What's going on with in Florida?

[BSN07]

 

Although Hanley Ramirez's play has been great, Dan Uggla is far from the only Marlin who has questioned Ramirez's desire and willingness to play through injuries. ``There are 23 guys behind Uggla,'' one Marlins person said, noting Ramirez isn't popular with teammates. Fairly or not, teammates question his toughness, partly because he skipped the 2008 season finale citing a stiff shoulder, which preserved his .301 average

 

 

Am I missing something? He hasn't played less then 153 games since becoming a full time player. But It seems he has some questioning his desire?

 

Just seems odd.:dunno:

 

 

Edit: Botch the title... Feel free to fix it.

[Dojji]

So yeah, looks like they might be up for trading Ramirez after all.

[Dipre]

Sorry' date=' I can't respond to this, I'm too busy drooling over Hanley trade scenarios[/quote']

 

Yet you actually managed to respond.

 

Ironic eh?

[Dojji]

Well there isn't honestly that much else to say.

 

"So yeah, apparently Hanley's unpopular with the Marlins players. Not exactly surprising, his attitude has come under scrutiny before and he's being asked to be a leader on a pretty rudderless team, not a good combination. I'm pretty sure he's getting a bad rap this time, but players have shot their way out of town over less than stuff like this becoming public. Maybe this gives us a chance to trade for him. I hope so."

 

Beyond the obligatory insults I think those 3 lines cover about everything that will be said in the entire thread.

[ORS]

Gee, I wonder if you guys think we should inquire about his availability?

[BSN07]

Actually my 1st intention was to get everyone's opinion on why they think everyone on the team is hating on Ramirez. Is it all true? Is it jealousy because he's really the only one on the team to have gotten "paid"? A general WTF is going on? The guy plays a ton of games. And is racking at the plate. While playing decent defense. They have even said he has played through some injuries this year. I mean what else could they want?

 

I knew the question of his "availability" would rise at some point. But it wasn't the main reason for making the thread.

[Dipre]

Well there isn't honestly that much else to say.

 

"So yeah, apparently Hanley's unpopular with the Marlins players. Not exactly surprising, his attitude has come under scrutiny before and he's being asked to be a leader on a pretty rudderless team, not a good combination. I'm pretty sure he's getting a bad rap this time, but players have shot their way out of town over less than stuff like this becoming public. Maybe this gives us a chance to trade for him. I hope so."

 

Beyond the obligatory insults I think those 3 lines cover about everything that will be said in the entire thread.

 

Well done.

 

But couldn't you have done that in the first place?

[BoSox21]

These were the same type of concerns people whispered about when he was in our system so it isn't all that surprising

[Dojji]

Actually my 1st intention was to get everyone's opinion on why they think everyone on the team is hating on Ramirez. Is it all true? Is it jealousy because he's really the only one on the team to have gotten "paid"? A general WTF is going on? The guy plays a ton of games. And is racking at the plate. While playing decent defense. They have even said he has played through some injuries this year. I mean what else could they want?

 

I knew the question of his "availability" would rise at some point. But it wasn't the main reason for making the thread.

 

At some point it has to come down to the manager and GM need to put a cap on this crap if they want to keep Hanley happy. If they can't control the clubhouse that's one more strike against a very bad franchise.

[BSN07]

These were the same type of concerns people whispered about when he was in our system so it isn't all that surprising

 

I don't understand it though. Maybe he's not the vocal type. But a guy who plays 150+ games every year and has his kind of stats at the plate doesn't appear to be lazy to me. I mean if this is him being lazy, I can only imagine the type of player he could be if inspired.

[Dojji]

I think the bigger point is that we're hearing this at all. Most franchises know how to keep this stuff under wraps and can keep disgruntled players out of the media.

 

Personally I think Uggla needs to take some heat here. War by media on your own teammate who will probably be your teammate next year is better than not playing through the odd injury?

[a700hitter]

He had some motivational issues when he was in the Red Sox organization. At the beginning of this season he was reportedly complaining openly in the clubhouse about being with the Marlins.

[example1]

This shouldn't be too hard to conceptualize fellas. We have already had an immensely productive and simultaneously lazy and unmotivated guy with a last named "Ramirez".

 

He puts up good numbers, he seems like someone any team would want, yet the team he's on doesn't see it that way. That's a warning sign to me.

 

I wonder if he's going to always be that "great player/not great leader" type player that teams will overpay for. His value (as a power-hitting SS) should be very, very high (like Jeter money). However, his personality and approach to the game reminds me more of Alfonso Soriano than a HOF-caliber player. A good player but maybe not someone the Sox should be thinking about building their franchise around.

[a700hitter]

We do need a SS, and Lowrie cannot be relied upon to take the starting job in 2010. Where do they turn? What about the Ramirez on ChiSox? He'd be way cheaper than HanRam from a $ and trade perspective. I don't know much about the guy, but he has looked pretty good this weekend. He seems to have good range and a very strong arm.

[ORS]

And he's under their control. Given their pitching, the resurgence of Konerko, the other good young players on their roster (Getz, Beckham), a full year of health from Quentin, and the acquisition of Alex Rios, plus them being a big market club, I think they have visions of competing next year, and would only move him if overwhelmed to do so.

[a700hitter]

And he's under their control. Given their pitching' date=' the resurgence of Konerko, the other good young players on their roster (Getz, Beckham), a full year of health from Quentin, and the acquisition of Alex Rios, plus them being a big market club, I think they have visions of competing next year, and would only move him if overwhelmed to do so.[/quote']You are probably right. Do you think he is a good SS?

[ORS]

Yeah, he's got some tools to be very good, but he's not someone I'd give up potential talent to acquire. He can hit a little, but he has all the patience of a sailor on shore leave in a brothel at the plate.

[Dojji]

If we don't go for Hanley the other shortstop that makes sense is JJ Hardy. If the coaching staff thinks they can correct whatever's wrong with his approach to the plate he could be the steal of the century.

[CrespoBlows]

He won't come cheap, and I don't really want to find out. He's always been a poor OBP threat.

[Dojji]

I disagree about the price tag. How much can Milwaukee really ask for the guy? Unless he turns it around he's essentially little more than an above average gloveman.

[CrespoBlows]

I disagree about the price tag. How much can Milwaukee really ask for the guy? Unless he turns it around he's essentially little more than an above average gloveman.

 

He's a 26 year old SS, who was above average from the position for consecutive years. How many teams would give something like that away?

[msubulldogs21]

Funny that this stuff about Hanley has come up. I'm not going to pretend to be an expert, but I think I know a little bit of what the problem is here. Back during March I was talking with one of my best friends. His cousin (Brett Sinkbeil) pitches for New Orleans, the Marlins AAA club and probably has a nice future with the team. He has been around Hanley quite a bit in spring training and has some close friends on the team in Chris Volstad, Josh Johnson, Dan Uggla, etc. According to what Brett told him, there aren't a whole lot of guys who really like Hanley a whole lot, mainly because he walks around with an attitude like he is God's gift to the game of baseball. I don't think it's a money/jealousy issue, but I could be wrong on that. But the main thing is, if you're acting like you're significantly better than everyone around you that act will grow tired real quick. There's no doubt Hanley is a prolific talent, but you can't just go around acting superior to the rest of the guys you're around almost every day for 7-8 months. I'd be willing to bet this is all true.

[Cocos Disciples]

Funny that this stuff about Hanley has come up. I'm not going to pretend to be an expert' date=' but I think I know a little bit of what the problem is here. Back during March I was talking with one of my best friends. His cousin (Brett Sinkbeil) pitches for New Orleans, the Marlins AAA club and probably has a nice future with the team. He has been around Hanley quite a bit in spring training and has some close friends on the team in Chris Volstad, Josh Johnson, Dan Uggla, etc. According to what Brett told him, there aren't a whole lot of guys who really like Hanley a whole lot, mainly because he walks around with an attitude like he is God's gift to the game of baseball. I don't think it's a money/jealousy issue, but I could be wrong on that. But the main thing is, if you're acting like you're significantly better than everyone around you that act will grow tired real quick. There's no doubt Hanley is a prolific talent, but you can't just go around acting superior to the rest of the guys you're around almost every day for 7-8 months. I'd be willing to bet this is all true.[/quote']

 

Holy s***, Brett Sinkbeil=Thumper!

[jacksonianmarch]

Hanley isnt going anywhere. They will move Uggla before they move Hanley

[BSN07]

We do need a SS' date=' and Lowrie cannot be relied upon to take the starting job in 2010. Where do they turn? What about the Ramirez on ChiSox? He'd be way cheaper than HanRam from a $ and trade perspective. I don't know much about the guy, but he has looked pretty good this weekend. He seems to have good range and a very strong arm.[/quote']

I'm sure everyone has a price. But I don't see the Sox going after him. I think there are a few names on a list of potential SS before you get to Alexi. Hardy(most likely), Drew( AZ sucks, you never know), Hanley(again everyone has a price+ recent issues), Tulo(again this would have to be a everyone has a price type of move)

And he's under their control. Given their pitching' date=' the resurgence of Konerko, the other good young players on their roster (Getz, Beckham), a full year of health from Quentin, and the acquisition of Alex Rios, plus them being a big market club, I think they have visions of competing next year, and would only move him if overwhelmed to do so.[/quote']

I concur

He won't come cheap' date=' and I don't really want to find out. He's always been a poor OBP threat.[/quote']

But he SLG more then Lowrie. There comparable OPS wise. I would think Hardy has the advantage in the field.

I disagree about the price tag. How much can Milwaukee really ask for the guy? Unless he turns it around he's essentially little more than an above average gloveman.

Them sending him down and gaining another year of control over him will up the price tag. I would thing a SP prospect would get it done. Maybe Tazawa? Bowden seems pricey. Kelly too. Pimentel+ one of the OF might do it as well. Something along those lines. Also depends on how many teams will get in on him. And what other SS's become available this off season too will have an effect on the price.

Hanley isnt going anywhere. They will move Uggla before they move Hanley

 

I tend to agree with you there. But the wheels do seem to be slightly greasy:D

[Keeper]

You are probably right. Do you think he is a good SS?

 

Alexei is not a good SS. He has a strong arm and decent range, but he makes a ton of errors, doesn't charge the ball particularly well, and takes too long to get rid of the ball. Also makes a lot of poor, lazy throws in the dirt. Konerko has bailed him out a lot this year. I think eventually the White Sox will move him back to 2B, where he flourished. If Josh Fields had panned out at 3B, Alexei might be there right now and Beckham would be at SS.