Rice Makes the Hall on Last Try

[a700hitter]

http://boston.redsox.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090112&content_id=3740202&vkey=news_bos&fext=.jsp&c_id=bos

 

He richly deserves it. He was a dominant offensive player for most of his career.

[schillingouttheks]

Nice. Congrats Jim!!!!

[yeszir]

Awesome. Every year people would talk about him and then he'd get snubbed. It was a tradition. Glad to see he's finally in.

[VA Sox Fan]

FINALLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[BoSox21]

never saw him play but some pretty impressive stats. good for him

[msubulldogs21]

Great to hear. I'm happy for him.

[ACL BoSox]

It's about time. Thank god he got in.

[26 to 6]

Congrats to Jim Rice.

 

I just dont get what makes him more deserving this year than last year. or the past 14 years. I guess there was a sense of urgency since this was his last year on the ballot, the writers didnt want to leave his fate up to the veterans committee. Either way, congratulations.

 

Now lets get Mattingly in!

[Cocos Disciples]

I don't think he deserved it (made a thread about it), but congratulations.

[Keeper]

Dawson certainly deserved it over Rice. So did Blyleven. But I'm happy for Rice. Going to the Veteran's Committee is like going to limbo.

[jacksonianmarch]

I don't think he deserved it (made a thread about it)' date=' but congratulations.[/quote']

 

I agree, he was a borderline case who I dont think made the cut, especially with how strict access has become these days. But he was solid for a long time and now, finally, the sox can retire his number

[rician blast]

HE was borderline and it played out that way. There's a bunch of guys who are borderline, i.e. Dawson...I wouldn't include Mattingly as a borderline HOF'er, his numbers fall too short.

 

For the helluvit, link below is compares stats of some fairly similar players:

 

http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/historical/player_stats.jsp?compare.x=&box6=XXXX118443XXXX&c_id=mlb&section1=2&statSet1=1&statType=1&sortByStat=HR&timeFrame=3&timeSubFrame=0&baseballScope=mlb&isCompare=true&sitSplit=&venueID=&teamPosCode=all&HS=true&box1=XXXX113151XXXX&box2=XXXX114526XXXX&box4=XXXX121140XXXX&box5=XXXX120225XXXX&checkBoxTotal=0&playerLocator=mattingly

[a700hitter]

Congrats to Jim Rice.

 

I just dont get what makes him more deserving this year than last year. or the past 14 years. I guess there was a sense of urgency since this was his last year on the ballot, the writers didnt want to leave his fate up to the veterans committee. Either way, congratulations.

I think what happened was that he had built up such resentment among writers that in the early years of his candidacy he was the victim of a certain amount of retribution. As years went on, offensive numbers became more and more bloated (mainly due to roids) and that diminished some of Rice's accomplishments. In the last few years (almost 20 years removed from his playing career) there weren't very many writers who covered him and had the opportunity to judge him first hand. They only had the numbers and the stats, and the stats were diminished by the decade of roids.

 

Now lets get Mattingly in!

Mattingly was a great hitter and fielder. I haven't done an analysis of their stats, but regardless of stats Mattingly didn't dominate like Rice did. Rice just flat out scared the hell out of pitchers. Yankee fans hated to see him in the batters box. He dominated in a batting order that had Evans, Lynn, Yaz George Scott, Fisk. Each of them were major offensive forces, but it was Rice who made the opponents sweat.

[BSN07]

Congrats!:thumbsup:

[Jacoby_Ellsbury]

Awesome.

[Dojji]

Now we just gotta get Dewey Evans in on the veterans' committee and that era of Sox history will be properly remembered.

[Cocos Disciples]

Or not.

[Keeper]

I'm with Coco on this. But with legends like Bill Mazeroski, Tony Lazzeri, and Joe Gordon in the HOF you could seriously make a case for just about anyone who had a halfway decent career.

[WhiskeyBreath]

Great to see Rice finally get in. Well deserved.

[redsoxrules]

Great news for Rice

 

 

how in hell does ricky NOT get 100% of the votes?

[example1]

Will Rice get his number retired now? 10 years with team, retires as Red Sox, and HOF. Aren't those the criteria?

[WhiskeyBreath]

Great news for Rice

 

 

how in hell does ricky NOT get 100% of the votes?

 

There hasn't been a single player in MLB history that has received 100%. Some of those damn voters shouldn't be allowed to vote on the hall anymore.

[Dojji]

Or not.

 

Evans was ahead of his time offensively. Back then he was just a .270 hitter with a bit of pop but at his peak his OBP was consistently around the .400 mark (career .370 OBP), he was arguably the best defensive RF in history, hit 385 HR's, logged 2446 hits, and had career high OPS + years of 162, 156, and 148 (in 1981, 1987, and 1982 respectively)

 

When you combine his marginal-to-borderline offense to his legendary defense, he sniffs the edges of HoF worthiness. That plus his role in the 1975 and 1986 pennant runs might put him over the edge in some eyes.

 

It's very possible that if he'd played in an era where OBP was en vogue he'd be in. He at least deserves the kind of consideration Andre Dawson got/is getting. He at least should be given an honest look.

[YAZMAN]

Congrats to Jim Rice.

 

I just dont get what makes him more deserving this year than last year. or the past 14 years. I guess there was a sense of urgency since this was his last year on the ballot, the writers didnt want to leave his fate up to the veterans committee.

 

Hmmm...I wonder if his stint at NESN hasn't contributed to the change in attitude?

 

 

Anyway, I say deserved, and congratulations.

[riverside sluggers]

Congrats Rice. Cant wait for the home opener now, I imagine they will be retiring his # 14 then

 

With next year not having any sure 1st ballot hall of famer, Andre Dawson will get in. He got 67% of the vote yesterday

[Dojji]

If Dawson should get in, Evans absolutely deserves to be in. He was an objectively better hitter and a vastly superior defender.

 

Dawson career OPS .805

Evans career OPS .840

 

Dawson career OPS+ 119

Evans career OPS+ 127

 

Dawson career OBP .323

Evans career OBP .370

 

Andre Dawson had a 20 year career of being Jose Guillen other than a handful of peak years. He also stuck around way too long looking for longevity. A modern baseball analysis doesn't show him to be anywhere near the hitter his reputation made him out to be.

 

Evans finished well. Even in Evans' Baltimore year where his power utterly failed him he put up a season OPS+ of 119 and an OBP of .393. And if anything, the more we learn about baseball the more we realize just how underappreciated Dwight Evans really is as a hitter.

 

I think in the end he has a chance with the Veterans' Committee if someone in there has been won over to the OBP school or really liked his defensive game.

[a700hitter]

Will Rice get his number retired now? 10 years with team' date=' retires as Red Sox, and HOF. Aren't those the criteria?[/quote']Those are the criteria. I would expect that his number would be retired this season.

 

Interestingly, during his last Spring Training with the Red Sox, I got Hanley Ramirez's autograph. When he signed his name, he put his uniform # which in this case was #14. I don't remember if he wore #14 at camp. It might just have been his minor league #.

[Dojji]

Wow, that was one heck of a scoop man, that might be valuable some day.

[Keeper]

If Dawson should get in' date=' Evans absolutely deserves to be in. He was an objectively better hitter and a vastly superior defender.[/quote']

 

They had 8 gold gloves apiece. Forgive me, but "vastly superior" smacks of hometown bias.

 

Dawson had more hits, home runs, doubles, triples, RBIs, runs, stolen bases, his average is higher, and his SLG is higher. Evans only beats him in OBP and OPS. If all you care about is sabermetrics, you could make a case for Evans. But let's be real: Dawson was the better player.

[Jasonbay44]

Finally, about time Rice got in, Congrats to him.