Should Kalish make the team next year?

[Yaz Sideburn]

if the red sox want to improve the offense, trading a guy like drew who's usually good for an ops around .900 probably isn't the best way to do it. we can't ship someone off every time they have a down year

[NativeBostonian]

I think the Red Sox should keep the Kid. Then they can get to work on kicking J.D Drew and Mike Cameron out on Lansdowne Street?

[Palodios]

This is all predicated on the idea that we're all so freaking impatient that we can't just wait for their contracts to expire anyway.

 

I'm sorry if I want to see this team win another championship while its loaded with home grown players. The core 4 won't be around forever and Lackey/Beckett/Dice-k will decline towards the ends of their contracts. In 2011, the team's payroll drops 30 million dollars of payroll in dead weight alone. 2011 looks too good for them to keep waiting for Ted Williams to be reborn in Reddick's body.

[Dojji]

Well, if you want to win, making short-sighted moves that help you one year and hurt you for the next several down the road isn't the best way to do it.

[jacksonianmarch]

i know stuff like "the red sox won't get anything in return and they'll have to pay most of their salaries" is just typical knee jerk stuff from you but try to think it through first. you really don't think a team will be willing to take on $4 million of mike cameron's salary next year?

 

i don't see them moving drew. he's one of the best right fielders in baseball

 

The Rangers werent willing to take on 4 million dollars of Cliff Lee's salary, and he's the best pitcher in the AL. The Yankees got the Astros to take most of Lance Berkman's salary and the Guardians to take Kerry Wood's. You have to keep in mind the economic times here

[Palodios]

Well' date=' if you want to win, making short-sighted moves that help you one year and hurt you for the next several down the road isn't the best way to do it.[/quote']

 

Trading Ellsbury is a move about the future. He might help them a little bit now, but he simply isn't as good as Crawford, and Kalish simply has more potential. Trading him gets value that will save crucial, cant-miss prospects like CK, RK, JI from being used in the inevitable big trade at the beginning of next season.

[Dojji]

After 2011, there would be room for all of Kalish, Crawford and Ellsbury in the lineup. This is a non-issue if you're willing to suck it up for one year.

[Palodios]

You keep ignoring the question about where the prospects for a big trade will come from.

[Yaz Sideburn]

The Rangers werent willing to take on 4 million dollars of Cliff Lee's salary' date=' and he's the best pitcher in the AL. The Yankees got the Astros to take most of Lance Berkman's salary and the Guardians to take Kerry Wood's. You have to keep in mind the economic times here[/quote']

 

none of those deals are at all like the kind of trade we're talking about. we're not talking about trading a premium pitcher for prospects or dumping salary at the trade deadline

[Yaz Sideburn]

You keep ignoring the question about where the prospects for a big trade will come from.

 

a combination of some of casey kelly, lars anderson, josh reddick, michael bowden, anthony rizzo, junichi tazawa, stolmy pimentel, yamaico navarro, will middlebrooks, ryan lavarnway or luis exposito would be good enough to acquire a premium talent

[Palodios]

In 2009, Lowell hit .290, with an .811 OPS. Texas wanted us to pay 9 million of his contract. Cameron has equally severe injury concerns, and isn't hitting nearly as well as Lowell.

 

If the season ended today, JD Drew would be a Type A free agent, and I honestly believe that JD Drew will perform better in a contract year. Plus, the 2 top draft picks would be worth far more to the team than the 4 million dollars it might get in the trade market. Hell, Drew has been the only good player in the outfield this year, and you want to get rid of him?

[Palodios]

a combination of some of casey kelly' date=' lars anderson, josh reddick, michael bowden, anthony rizzo, junichi tazawa, stolmy pimentel, yamaico navarro, will middlebrooks, ryan lavarnway or luis exposito would be good enough to acquire a premium talent[/quote']

 

Listen please. I don't want to trade those young guys, and this organization doesn't either. Not only that, half of those guys have no trade value. I don't have a clue why you keep mentioning Tazawa-- he has sucked in the majors, he had tommy john this year, hasn't played in 2010, he can't even speak English or Spanish, and he costs more than the average prospect. Actually look into who these players are before you spout nonsense about whether or not this team should trade them... or if another team will actually want them.

[Yaz Sideburn]

In 2009, Lowell hit .290, with an .811 OPS. Texas wanted us to pay 9 million of his contract. Cameron has equally severe injury concerns, and isn't hitting nearly as well as Lowell.

 

If the season ended today, JD Drew would be a Type A free agent, and I honestly believe that JD Drew will perform better in a contract year. Plus, the 2 top draft picks would be worth far more to the team than the 4 million dollars it might get in the trade market. Hell, Drew has been the only good player in the outfield this year, and you want to get rid of him?

 

cameron's a much more valuable player with the offense and defense that he provides at a premium position. lowell is essentially a 1b/dh who puts up below average offense for his position

[Yaz Sideburn]

Listen please. I don't want to trade those young guys' date=' and this organization doesn't either. Not only that, half of those guys have no trade value. I don't have a clue why you keep mentioning Tazawa-- he has sucked in the majors, he had tommy john this year, hasn't played in 2010, he can't even speak English or Spanish, and he costs more than the average prospect. Actually look into who these players are before you spout nonsense about whether or not this team should trade them... or if another team will actually want them.[/quote']

 

if you don't want to trade them, that's fine. but don't say that you don't want to trade any of our decent prospects and then continue to insist that we don't have anyone to use in a trade for a premium player

[Palodios]

Kelly, Kalish, Iglesias, Stolmy, Rizzo, Lavarnway are part of this organizations long term plans. If it has to part with one of them, fine, but to give up a number of them will seriously hurt this organization's future. If this team trades away Ellsbury, it knows what it has and knows what its getting rid of.

[Yaz Sideburn]

Kelly' date=' Kalish, Iglesias, Stolmy, Rizzo, Lavarnway are part of this organizations long term plans. If it has to part with one of them, fine, but to give up a number of them will seriously hurt this organization's future. If this team trades away Ellsbury, it knows what it has and knows what its getting rid of.[/quote']

 

i like kalish and iglesias, but there's no guarantee that any of the guys you just mentioned ever make a major contribution at the major league level. ellsbury is a proven talent at a premium position, i would keep him

[Palodios]

i like kalish and iglesias' date=' but there's no guarantee that any of the guys you just mentioned ever make a major contribution at the major league level. ellsbury is a proven talent at a premium position, i would keep him[/quote']

 

As I said, they know what they have, and what they're getting rid of. None of the guys we want to get rid of are actually key pieces. So it would take three or four of those guys that might not make a mlb roster to get the value that Ellsbury would.

[Dojji]

Time to agree to disagree. We're just repeating ourselves now

[Palodios]

Yeah, actually that's a very good suggestion. Yaz's self-admitted bias really just gets under my skin, so I did the mature thing for once and threw him on my ignore list-- I got a bit heated there for a while.

[WhiskeyBreath]

Ignore list? really?

[Palodios]

I don't get along with him. Its not worth fighting over.

[WhiskeyBreath]

I suppose. Forget me. I just have this dumb thing about people using "ignore features" on message boards. Just never crossed my mind to ignore even the worst of people on the internet.

[Palodios]

I just want to mention that right now, Bill Hall's numbers are exactly where we expected Mike Cameron's to be.

[Yaz Sideburn]

Yeah' date=' actually that's a very good suggestion. Yaz's self-admitted bias really just gets under my skin, so I did the mature thing for once and threw him on my ignore list-- I got a bit heated there for a while.[/quote']

 

at least i come with a dislcaimer

[a700hitter]

Got the latest issue of Diehard yesterday. There were stories recapping the highlights of the Sox minor league franchises. After reading it, I realized that for all the hype about the rebuilding of the minor league system their is not a single stud (non-pitcher) in the entire system. The Pawtucket manager was quick and decisive as he named Daniel Nava as he story of the year. That is really pathetic. His major league ability is marginal at best. That's when it dawned on me that the system is devoid of big talent. Kalish is a nice player, but he is no blue-chipper. If the Sox want to be competitive over the next 2-3 seasons, they had better get some big time FA's.

[BSN07]

Got the latest issue of Diehard yesterday. There were stories recapping the highlights of the Sox minor league franchises. After reading it' date=' I realized that for all the hype about the rebuilding of the minor league system their is not a single stud (non-pitcher) in the entire system. The Pawtucket manager was quick and decisive as he named Daniel Nava as he story of the year. That is really pathetic. His major league ability is marginal at best. That's when it dawned on me that the system is devoid of big talent. Kalish is a nice player, but he is no blue-chipper. If the Sox want to be competitive over the next 2-3 seasons, they had better get some big time FA's.[/quote']

 

This is your MO every year

[Dipre]

Yeah, that's kinda not how it works. Youk, Pedey and Lester weren't "Blue Chippers" either, and look at what's happened with them.

 

Not to mention that the system is currently very bottom-heavy, but there are undeniably loads of talent in the lower levels.

[jacksonianmarch]

Lester was a blue chipper, then got written off a bit after his battle with lymphoma

[Dipre]

Lester was a blue chipper' date=' then got written off a bit after his battle with lymphoma[/quote']

 

He was a number 57 pick. He became an uber-prospect with time (he wasn't a top 100 prospect in 2003 or 2004), just like some of the guys in the lower levels will eventually do.

[a700hitter]

He was a number 57 pick. He became an uber-prospect with time (he wasn't a top 100 prospect in 2003 or 2004)' date=' just like some of the guys in the lower levels will eventually do.[/quote']He was definitely a highly anticipated prospect while in the minors. In my original post, I was talking about non-pitching prospects. We have no position players in the minors that are creating any buzz.. none. There was buzz about Pedroia. Even Youk had some buzz, because he had some consecutive game streak for reaching base. There was certainly buzz about Ellsbury. We've got nothing now. It will be interesting to see where our minor league organization gets ranked.

 

Spud and I remember when Dick O'Connell had all sorts of studs coming up from the minors in the late 60's and 70's. Year after year big talent came to the bigs: Carlton Fisk, Dwight Evans, Cecil Cooper, Bill Lee, Ben Oglivie, Juan Beniquez, Rogelio Moret, Rick Burleson, Jim Rice and Fred Lynn just to mention a few. Before them Reggie Smith, George Scott, Petrocelli, Conigliaro, and Lonborg. O'Connell was not the GM when the earlier group was signed, but he was instrumental in getting those guys, and it was because of his nose for talent that he was given the job in 1965. This was before the internet, ESPN and 24/7 sports coverage, and there was major buzz about many of these guys, especially Fisk, Evans, Lynn and Rice. I was hearing about those guys and I lived in NY.