Xander Bogaerts

[Emmz]

Xander now #1 on soxprospects.

 

Soxprospects is a joke bro.

[SemperFi Sox]

Soxprospects is a joke bro.

 

Do explain

[User Name]

Bogaerts is being rated as the Sox' number one prospect by most (if not all) reputable sources right now anyway.

[Dojji]

Well sure. The man projects as a power hitting SS right now, and those are freaking valuable.

 

Personally I do put Bradley ahead of him just because he's closer to the bigs but that's me.

[User Name]

How does that make him rate higher though?

[Dojji]

I don't value prospects the same way Baseball America does.

 

You might have notices that a few times.

 

Specifically I tend to believe that a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. I'll take a guy who can already compete at a given level over a guy who's projected to absolutely dominate it until they prove other wise.

 

Of course, I also reserve my right to change my mind. People don't seem to get that last bit though.

[User Name]

That's an interesting way to go about it.

[Dojji]

The truth is usually in the middle. There's something to be said for already-developed skill. There's also something to be said for natural athletic talent. I just think that prospect watchers are so frantic to be the first guy to call someone a big leaguer they lose their heads a bit about some of these A ball players.

 

Also I do happen to think that the barrier between Salem and Portland is significant enough that I'll take just about any talented AA player (say, Bradley) over an objectively more talented A+ guy. If we had to (we don't, but if we did) we could theoretically call Bradley up right now and hope to get SOMETHING out of him. Bogaerts would just wilt.

[jacksonianmarch]

I also think the AA barrier is pretty significant, but certain skill sets shouldnt see problems in the minors regardless. And as much as it is a fan's perspective, the only two perspectives that matter are Cherington's and any potential suitor GM's perspective. My guess is all of those people value Bogaerts over Bradley.

[SemperFi Sox]

I think Bradley is going to be a very good CF, but I view Bogaerts potential as much higher. Especially if he's able to stay at SS. He's got 30+ HR potential.

[Emmz]

Bogaerts is being rated as the Sox' number one prospect by most (if not all) reputable sources right now anyway.

 

That he is, but soxprospects is just basically some guys talking out of their asses. I don't proclaim to be a scout, but there's really nothing of value on that site.

[Dojji]

I wouldn't say "nothing." At the least they're a good source to track minor league player movement.

[example1]

That he is' date=' but soxprospects is just basically some guys talking out of their asses. I don't proclaim to be a scout, but there's really nothing of value on that site.[/quote']

 

I don't have any problem with SP's site. I'm thankful for it, actually. Nice presentation, consistent format. Their little 'executive' team (for lack of a better term) actually does scout games, with a radar gun, and they also have guest appearances on ESPN Boston and know many of the Sox scouts, get interviews with the Sox scouting director and prospects. I wouldn't call that nothing.

 

In fact (and no offense to anyone here) but Soxprospects definitely adds more to the dialogue than talksox does. We just sit here and argue with one another; at least on SP they are contributing something to discuss. I love talksox, long time member and all, but this is just a good place to come dialogue. We don't have an on-going list of today's minor league games with links to the box scores for each, or people who are experts on the collective bargaining agreement or people who go out of their way to attend low-A games.

 

A few years ago I would have agreed with you Emmz, but they've come a long way to professionalize the site. Their podcasts are also very informative, IMO.

 

Where the hell else would I go to find a scouting report Lowell RP William Cuevas? Maybe there's a better site?

[SemperFi Sox]

Hit his 15th bomb today.

[SouthieFanatic]

I love this kid. Partly cause I'm Dutch, but more so because he's got so much potential

[Dojji]

I don't have any problem with SP's site. I'm thankful for it, actually. Nice presentation, consistent format. Their little 'executive' team (for lack of a better term) actually does scout games, with a radar gun, and they also have guest appearances on ESPN Boston and know many of the Sox scouts, get interviews with the Sox scouting director and prospects. I wouldn't call that nothing.

 

In fact (and no offense to anyone here) but Soxprospects definitely adds more to the dialogue than talksox does. We just sit here and argue with one another; at least on SP they are contributing something to discuss. I love talksox, long time member and all, but this is just a good place to come dialogue. We don't have an on-going list of today's minor league games with links to the box scores for each, or people who are experts on the collective bargaining agreement or people who go out of their way to attend low-A games.

 

A few years ago I would have agreed with you Emmz, but they've come a long way to professionalize the site. Their podcasts are also very informative, IMO.

 

Where the hell else would I go to find a scouting report Lowell RP William Cuevas? Maybe there's a better site?

 

I agree. They're not authoritative, but they're very, very informative. Most fanbases don't have guys who do what SP.com is doing.

[Emmz]

Most fanbases don't have guys who pretend to know how to scout.

[Emmz]

I don't have any problem with SP's site. I'm thankful for it, actually. Nice presentation, consistent format. Their little 'executive' team (for lack of a better term) actually does scout games, with a radar gun, and they also have guest appearances on ESPN Boston and know many of the Sox scouts, get interviews with the Sox scouting director and prospects. I wouldn't call that nothing.

 

In fact (and no offense to anyone here) but Soxprospects definitely adds more to the dialogue than talksox does. We just sit here and argue with one another; at least on SP they are contributing something to discuss. I love talksox, long time member and all, but this is just a good place to come dialogue. We don't have an on-going list of today's minor league games with links to the box scores for each, or people who are experts on the collective bargaining agreement or people who go out of their way to attend low-A games.

 

A few years ago I would have agreed with you Emmz, but they've come a long way to professionalize the site. Their podcasts are also very informative, IMO.

 

Where the hell else would I go to find a scouting report Lowell RP William Cuevas? Maybe there's a better site?

 

If I wanted a fake minors report from a wannabe scout I could get it anywhere. The difference between Talksox and Soxprospects is that SP is full of pretentious homers that actually think they're scouts. I can just talk to Fred over here and save myself to hassle of having to log in at two different sites.

 

I hope I've finally clarified enough as to why I think Soxprospects is an absolute joke of a website.

[User Name]

Count me in as a rider of the "SP.com sucks" bandwagon.

[a700hitter]

Most fanbases don't have guys who pretend to know how to scout.

Do these jokers at least watch these guys play or are they just crunching meaningless low level minor stats and combining that with professional scouting reports. If that is what they are doing, they are nothing more than a useless secondary source with a bias.

[jacksonianmarch]

everyone has an ace or middle of the order projection over there. I do find it humorous. And they do pump the gun a little with velo readings on the pitchers they "scout".

[Dojji]

Do these jokers at least watch these guys play or are they just crunching meaningless low level minor stats and combining that with professional scouting reports. If that is what they are doing' date=' they are nothing more than a useless secondary source with a bias.[/quote']

 

They watch the games, record video, and occasionally post it online (if you know how to find it). They'[re a little high on many of the prospects, but on a website devoted 100% to Red Sox prospects, that's not that surprising.

 

You may not agree with every analysis they make (I know I don't) but they do add fresh information to the discussion on a pretty regular basis. They're a must read during Spring Training (usually multiple first hand accounts) and again at draft time, and again going into September.

[example1]

everyone has an ace or middle of the order projection over there. I do find it humorous. And they do pump the gun a little with velo readings on the pitchers they "scout".

 

Can you find me a couple of examples of this? Here's the pitchers, in order of their rank, with projections from scouting reports:

 

Barnes: Second or third starter projection on a first division team.

Tazawa: Projects as a 7th/8th inning reliever on a contender.

Ranaudo: Third starter ceiling at major league level.

Britton: Late inning reliever

Owens: 2nd/3rd pitcher on first division team

 

I could go on, but I hardly EVER see a projection of "ace". If Owens or Barnes don't have it, I don't know who does...

 

As for middle order bat I see that in Bogaerts, and I see Brentz as a 5th/6th hitter, but a) I don't see many middle order bat projections and why is predicting that some of these guys could be middle order bats out of line? Is there any doubt that Middlebrooks could be one? Or that Ellsbury was over hyped? Or Pedroia?

 

I'm pretty sure that you are just talking out of your rear, or basing it on 2008 rather than the site currently.

 

Overall, I understand people having their loyalties, but to think the information on that site sucks because the message board is pretentious or something seems like a weak reason. It's a good site, lots of very useful information, even if you don't like some of it.

 

As for who can be scouts and who can't, I can tell you that compared to paying a bunch of money to get Baseball America, I'm pretty content with their scouting work. If I would ever give a700 any credence for his observations during spring training, I'll listen to these guys who actively go to Lowell and Greenville games.

 

Is anyone on talksox going to Greenville games and able to give me a first hand scouting report? Emmz, do you have first person accounts of ANY of these players?

[jacksonianmarch]

I am basing it on the last time I was on the site, which was probably 2-3 years ago.

[Emmz]

Can you find me a couple of examples of this? Here's the pitchers, in order of their rank, with projections from scouting reports:

 

Barnes: Second or third starter projection on a first division team.

Tazawa: Projects as a 7th/8th inning reliever on a contender.

Ranaudo: Third starter ceiling at major league level.

Britton: Late inning reliever

Owens: 2nd/3rd pitcher on first division team

 

I could go on, but I hardly EVER see a projection of "ace". If Owens or Barnes don't have it, I don't know who does...

 

As for middle order bat I see that in Bogaerts, and I see Brentz as a 5th/6th hitter, but a) I don't see many middle order bat projections and why is predicting that some of these guys could be middle order bats out of line? Is there any doubt that Middlebrooks could be one? Or that Ellsbury was over hyped? Or Pedroia?

 

I'm pretty sure that you are just talking out of your rear, or basing it on 2008 rather than the site currently.

 

Overall, I understand people having their loyalties, but to think the information on that site sucks because the message board is pretentious or something seems like a weak reason. It's a good site, lots of very useful information, even if you don't like some of it.

 

As for who can be scouts and who can't, I can tell you that compared to paying a bunch of money to get Baseball America, I'm pretty content with their scouting work. If I would ever give a700 any credence for his observations during spring training, I'll listen to these guys who actively go to Lowell and Greenville games.

 

Is anyone on talksox going to Greenville games and able to give me a first hand scouting report? Emmz, do you have first person accounts of ANY of these players?

 

Cool, they watch games. How's that scouting again? Also, Ranaudo was projected as an ace before. Anyways, all they've done is become safer with predictions, so in other words, do a less homer-like job of copying scouting reports.

 

If you think watching a lot of games makes you a scout, that's your issue I guess. s*** maybe I'll just have to start going to minor league games, maybe I'll get a job with a team as a scout.

[SemperFi Sox]

Cool, they watch games. How's that scouting again? Also, Ranaudo was projected as an ace before. Anyways, all they've done is become safer with predictions, so in other words, do a less homer-like job of copying scouting reports.

 

If you think watching a lot of games makes you a scout, that's your issue I guess. s*** maybe I'll just have to start going to minor league games, maybe I'll get a job with a team as a scout.

 

Safe as in calling Xander a potential 30+ HR hitter in the middle of a contending teams lineup?

[User Name]

I honestly don't see what the big deal is. Some people like SP, and others (like me) don't for a variety of reasons.

 

Let's move on and go back to the awesomeness that is Xander.

[SemperFi Sox]

Do you realize they actually attend many games to scout players? They aren't random people watching games on their mom's tv.

[User Name]

So?

[Dojji]

So?

 

So their analysis is based on more than just what they can read on other websites and see on TV.

 

That puts them above our level, meaning it's kind of foolish to try and look down on them.