Source: Crawford ask Red Sox to let him have TJS

[SCM33]

Be realistic, if the season is over CC should get this taken care of to be ready for 2013. If you wait then your asking for another 2012. This guy can't get a break.

 

He should have gotten this taken care of months ago.

 

The season was over since day 1.

[SoxFanForsyth]

Any increase to his trade value from playing well would probably be negated by the fact that he will be getting the surgery in the off season.

 

Didn't negate Adrian Gonzalez's value at all when the Sox traded for him. He's not a pitcher, so arm surgery isn't really a huge deal.

 

I would be more concerned with shoulder surgery for a power hitter than I would be for TJ surgery for a position player.

[a700hitter]

Didn't negate Adrian Gonzalez's value at all when the Sox traded for him. He's not a pitcher, so arm surgery isn't really a huge deal.

 

I would be more concerned with shoulder surgery for a power hitter than I would be for TJ surgery for a position player.

Maybe it should have hurt his trade value. Gonzo has had a power outage in 2012-- could be his shoulder?

[SoxFanForsyth]

Maybe it should have hurt his trade value. Gonzo has had a power outage in 2012-- could be his shoulder?

 

I mean he hit 17 in the 1st half of 2011, which is when it would have affected him the most, and regardless, there was a huge market for him. Plus shoulder surgery for a power hitter is going to affect the market much more than elbow surgery for Crawford.

[a700hitter]

I mean he hit 17 in the 1st half of 2011, which is when it would have affected him the most, and regardless, there was a huge market for him. Plus shoulder surgery for a power hitter is going to affect the market much more than elbow surgery for Crawford.

Surgery doesn't make the guy like new. His power stroke has suffered. I think it is because he has a bum shoulder.

[example1]

First, how are fans pummeling them... by packing Fenway every game? The only guy to get booed in any significant way has been Beckett. Bobby V actually got a bit of a positive chant from the fans not that long ago. The assertion of pummeling by fans is just nonsense. The pummeling by the press has to be expected when you are fighting for last place. If they are waiting for the press to get off their backs before they can "act rationally", they will be in last place next season too. The way to get the press off their backs would be by giving them something positive to write and report. If there is nothing positive, they still have to get people to read their columns and listen to their shows.

 

The stuff about Fans and the press feeling that they have a "god given right to a contender every single season" is patent nonsense.

 

Stop blaming the press and the fans for the failure of this organization. The fans are not to blame. The only thing positive about this franchise right now is that they have one of the most loyal and passionate fan bases in sports that provides the franchise with tremendous resources to run their organization.

 

The fans also soak up the media's fervor and reinforce the way the media behaves. They go to games, but they also glob onto the media. I'm not implicating you, a700, so no need to get defensive. I'm not saying ALL fans are perpetuating it, but enough are doing it that stories like "Clay Buchholz seen at fundraiser" get a few days worth of press. It is absurd.

 

As for "the only positive thing about this franchise" being the loyal fan bases, I would also say that having an ownership who is willing to spend $170m+ is a positive thing. It is easy to take for granted, but plenty of other rich owners don't spend that much on their teams.

[iortiz]

Not everything is Cherington's call. Stop treating him like the boogeyman. He's just another cog in the FO machine.

 

You're right he is only a puppet or an incompetent.

 

Either way, I bet CC won't be ready to begin next season... again.

 

Bravo FO, bravo!.

[iortiz]

The fact that this might not be Bumbling Benny's call speaks volumes as to his being a puppet and/or incompetent. Either way, he is not the guy who should be interacting with other GMs in rebuilding this team.

 

hahaha just put the same

[a700hitter]

The fans also soak up the media's fervor and reinforce the way the media behaves. They go to games, but they also glob onto the media. I'm not implicating you, a700, so no need to get defensive. I'm not saying ALL fans are perpetuating it, but enough are doing it that stories like "Clay Buchholz seen at fundraiser" get a few days worth of press. It is absurd.

 

As for "the only positive thing about this franchise" being the loyal fan bases, I would also say that having an ownership who is willing to spend $170m+ is a positive thing. It is easy to take for granted, but plenty of other rich owners don't spend that much on their teams.

The ownership can't spend that if the fans aren't putting it in their pockets. I wasn't taking anything personally. Pinning any of the incompetence, poor decisions and inaction on the fans or press is just absurd. The organization from top to bottom owns the blame for this monstrosity of a season.

[a700hitter]

hahaha just put the same

Great minds. You and I took a lot of abuse because we thought the starting pitching would not be good enough.

[iortiz]

Great minds. You and I took a lot of abuse because we thought the starting pitching would not be good enough.

 

Yeah but we missed in something, at least speaking for myself, I didn't think we were going to be this bad.

 

I want to see how they fix this big hole next season. Going to be tough. No many options as everybody thought. No big fish (true aces) available, at least no in my radar, and Lackey ain't the answer.

[a700hitter]

Yeah but we missed in something, at least speaking for myself, I didn't think we were going to be this bad.

 

I want to see how they fix this big hole next season. Going to be tough. No many options as everybody thought. No big fish (true aces) available, at least no in my radar, and Lackey ain't the answer.

I never expected it to be this bad either.

[RedSoxNC84]

I never expected it to be this bad either.

 

Everyone said third place, not last place

[jung]

From what I heard the latest news was no longer that CC WOULD have surgery on Tuesday but that they would discuss options on Monday. It all seems so ridiculous. Will they just do anything and everything to extract every last dollar out of a season regardless of risk to the player or risk to his ability to start the next season on time and ready to roll. What rational could they have for waiting other than trying to pump up the tires on the 2012 season.

 

The level of insanity that real fans have had to endure is just beyond belief.

 

Of course, anybody that really knows something about the game and is passionate about the team is not really somebody LL wants anything to do with anymore. Give him the lady from Colorado for whom the Sox organization can do no wrong and Larry is all in. Give him somebody that wants the team to win on the field and Oh no...not Larry's kind of fan...not likely to pump up Larry's brick sales.

 

I think the spin that the Sox are trying to put on things these days is really disheartening and I hope it backfires the way it deserves. This is not the medias fault. If they don't like this stuff getting out then go to the leaks and plug them...they are leaks in their organization. I think calling the fans out for being to demanding or feeling some sense of entitlement is a red herring as well. I don't know a single real fan that would not be OK with a plan that was aimed at 2014 instead of 2013. That is not to suggest that the Sox have to tell us what the plan is. We do want to feel like they have a clue and nobody feels like they have a clue and most of us feel like they are lying through their teeth at just about every opportunity.

 

They would not have to lie if they were not trying to spin every possible issue five ways from Sunday. It has gotten so bad now that I am convinced that they no longer even know which direction to spin something any longer. They even look more idiotic these days when there are occasions when the despised media for which we are ready to believe just about anything ends up with more credibility than they have.

[jung]

Maybe it should have hurt his trade value. Gonzo has had a power outage in 2012-- could be his shoulder?

 

The way I remember it, Agons shoulder had been mending fine and I think he felt like he had recovered most if not all of his strength and then game the HR Derby of the 2011 season....the one where Dave Magadan warned AGons not to participate. The stuff that was written at that point was not that Agons re-injured the shoulder as much as he damaged the repair.

 

It is possible that AGons has done something that while not causing him long term pain has weakened the shoulder. That would not be a complete surprise and may fit with other things that we have seen. Agons went through that slump earlier this year where he was hitting few balls cleanly and his power numbers really suffered at that point. Now he is hitting the ball much better but it looks like unless he gets all of it, the ball just ain't goin' out any more. Maybe pain will come later but lack of strength is what he has been left with at this point...all conjecture on my part but just trying to make what we do know and what we can see fit.

 

Guess we will just have to wait and see but something still does not seem right there.

[mvp 78]

The problem this year was Beckett and Lester. You guys were worried about 3-5. Enough with your circlejerking...

[jung]

The entire rotation was a fail. The only difference being that Lester and Beckett were performance fails and the rest was a planning fail. Felix was not going to last the season and didn't. Bard imploded before the season was half done. Buch started the season a major question mark that panned out due to his own efforts, a matter of luck from a planning perspective and a matter of personal diligence from Buch's perspective.

 

What was the FO answer to Buch not panning out and Felix and Bard.....Morales, Cook, dice???? In fact, the whole thing was a farce....a bunch of has-beens tossed in with a bunch of never-was's and few high priced superstars that in the main weren't that super.

[Behindenemylines]

GM Cher has to step up like the guy in Washington when he said it will be his decision when to shut down the kid pitcher.Cher should have done that with CC. If he is running the ship that is the way it should have been done. Take the presure off of CC and his worry about the back lash of the fans and make the decision to get this taken care of. Can't move CC anyway with the elbow problem so why not get healthy for 2013.

[jacksonianmarch]

Crawford to have TJS on Thursday. Season over for him

[SoxFanForsyth]

Glad he's having it now. 6 to 7 months of rehab should have him back by ST or April at the latest. 7 months from Thursday would be 7 months from March 23rd.

 

If he has a quick rehab, he could be back by Opening Day. If he's 7 months of rehab, he'll miss maybe 1-2 weeks.

 

I'm not sure, though, if he could start swinging a bit sooner because really, if he's able to swing by early-to-mid March (6.5 months), the throwing will come almost instantly. It's timing that is the biggest time consuming activity.

[DocHolliday]

Still not sure why they couldn't have made this decision weeks earlier.

 

Hopefully Crawford will learn from past mistakes and not rush his rehab to get back by a certain date. Whenever he comes back, he needs to resemble the Crawford we've seen this year from the time he steps on the field, with steady improvement from there.

 

This team can survive a couple of weeks into the season without him - not a couple of months.

[Wil Corderos Wife]

Not a bad decision. The season's more or less lost, so why risk further damage in a series of throwaway games? By doing it this early, he'll have a chance to recover from the surgery and whatever inevitable setback injuries pop up in time to play a bigger chunk of season than he did this year!

[jacksonianmarch]

Glad he's having it now. 6 to 7 months of rehab should have him back by ST or April at the latest. 7 months from Thursday would be 7 months from March 23rd.

 

If he has a quick rehab, he could be back by Opening Day. If he's 7 months of rehab, he'll miss maybe 1-2 weeks.

 

I'm not sure, though, if he could start swinging a bit sooner because really, if he's able to swing by early-to-mid March (6.5 months), the throwing will come almost instantly. It's timing that is the biggest time consuming activity.

 

He'll be able to hit by spring training, I can guarantee you that much. He'll likely DH through the spring, then get clearance to play OF full time sometime in April.

[SoxFanForsyth]

He'll be able to hit by spring training, I can guarantee you that much. He'll likely DH through the spring, then get clearance to play OF full time sometime in April.

 

Well assuming a 7 month rehab stint, he'd be cleared to play by 3/23.

 

I guess I'm a bit confused. I would assume that the tail end of the rehab program would include throwing, no? So, it's not that he goes 7 months without throwing a baseball. It's that he goes about 5 or 6 months without throwing, then a gradual build up process, and is ready to play full time after 7 months?

 

If that's the case, I would expect him to be ready for Opening Day in LF.

[a700hitter]

Well assuming a 7 month rehab stint, he'd be cleared to play by 3/23.

 

I guess I'm a bit confused. I would assume that the tail end of the rehab program would include throwing, no? So, it's not that he goes 7 months without throwing a baseball. It's that he goes about 5 or 6 months without throwing, then a gradual build up process, and is ready to play full time after 7 months?

 

If that's the case, I would expect him to be ready for Opening Day in LF.

So, he needs an operation to restore his weak-ass arm?

[jacksonianmarch]

Well assuming a 7 month rehab stint, he'd be cleared to play by 3/23.

 

I guess I'm a bit confused. I would assume that the tail end of the rehab program would include throwing, no? So, it's not that he goes 7 months without throwing a baseball. It's that he goes about 5 or 6 months without throwing, then a gradual build up process, and is ready to play full time after 7 months?

 

If that's the case, I would expect him to be ready for Opening Day in LF.

 

He will have a gradual build up process. But he wont be cleared to make full strength throws from the outfield until late March or early April. It's a 6-8 month recovery time, and I would assume they will wait on his full on throws until very late in the yr. They really dont want to f*** with this

[SoxSport]

Maybe it should have hurt his trade value. Gonzo has had a power outage in 2012-- could be his shoulder?

 

He has had a power outage since the all-star game last year, though he has come back some lately.