Let's talk about Josh Hamilton

[Divinity]

so he doesn't touch the stuff in years, but he's still battling heroin addiction. Hahaha

 

There is no absolute cure for addiction Emmz. Addiction disorders tend to be chronic life-long struggles. Besides that earlier this year he also suffered another slip with his alcoholism.

[Behindenemylines]

The questions about Crawfords contract by the media and fans started after seven ABs when he was moved out of the second slot in the lineup. He tried to prove he was worth the contract the whole year, and struggled the whole year and heard some boos. Based on Hamilton's past I could see similar things happening. He has had periods where he has struggled and if he is making big $$$$$ long term he is going to hear the fans and the media.

[Brennan]

There is no absolute cure for addiction Emmz. Addiction disorders tend to be chronic life-long struggles. Besides that earlier this year he also suffered another slip with his alcoholism.

 

 

 

Yeah, what was I thinking questioning his integrity as far as possible drug use?

[SouthieFanatic]

I would say people make too big a deal out of that alcohol slip up, but then again i've never been addicted to Heroin. I mean I feel like one beer can't hurt the guy, but again what do I know. Either way I think we should stay away from him for the pure and simple fact that he's gonna want a mega contract and I wouldn't go near one those for awhile if I was BC

[RedSoxNC84]

Even if the Sox passed on Hamilton, I highly doubt he would even be available.. I think he stays in Texas.

[Dojji]

so he doesn't touch the stuff in years, but he's still battling heroin addiction. Hahaha

The fact that you think that's funny shows you don't know one little thing about substance abuse.

[Woese]

Ben Cherington wants the team to exhibit more discipline in regard to signing FA's to lucrative contracts. Signing Josh Hamilton would be the exact opposite of that - he'll be on the wrong side of 30 very soon, is very injury prone, and most importantly, he has never been under intense scrutiny like he would be in Boston.

 

 

Carl Crawford was very uncomfortable here but god bless him because he tried so damn hard. Hamilton will do the same and I fear that if he fails, he may relapse. Signing with Boston would be a terrible idea for both the Red Sox and Josh Hamilton.

[Behindenemylines]

CC was a hard worker, but he was never going to produce where people would say he is earning his money. Hamilton has a lot of baggage and is north of 30. Don't know if it is something that would be wise for the Sox to invest in. He is going to ask for big $$$$$$ at a minimum of 5 years.

[Bellhorn04]

A few things to keep in mind though:

 

The Red Sox don't have any prospective 3-4 hitters in their system.

David Ortiz will soon be gone.

Acquiring good 3-4 hitter types cheaply is not going to be that easy.

[Palodios]

A few things to keep in mind though:

 

The Red Sox don't have any prospective 3-4 hitters in their system.

David Ortiz will soon be gone.

Acquiring good 3-4 hitter types cheaply is not going to be that easy.

 

So that makes Bogaerts.... what exactly?

[Orange Juiced]

So that makes Bogaerts.... what exactly?

 

Right now, an unproven 19-year old.

 

I'm a big fan of his, but let's not crown him the next Ernie Banks just yet.

[Palodios]

Right now, an unproven 19-year old.

 

I'm a big fan of his, but let's not crown him the next Ernie Banks just yet.

 

I was responding to the assertion that there are no perspective 3-4 hitters in the system.

[circus catch]

A couple of things about Hamilton that I don't think are here:

 

- I heard on comcast NE one sunday morning that he has reamed out assistant coaches publicly three times this season. No other verification of that.

 

- He's a very un-Red Soxian first pitch hitter. He is 57th of 78 regulars in pitches per at bat, just a shade better than Mike Aviles. When you think of how often they must pitch around him . . .

 

- Next year would be his year 32 season. I think he's fine for a few seasons, but his chances of a serious injury go way up. And how will he deal emotionally with the downward trend in his career, and where does that leave him in regards to the wagon? He's already fallen off a couple of times recently.

 

Watching a 35 year-old Josh Hamilton battling injuries and popping up on the first pitch for 25 mil. Shudder. I'll pass.

[Spitball]

Hamilton has put up numbers that will entice teams to overpay for too many years. General managers know they will not be in office for the duration of these contracts...but we will still be fans for that time (see Theo Epstein and those of us here on Talksox).

 

Adrian Gonzalez, Carl Crawford, Josh Beckett, Albert Pujols, and others will drain their teams' futures when they have the natural regression of skills that comes with age. With Josh Hamilton, there is the added problem of drug addiction.

 

He is a gifted player. He is my daughter's favorite non-Red Sox player. I would not over-pay for any player with age and drugs issues.

[Dirt Schilling]

I say offer him a case off beer and he will be the cheapest buy ever.

[jung]

Except for LA which will have a bottomless pit of money. They will likely end up with a bunch of bad contracts but I am not sure you can actually financially hurt them with their new TV deal.

[example1]

Except for LA which will have a bottomless pit of money. They will likely end up with a bunch of bad contracts but I am not sure you can actually financially hurt them with their new TV deal.

 

I think what the Sox realized is that you can be so hurt on the field that it hurts you financially, even if the huge up-front cost doesn't hurt. Even with the Dodgers deep pockets I suspect they will still feel obligated to play their expensive players. There hasn't been a team yet that just sat those guys. So if Crawford or Beckett are terrible I don't think they will just sit them. That means they take up roster spots. Add an injury here, and another bad contract or two and the Dodgers will feel the exact same pressure of suckitude that the Red Sox felt. l

[RedSoxNC84]

Victorino wants to stay with the dodgers, but not as a bench player.. Looks like he's going to sit in favor of Crawford.

[rjortiz]

Victorino wants to stay with the dodgers, but not as a bench player.. Looks like he's going to sit in favor of Crawford.

 

Victorino could get $10-$12 AAV in free agency. The Dodgers won't pay that much for a 4th OF. Unless they trade Ethier, he's going somewhere else.

[jung]

The Dodgers will definitely feel the need to do something if their current roster and lineup craps out. The difference between the Sox and the Dodgers is that if it happens to the Dodgers they will just spend more money. They will not necessarily have to find an angel to bail them out of the bad contracts they have. They will just get more players and offload what they can when they can.

[redsoxbeatz]

No thanks!!

 

Home grown talent for cheap, plz.

 

I don't mind the FO spending money on pitchers when their available but even then... Use your draft picks, develop them, use them.

 

2013 & 2014 will be re-building. Maybe some pitchers emerge for 2015-2016.

 

BB needs to a baseball-clone to run this team.

[TutGadol]

Not cool mentioning the alcoholism. I don't see how it can be a problem, especially when he can't go to a bar without any single guy there sticking his head up his ass.

 

To the matter, I don't see how he signs here. I just don't. He'll probably stay in Texas where he belongs.

[Spitball]

Not cool mentioning the alcoholism. I don't see how it can be a problem, especially when he can't go to a bar without any single guy there sticking his head up his ass.

 

Hamilton has had some slips with the alcohol. I won't post the stories or pictures, but they are out there and easy enought to find. He has a problem and it has to be a worry. Johnny Narron used to be his "baby sitter" on the road but left to take a job with the Brewers. Currently, I believe his father-in-law serves in the that role.

 

Substances abuse is a lifelong battle.

[Orange Juiced]

Not to get the thread too off track, but another option I think the Sox should consider is BJ Upton. We all know how he killed the Sox in 2008, but more recently, he's put up these numbers:

 

2010: .237/.322/.424/.745, 106 ops+, 18 hr, 62 rbi, 42 sb

2011: .243/.331/.429/.759, 115 ops+, 23 hr, 81 rbi, 36 sb

2012: .250/.302/.422/.724, 103 ops+, 17 hr, 61 rbi, 27 sb

 

He's 27 now so he's just entering his prime. He's averaged, according to fangraphs, 3.5 WAR the past 3 seasons (and it'll probably be a little higher since there's still some of this season left for him to add to that). At about $5.3 million per WAR, that makes him "worth" about $19 million a year. He's a free agent after this season, but I bet a lot of teams will be scared off by his low obp. He's essentially a slightly slower, but more powerful, version of Carl Crawford. But he's right-handed, and he's better suited for Fenway than Crawford was. Moreover, he won't command *nearly* the kind of money Crawford ended up getting, despite him being "worth" about $19 million a season.

 

Look at his spray chart here (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/player/b.j.-upton/hitchart/200917?q=b.j.-upton). That would look very nice in Fenway. I would think he'd be a 25 homer, 80 rbi, 30 sb kind of player in Boston, and I think they could get him for probably something in the $13-15 million a year range. For a guy who will be just 28 next year, we're talking about a prime player.

 

I know the last OF free agent the Sox picked up from Tampa didn't work out so well, but Upton (a) is younger, ( is more of a power hitter, © his swing is more suited for Fenway than Crawford's ever was, and (d) he'd come significantly cheaper than Crawford did.

 

I don't love the obp, but he does a lot of terrific things that the Sox could use. Plug that guy into the LF position, and in the #5 or #6 spot in the lineup, and watch what he can do. Is he worth a look-see?

[Spitball]

Not to get the thread too off track, but another option I think the Sox should consider is BJ Upton. We all know how he killed the Sox in 2008, but more recently, he's put up these numbers:

 

2010: .237/.322/.424/.745, 106 ops+, 18 hr, 62 rbi, 42 sb

2011: .243/.331/.429/.759, 115 ops+, 23 hr, 81 rbi, 36 sb

2012: .250/.302/.422/.724, 103 ops+, 17 hr, 61 rbi, 27 sb

 

He's 27 now so he's just entering his prime. He's averaged, according to fangraphs, 3.5 WAR the past 3 seasons (and it'll probably be a little higher since there's still some of this season left for him to add to that). At about $5.3 million per WAR, that makes him "worth" about $19 million a year. He's a free agent after this season, but I bet a lot of teams will be scared off by his low obp. He's essentially a slightly slower, but more powerful, version of Carl Crawford. But he's right-handed, and he's better suited for Fenway than Crawford was. Moreover, he won't command *nearly* the kind of money Crawford ended up getting, despite him being "worth" about $19 million a season.

 

Look at his spray chart here (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/player/b.j.-upton/hitchart/200917?q=b.j.-upton). That would look very nice in Fenway. I would think he'd be a 25 homer, 80 rbi, 30 sb kind of player in Boston, and I think they could get him for probably something in the $13-15 million a year range. For a guy who will be just 28 next year, we're talking about a prime player.

 

I know the last OF free agent the Sox picked up from Tampa didn't work out so well, but Upton (a) is younger, ( is more of a power hitter, © his swing is more suited for Fenway than Crawford's ever was, and (d) he'd come significantly cheaper than Crawford did.

 

I don't love the obp, but he does a lot of terrific things that the Sox could use. Plug that guy into the LF position, and in the #5 or #6 spot in the lineup, and watch what he can do. Is he worth a look-see?

 

Well researched post, OJ. I can't get too excited about either Upton, but this one's numbers are not real exciting for an outfielder. He may emerge in a different environment, but I think he is about to get too expensive for an outfielder OPSing just north of .720.

[Orange Juiced]

He might be. He has loads of talent and just hasn't quite put it all together yet. I do wonder what he'll command for a salary.

[Dojji]

No. No more so called "5 tool" guys who don't have the fundamental patience and skill to control the at bat.

 

This is a patient, station to station team that draws walks and works the pitcher. Our assets are based on the power of our lineup and the strength of our starting rotation. That's the identity, and affirming and strengthening that identity needs to be the focus. We just saw what happens when a team tries to do everything at once. Don't repeat the mistake.

 

Stick to your strengths and build on those things. If you can do that and also bring other elements, so much the better, but don't -- DO NOT -- allow your core strengths to slip because you're casting too wide a net. Going after Upton would be doing exactly that.

[RedSoxNC84]

Is it bad I sort of miss the 'waiting for the three run homer' days? At least the Sox were able to outscore teams then.

[TutGadol]

Not to get the thread too off track, but another option I think the Sox should consider is BJ Upton. We all know how he killed the Sox in 2008, but more recently, he's put up these numbers:

 

2010: .237/.322/.424/.745, 106 ops+, 18 hr, 62 rbi, 42 sb

2011: .243/.331/.429/.759, 115 ops+, 23 hr, 81 rbi, 36 sb

2012: .250/.302/.422/.724, 103 ops+, 17 hr, 61 rbi, 27 sb

 

He's 27 now so he's just entering his prime. He's averaged, according to fangraphs, 3.5 WAR the past 3 seasons (and it'll probably be a little higher since there's still some of this season left for him to add to that). At about $5.3 million per WAR, that makes him "worth" about $19 million a year. He's a free agent after this season, but I bet a lot of teams will be scared off by his low obp. He's essentially a slightly slower, but more powerful, version of Carl Crawford. But he's right-handed, and he's better suited for Fenway than Crawford was. Moreover, he won't command *nearly* the kind of money Crawford ended up getting, despite him being "worth" about $19 million a season.

 

Look at his spray chart here (http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/player/b.j.-upton/hitchart/200917?q=b.j.-upton). That would look very nice in Fenway. I would think he'd be a 25 homer, 80 rbi, 30 sb kind of player in Boston, and I think they could get him for probably something in the $13-15 million a year range. For a guy who will be just 28 next year, we're talking about a prime player.

 

I know the last OF free agent the Sox picked up from Tampa didn't work out so well, but Upton (a) is younger, ( is more of a power hitter, © his swing is more suited for Fenway than Crawford's ever was, and (d) he'd come significantly cheaper than Crawford did.

 

I don't love the obp, but he does a lot of terrific things that the Sox could use. Plug that guy into the LF position, and in the #5 or #6 spot in the lineup, and watch what he can do. Is he worth a look-see?

 

He's brother is still a better option in my opinion, but this looks like a very good idea too. He can play center too if they decide to trade Els.

[a700hitter]

He's brother is still a better option in my opinion, but this looks like a very good idea too. He can play center too if they decide to trade Els.

BJ has too much dog in him. In Tampa, he has Longo to keep him in line. He's scared shitless of Longo. I don't think we have anyone here willing to get in his face. At the right price, I'd take him, but he ain't going to come cheap.