Yankee deadline rumors

[jacksonianmarch]

On the contrary, why would the Yankees want to harrass their kids with the possibility of being dealt? The funny thing about this is that Ivan Nova isnt even in my updated top 15 Yankee prospects and Zach McAllister isnt in the top 20. Neither of them are the best pitchers at their level (David Phelps is the best pitcher in AAA). McAllister is looking more and more like a 4th or 5th starter and Nova's ceiling looks like a #3 but I think he might end up in the pen. Regardless, a prospect deal always has a chance to bite you in the ass, but getting Haren shores up the #2 spot in the rotation behind CC and it allows Hughes to go to the pen in 5 weeks when Pettitte comes back. It's a no-brainer.

[jacksonianmarch]

The only thing that it would require is a pen acquisition of some sort. And I have heard rumors that the Yankees might take a bad contract off Arizona's hands to lessen the prospect burden. Regardless, this floated deal and the failed Cliff Lee deal should give anyone pause to criticize the Yankee system. It's highly underrated and chock full of talent. And it will only get better

[Palodios]

Take a step back there. So you're saying having one guy from the Yankees throwing rumors out there about trades isn't harassing their kids? If they cared about the players emotions, these details wouldn't be out there until the deals were done.

 

And you're saying because these two teams didn't want Yankee prospects, it means that the Yankee system has more value? I agree that the Yankees have a pretty solid farm system going, but this reasoning doesn't make a ton of sense.

[jacksonianmarch]

Take a step back there. So you're saying having one guy from the Yankees throwing rumors out there about trades isn't harassing their kids?

 

No, I am saying that these rumors would be detrimental to the kids. Nothing like an impending trade to throw you off your game

 

If they cared about the players emotions, these details wouldn't be out there until the deals were done.

 

Agreed, but there is always a leak. The sox and yanks have tried to clam up on rumors over the past few yrs, but someone always leaks stuff

 

And you're saying because these two teams didn't want Yankee prospects, it means that the Yankee system has more value? I agree that the Yankees have a pretty solid farm system going, but this reasoning doesn't make a ton of sense.

 

No, what I am saying is that the Yankees and Mariners had an agreement in principle for Lee, so obviously they liked what they saw. The problem in that negotiation was Adams' ankle. The rumor I heard, granted operative term rumor, is that the M's wanted Eduardo Nunez in the deal instead of Adams and the Yanks balked saying that the deal was already agreed to.

 

In terms of Haren, if the holdup is on Joba, then I dont think they'll match up to be honest with you. Not sure why we wouldnt cash that chip in for a true top of the rotation horse who is pretty cost effective in the grand scheme of things

[Palodios]

No' date=' I am saying that these rumors would be detrimental to the kids. Nothing like an impending trade to throw you off your game[/quote']

 

Yeah, that's why I said a step back-- I wasn't exactly sure how this was contrary what I said. I was betting the leak has to be one or two people in the organization, not the organization itself.

[jacksonianmarch]

oh, yeah, then I agree with you. Although I dont think Cashman, Hank and Hal employ a guy simply to leak info. My guess is that the leak changes depending on the situation

[jacksonianmarch]

Sooo, we might be seeing Dan Haren before long. Mitre looked awful

[jacksonianmarch]

I have a feeling this is gonna happen. Read a report that the DBacks were trying to add Chris Snyder and Chad Qualls into the deal if the Yankees kept Joba out of it. The Yanks balked. But as the negotiation wears on, I bet they can find common ground. I bet the Yankees are able to make it work by bringing on Chad Qualls and probably moving Nova, McAllister and another guy. Qualls is a guy with a helluva resume but an absolutely abysmal season.

[jacksonianmarch]

Qualls has almost $2mil left on his contract this yr then is a FA. Snyder has $2 mil left on his contract for this season, $5.75mil on his contract for next yr and a $6.75 mil contract option for 2012

[diony]

Qualls has a .450 BABIP and his numbers won't correct themselves with 2 months left.

 

Snyder is not neccesary since we have Posada, Cervelli and both Montero and Romine at AAA next season.

[jacksonianmarch]

I bet there is SOMETHING that we can do to fix him. You dont go from dominant to incredibly bad in one season during what should be your prime.

[Rdsxmbnt]

I have a feeling this is gonna happen. Read a report that the DBacks were trying to add Chris Snyder and Chad Qualls into the deal if the Yankees kept Joba out of it. The Yanks balked. But as the negotiation wears on' date=' I bet they can find common ground. I bet the Yankees are able to make it work by bringing on Chad Qualls and probably moving Nova, McAllister and another guy. Qualls is a guy with a helluva resume but an absolutely abysmal season.[/quote']

 

Unless the "another guy" is an elite piece in the deal then there's no way this is happening. Ivan Nova is not getting you anything close to Dan Haren lol

[jacksonianmarch]

we'll see red. Nova has done a lot in recent weeks to increase his stock, mostly throwing with better velocity. Plus, there seems to be a lot of urgency to move contracts which always benefits NY

[BSN07]

Maybe the Yankees get a third team involved. Jesus being a Catcher and AZ having a good young Catcher hurts the Yankees since he's probably their best trade chip. If they can find another team to send Jesus too for another elite prospect AZ loves, then a deal might fall together. It's not unfathomable. Haren's a little risky. But if the Sox were in on him, I probably wouldn't be opposed to getting him. He has enough upside to warrant the risk.

[Palodios]

I heard reports that Montero was only being moved for Cliff Lee, and besides that, they weren't interested in trading him for any of the other available pitchers.Cliff Lee is as close to a sure thing as possible, he's at the front of a Cy Young race. Dan Haren is not.

[jacksonianmarch]

Maybe the Yankees get a third team involved. Jesus being a Catcher and AZ having a good young Catcher hurts the Yankees since he's probably their best trade chip. If they can find another team to send Jesus too for another elite prospect AZ loves' date=' then a deal might fall together. It's not unfathomable. Haren's a little risky. But if the Sox were in on him, I probably wouldn't be opposed to getting him. He has enough upside to warrant the risk.[/quote']

 

1. Montero isnt getting traded

2. The Yankees have the pitching prospects to make this work without Montero

3. The Yankee financial advantage will probably be at work again

 

Haren is a luxury, IMO. A front 3 of CC, AJ and Pettitte is solid, a #4 of Vazquez and Hughes in the pen is a pretty nice way to setup a rotation for the playoffs. Adding in Haren would be an improvement, but it is a luxury. It sounds like Arizona is in some serious financial dire straights and needs the cap relief. I have a feeling something will get worked out.

 

My best guess is....

 

Arizona trades:

Chad Qualls ($2.4 mil of cap relief)

Dan Haren ($17 mil of relief with option for 15 mil in 2012)

 

New York trades

Ivan Nova

Mark Melancon

Zach McAllister

lesser known prospect

 

That's my guess. It sounds significantly financially motivated and the Yankees have the pitching parts to make this look like a fair enough deal. Plus, in Arizona, I think Nova and McAllister can be solid starters and Melancon could eventually not get dicked around and potentially settle into his closer's potential.

[example1]

1. Montero isnt getting traded

2. The Yankees have the pitching prospects to make this work without Montero

3. The Yankee financial advantage will probably be at work again

 

Haren is a luxury, IMO. A front 3 of CC, AJ and Pettitte is solid, a #4 of Vazquez and Hughes in the pen is a pretty nice way to setup a rotation for the playoffs. Adding in Haren would be an improvement, but it is a luxury. It sounds like Arizona is in some serious financial dire straights and needs the cap relief. I have a feeling something will get worked out.

 

 

I love how you refer to it as "cap relief".

 

They are nowhere near the cap. It's payroll relief, or just relief. When the Yankees try to save money it is cap relief. When the D-Backs try to save money it is just an example of income disparity or a s***** franchise. I'm waiting for the day when the Yankees are seeking "relief" from the cap. Doesn't seem to phase them.

 

I'm not ragging on you, just pointing out the interesting use of a term that applies more specifically to big-market teams.

 

My best guess is....

 

Arizona trades:

Chad Qualls ($2.4 mil of cap relief)

Dan Haren ($17 mil of relief with option for 15 mil in 2012)

 

New York trades

Ivan Nova

Mark Melancon

Zach McAllister

lesser known prospect

 

That's my guess. It sounds significantly financially motivated and the Yankees have the pitching parts to make this look like a fair enough deal. Plus, in Arizona, I think Nova and McAllister can be solid starters and Melancon could eventually not get dicked around and potentially settle into his closer's potential.

 

If it is really financially motivated then the deal probably won't be fair, other than providing relief for Arizona.

 

If the move is there then the Yankees should take it, no doubt. It is a luxury, like you said, and I actually think it's a risk. I'm always skeptical of guys who were virtually unhittable for a few years and then get moved. He's probably still going to be a very nice pitcher no matter what, but it is probably safe to say that Haren's last few years were the best he will have. That said, a 3.60 ERA and 1.20 WHIP over 200 IP in the AL East isn't beyond the realm of possibility for him.

[jacksonianmarch]

And that's what I think he'll give us. 200+IP 200+K 3.60ish ERA and 1.20ish WHIP. That's top of the rotation stuff there

[yankees228]

I don't think this gets done without Joba.

[CoachC.]

Haren to Angels

[yankees228]

Terrible job by the Yankees. One of the worst jobs Cashman has ever done here.

[Keeper]

Haha, suck it Yankees. First, you couldn't close the deal on Lee. Now Haren. I love it.

[jacksonianmarch]

Like I said before, I think this came down to Lee in the offseason. There was an article this am that the Yankees wouldnt have had enough cash to sign Lee if they got Haren which was why they were balking at eating his whole contract. If that's true and the goal is to sign Lee in the offseason, then I cannot complain about this move.

[CoachC.]

Yankees wouldnt have had enough cash

 

[jacksonianmarch]

That's the rumor. Apparently the Steiny brothers do not share the same passion and devotion as their father did. Sounds like the brothers want to keep the salary as is and not add past their current high water mark

[example1]

And' date=' at 12 mil a yr, he isnt a hindrance to signing Lee in the offseason[/quote']

 

Like I said before' date=' I think this came down to Lee in the offseason. There was an article this am that the Yankees wouldnt have had enough cash to sign Lee if they got Haren which was why they were balking at eating his whole contract. If that's true and the goal is to sign Lee in the offseason, then I cannot complain about this move.[/quote']

 

You were all over it Jacko. You knew their financial situation and nailed it.

 

Oh, wait. <_>

[jacksonianmarch]

example, I made the first comment before the NYP article came out. The post is typically full of drivel, but they made some good points about the payroll. Now that George is gone, his sons will probably try to stabilize and then lower payroll. With Mariano looking at about the same salary and Jeter looking at a small pay cut, the Yankees arent gonna save much there. In the rotation, you have Pettitte and Vazquez making $23 million this yr, which sounds like what it's gonna take to sign Lee. So, unfortunately, I was wrong in my initial statement

[BSN07]

example' date=' I made the first comment before the NYP article came out. The post is typically full of drivel, but they made some good points about the payroll. Now that George is gone, his sons will probably try to stabilize and then lower payroll. With Mariano looking at about the same salary and Jeter looking at a small pay cut, the Yankees arent gonna save much there. In the rotation, you have Pettitte and Vazquez making $23 million this yr, which sounds like what it's gonna take to sign Lee. So, unfortunately, I was wrong in my initial statement[/quote']

 

I was wondering how the Sons would be running things. Imagine a Yankees team at or the below the luxury tax

[Palodios]

example' date=' I made the first comment before the NYP article came out. The post is typically full of drivel, but they made some good points about the payroll. Now that George is gone, his sons will probably try to stabilize and then lower payroll. With Mariano looking at about the same salary and Jeter looking at a small pay cut, the Yankees arent gonna save much there. In the rotation, you have Pettitte and Vazquez making $23 million this yr, which sounds like what it's gonna take to sign Lee. So, unfortunately, I was wrong in my initial statement[/quote']

 

Yeah, I don't see the Yankees letting Cliff Lee go again. Looking over the contract list, they don't have a lot of holes to fill. They will probably resign Pettite/Jeter/Rivera for similar money and use Posada as a fulltime DH. Signing Cliff Lee will put them a few million above what they're spending this year, but I doubt that'll be a problem.

[Yaz Sideburn]

if the yankees are trying to cut or stabalize the payroll, that doesn't bode well for them going after the most expensive starter on the market next year