.

[BSN07]

There's a chance Ells stays, he will have to be like Cano and walk from Boras probably and be willing to take something between Bourne's deal and BJ Uptons.

[jung]

Must be feeling kind of lonely over at Boras headquarters these days. Although the word is that Ellls is committed to Boras and that he enjoys a solid relationship with his agent....as in....they are on the same page.

[SoxSport]

Must be feeling kind of lonely over at Boras headquarters these days. Although the word is that Ellls is committed to Boras and that he enjoys a solid relationship with his agent....as in....they are on the same page.

 

 

...as long as Ells wants to test the open market. Cano just dumped Boras--which the media interprets as a sign he will stay in NY.

[mvp 78]

...as long as Ells wants to test the open market. Cano just dumped Boras--which the media interprets as a sign he will stay in NY.

 

He dumped Boras for JayZ. It's more a sign that he's an idiot rather than a sign he wants to stay in the Bronx.

[jung]

I wonder if Aroid has such a hair across his ass for Boras that he is campaigning players to leave him for anybody or if he is campaigning players to leave Boras for some particular other agency.

 

Whatever, it does appear that Boras has overplayed his hand in several cases this past off season and has a reputation for adamantly thinking he knows what is best for his players. It is probably not coincidental that what he thinks is best for them also holds out the potential for the highest financial gain, with some risks involved. At any rate Boras has surely gotten some clients pissed off at him and has some others that are stuck in limbo whether pissed off or not.

 

Result, those are some big name clients that have left the good ship Boras. However, Ells is not one of them and he does not appear to be so disposed to leave.

 

JayZ is based in Jersey as I recall and he is pretty much attached to the NY area. I think it is pretty clear that Cano wants to stay. That said, Pedro says the worst thing he ever did in baseball was to tip his hand and let the Sox know he really wanted to stay in Boston. The result was that Boston low balled him by too much and Pedro left. Neither side probably wanted that but that is what happened.

[SoxSport]

The Red Sox guessed right on Pedro. They offered him 2 years plus a 3rd option year (or maybe the 3rd year at the end) . The Mets had to offer him 4 years to get him--which was very risky at that time. The Red Sox turned out to be right, and the Mets made another bad FA signing. Pedro gave them 2 decent years.

 

I don't remember the situation as Pedro describes it. He went for the maximum $$ deal--didn't have to leave.

[jung]

Well Pedro appears to be saying that the Sox did not have to match the Mets deal but had to get close enough "in his mind". These guys all think they are worth the universe. So while he may have been looking for something from the Sox that was between where they were and where the Mets were., it still might have been more than the Sox felt they could spend.

 

In light of how Pedro pitched, three years at a higher per annum might have gotten it done and might have satisfied both sides. Hard to tell. I am just reporting what Pedro says. None of us know where and when the offers were made and how they ultimately got where they got.

[Dojji]

Pedro Martinez needed to go to the National League when he did.

 

Lowballing him was one of Theo's moves that he got right. Pedro would not have been his old self for us. His last year of vintage Pedro was 2003 and the writing, as they say, was clearly on the wall for a smallish pitcher who'd started to decline.

 

The move to let Pedro move on only looked bad in 05 and we weren't going anywhere in 05 anyway.

[Laser Show]

He dumped Boras for JayZ. It's more a sign that he's an idiot rather than a sign he wants to stay in the Bronx.

 

Jay-Z is not his agent. Jay-Z is forming a partnership with Creative Artists Agency (CAA), which is already one of the biggest and most famous agencies around.

 

They represent Ryan Braun, Derek Jeter, Jason Bay, Andre Ethier, Matt Garza, Adam Jones, Carlos Quentin, Ryan Howard, Buster Posey, Roy Halladay, Ryan Zimmerman, amongst many other big names, and that's just baseball.

 

In sports, they also represent other big names like Dwyane Wade, Carmelo Anthony, Cristiano Ronaldo, Sidney Crosby, Tony Romo, Shaun White.

 

Then, in film, they represent Jennifer Aniston, James Cameron, Drew Barrymore, George Clooney, Tom Cruise, Robert Downey, Cameron Diaz, Will Ferrell, Jamie Foxx, Tom Hanks, Scarlett Johansson, Anne Hathaway, Natalie Portman, Arnold Schwarzenegger, Will Smith, Steven Spielberg, and Bruce Willis.

 

And in music, AC/DC, Christina Aguilera, Chris Brown, Mariah Carey, Kelly Clarkson, Green Day, John Legend, Ludacris, John Mayer, Shakira, Bruce Springsteen, Justin Timberlake, Sting, and Kanye West

 

 

It can be argued that this was actually a very smart move on his part.

[jung]

Well in fact Cano signed with JayZ who is partnered with CAA. Cano could have just signed with CAA if he wanted to do that. His agreement is with JayZ and JayZ's agreement is with CAA.

[Laser Show]

Well in fact Cano signed with JayZ who is partnered with CAA. Cano could have just signed with CAA if he wanted to do that. His agreement is with JayZ and JayZ's agreement is with CAA.

 

Cano will be represented by Brodie Van Wagenen, one of CAA's agents.

[BSN07]

Robinson Cano found an agent who is perhaps more powerful than Scott Boras, dropping Boras for Jay-Z this week. While it was previously suggested CAA Baseball's Brodie Van Wagenen would handle all of the contract negotiations, Jay-Z will be "intimately involved," Van Wagenen tells Jon Heyman of CBS Sports. Heyman feels that Cano, next offseason's top free agent, has "at least tipped his hand that he wants to stay in the Bronx."

 

"You have examples like CarGo, Weaver, Andrus, Varitek — there’s a ton of examples of guys that have signed before [free agency]," explained Red Sox center fielder Jacoby Ellsbury to WEEI's Alex Speier in the wake of Elvis Andrus' new contract. "[Agent Scott Boras] gives you advice, but it’s up to you to make your own decision." Ellsbury may be the top available free agent position player in free agency, if Robinson Cano signs before then.

[seabeachfred]

I think the Dodgers are already feeling it with Zack Greinke. The guy hasn't even thrown a pitch for them in a game that counts and he is already having elbow issues. That contract has the potential to turn out worse than Lackey's!

 

That team just looks bloated.

 

No contract given to a player like Pujols will ever be worthwhile, the Yankees are seeing that first hand with A-Rod, the Angels should have taken notes. Pujols is too old and on the decline and now LAA owns him for what, NINE more years? Pujols would have made more sense on a Josh Hamilton-like contract a bloated AAV in exchange for shorter term.

 

Lord Snow, since the Angels and Dodgers play out where I live I think I can add some tidbits to this conversation. For the Angels, they are totally desperate to get back to the World Series. To them 2002 seems like light years away, and it was AFTER that season that Arte Moreno, known out here in the press as Angry Arte, bought the team. They have won many AL West Division titles but always seem to be short circuited in the ALDS or ALCS and Moreno wants into the Fall Classic. They seem weak in the backend of their rotation and their bullpen might be suspect. They have a lot of money tied up in two stars---Hamilton and Pujols and maybe they can bat their way to the Series. At least they give the impression that they might have what it takes even though they had a very miserable Spring Training Record.

 

The Dodgers seem to be a team with a bunch of parts that just don't fit. They looked dead again last night against the Giants, both in the stands and on the field. Beckett was bombed for two big homers and their hitters were something like 1 for 14 with runners in scoring position. Kemp and Gonzales have one hit between them in three games and it seems to be that Adrian doesn't like to play in front of big crowd out here any more than he did in Boston. Both teams are trying to buy their way into the World Series and I can only hope that both fall on their collective faces.

[Laser Show]

 

CAA’s Brodie Van Wagenen will handle Cano’s next contract and Jay-Z could help direct his off-field endeavors, though Cano would not elaborate on those goals.

[jung]

CAA’s Brodie Van Wagenen will handle Cano’s next contract and Jay-Z could help direct his off-field endeavors, though Cano would not elaborate on those goals.

 

Correct but from what I saw I think JayZ and CAA representatives are going to get paid out of the same pools of money as opposed to lets say JayZ getting paid separately for directing "off-field endeavors". In that sense, JayZ ends up getting a piece of Cano's baseball contract action and CAA gets a piece of Cano's off-field endeavors action. That has got to mean endorsements and the like which is thought to be JayZ's strong suit.

 

I should also mention that CAA's reputation is to be 180 degrees opposed to Boras. Their major clients tend to sign extensions and stay put as opposed to becoming FA's.

[BSN07]

Correct but from what I saw I think JayZ and CAA representatives are going to get paid out of the same pools of money as opposed to lets say JayZ getting paid separately for directing "off-field endeavors". In that sense, JayZ ends up getting a piece of Cano's baseball contract action and CAA gets a piece of Cano's off-field endeavors action. That has got to mean endorsements and the like which is thought to be JayZ's strong suit.

 

I should also mention that CAA's reputation is to be 180 degrees opposed to Boras. Their major clients tend to sign extensions and stay put as opposed to becoming FA's.

 

Ya that list of players and actors they represent was pretty heavy on big name stars with big contracts, pretty impressive.

[Youk Of The Nation]

off-field endeavors, though Cano would not elaborate on those goals.

 

Maybe he's going to sign onto films as Angelina Jolie's stunt lips?

[BSN07]

Over under on the release date of Cano's first Dominican flavored rap album?

[redsoxbeatz]

So the general consensus is that Ells & JBJ cant be on the Red Sox together. Why can't we have two CF? 1 play LF/RF and the other CF. Whats the big deal?

[Dojji]

Well we already have 2, Ells and Vic, so I suppose we could just suffer through having an outfield of 3 centerfielders.

[SoxSport]

So the general consensus is that Ells & JBJ cant be on the Red Sox together. Why can't we have to CF? 1 play LF/RF and the other CF. Whats the big deal?

 

Don't think that's the general consensus. Vic was supposed to make Ells tradeable. Bradley was down the road after that. I suspect the picture has changed.

[mvp 78]

So the general consensus is that Ells & JBJ cant be on the Red Sox together. Why can't we have to CF? 1 play LF/RF and the other CF. Whats the big deal?

 

I think the consensus was Ells would ask for too much $ and be gone. I think they could coexist just fine.

[BSN07]

Ya they can coexist together, no issues there. Def more of the Boras factor leading at least for me to think they wouldn't be together after this season.

 

I actually love the OF defense right now. One thing I noticed in the Yankee series is how often there was 2 OF waiting under a fly out. Teams are really going to have a hard time getting anything to drop in with this OF. I bet if JBJ wanted to he could run to RF on a flyball and join the other guys waiting for the ball

[jung]

I think that is it more than anything. Boras will take Ells to FA and presuming a decent healthy year this year, the Sox won't want to match the price. They have their next star CF sitting right in front of them. Unless they are complete idiots, he will be cost controlled till 2019. Don't need his skills in LF. They are nice to haves not got to haves and there is no way the Sox will not take advantage of having such a good, cost controlled CF.

[Dojji]

I can't agree with that Jung. Value comes from all factors of a player's ability. Bradley's defensive abilities aren't wasted in left as long as he hits adequately. That's a fallacy based on the premise that because defense is LESS useful in left, it is therefore useless. you have a good mind, you ought to see why that doesn't follow.

[redsoxbeatz]

I hope Red Sox can retain Ellsbury. I also hope Ellsbury can turn on the 2011 heat again.

[jung]

I can't agree with that Jung. Value comes from all factors of a player's ability. Bradley's defensive abilities aren't wasted in left as long as he hits adequately. That's a fallacy based on the premise that because defense is LESS useful in left, it is therefore useless. you have a good mind, you ought to see why that doesn't follow.

__________________

 

But you are defining the issues in absolute terms which don't matter in this particular case. The Sox will NOT keep Bradley, a super CF cost controlled to boot in LF and PAY for the privilege by virtue of keeping and paying for Ells in CF. If Ells goes to FA under circumstances favorable to him, the Sox will not pay for that privilege and they would be complete dolts if they did. Bradley has much more value to the Sox in CF and they will take full advantage of that value ala' his cost controlled situation and they will let somebody else play the less athletically inclined LF and let somebody else pay Ells to play their CF.

 

By the way, the situation is somewhat exacerbated by the fact that at the end of the day, JBJ is going to turn out to be superior to Ells as a CF. So how idiotic would it be to keep your more skilled CF in LF just because your fans have wet dreams about JBJ and Ells in outfield together long term.