Report: Red Sox, Matsuzaka agree to deal

[example1]

Nice stevece80. I've seen you on other boards, but I'm glad you've decided to come say hi. Hope you stick around. Great Matsuzaka pic.

[riverside sluggers]

Teahan will be at 1b

 

I believe their plan is to have Ryan Shealy at 1st base, Teahen would shift to the outfield if he stays with KC

[seabeachfred]

I believe their plan is to have Ryan Shealy at 1st base' date=' Teahen would shift to the outfield if he stays with KC[/quote']

 

Riverside, if Gordon turns out to be the player the Royals think he can be, Teehan might be just what we could use as our third baseman for the post-Lowell years. It won't be a price that's out of this world and he can be spared by the Royals since they do have a glut in the OF and Sheely is ticketed for first base. Teehan's salary is low enough to make him very affordable and the guy can be productive for us. On the other hand, if Chad Spann has a bang up year down at Pawtucket he could also be in the mix.

[riverside sluggers]

http://www.rotoauthority.com/2007/01/2007_fantasy_ba_7.html

 

Roto put forth its prediction of the top 30 starters (ranked by terms of drafting dollar value)

 

Matsuzaka ranked 10th, Curt Schilling ranked 22nd, and Mike Mussina ranked 27th. That was it for Sox & Yankee Starters

[hoefdj18]

hey, it's been a while since i last posted here, so 'hi' to everyone again. as for the matsuzaka deal, i'm still a little questionable. sure he is a good pitcher. we can project this and that, but i'm going to hold off judgement on wether this was a good deal or not. at the beginning of the season he may be lights out like how beckett was at the beginning because the hitters in the AL were not used to him; the same could go for dice. ok, so he lit up the japaneese leagues. so did nomo. and another hing, offering a 6 year deal (?), if he ends up being a total bust, which i hope he isn't, but hypothetically speaking, the sox are going to have to eat his major contract because no one will want him. sorry if this is all obvious or already discussed, i didn't backread. there's my two cents.

[hoke3182]

predictions are the mother of all f*** ups, there PROJECTIONS for a reason. Don't look into that. Predictions are right 50% of the time. Thier either right or wrong.

[seabeachfred]

Right now Hoke, projections and predictions are all we have going for us. This is the dead time for baseball, the five weeks before pitchers and catchers report, and, frankly, there isn't a whole lot else to talk about unless you want to speculate as we have since the prehistoric period as to when Drew will get signed or who will be our closer. I wil agree with you that predictions mean crapola. They're as wrong as much as they right and even projections are often off the mark. I would just like to know what Theo is up to right now, and whether he is still in the market for a closer and how close we are to getting J.D. under contract.

[stevece80]

ok' date=' so he lit up the japaneese leagues. so did nomo.[/quote']

 

And Nomo was one of the best pitchers in the Major Leagues his first two seasons. Furthermore, Matsuzaka was quite better than Nomo was in Japan. There's no use saying this pitcher and this pitcher were good in Japan, and then bad in the majors, because none of them had Daisuke's stuff or results before coming to America.

 

If you want to compare Nomo and Matsuzaka in their four full seasons before coming to America, their ERAs aren't all that disimilar. Nomo's undoing was his control, and it was absolutely horrendous in Japan, and while it eventually caught up to him in the US, it didn't do such a thing in Japan:

 

Nomo:

235 IP, 2.91 ERA, 109 BB

242 1/3 IP, 3.05 ERA, 128 BB

216 2/3 IP, 2.66 ERA, 117 BB

243 1/3 IP, 3.70 ERA, 148 BB

 

Matsuzaka:

194 IP, 2.83 ERA, 63 BB

146 IP, 2.90 ERA, 42 BB

215 IP, 2.30 ERA, 49 BB

186 1/3 IP, 2.13 ERA, 34 BB

 

What got Nomo by was his pure stuff, which was largely a nasty splitter. Matsuzaka also has great stuff, but can keep hitters honest with about 5 above average to great pitches that he can throw for strikes in any count. That's not projecting numbers, that's pure scouting. How many pitchers in the majors have that quality, and how many of them aren't at the very least above average pitchers?

[HeadOfSoxNation]

And Nomo was one of the best pitchers in the Major Leagues his first two seasons. Furthermore, Matsuzaka was quite better than Nomo was in Japan. There's no use saying this pitcher and this pitcher were good in Japan, and then bad in the majors, because none of them had Daisuke's stuff or results before coming to America.

 

If you want to compare Nomo and Matsuzaka in their four full seasons before coming to America, their ERAs aren't all that disimilar. Nomo's undoing was his control, and it was absolutely horrendous in Japan, and while it eventually caught up to him in the US, it didn't do such a thing in Japan:

 

Nomo:

235 IP, 2.91 ERA, 109 BB

242 1/3 IP, 3.05 ERA, 128 BB

216 2/3 IP, 2.66 ERA, 117 BB

243 1/3 IP, 3.70 ERA, 148 BB

 

Matsuzaka:

194 IP, 2.83 ERA, 63 BB

146 IP, 2.90 ERA, 42 BB

215 IP, 2.30 ERA, 49 BB

186 1/3 IP, 2.13 ERA, 34 BB

 

What got Nomo by was his pure stuff, which was largely a nasty splitter. Matsuzaka also has great stuff, but can keep hitters honest with about 5 above average to great pitches that he can throw for strikes in any count. That's not projecting numbers, that's pure scouting. How many pitchers in the majors have that quality, and how many of them aren't at the very least above average pitchers?

 

 

I agree...great post.

[a700hitter]

Nomo was pretty special his first couple of years in the majors. This could be a lot of fun this year.

[seabeachfred]

I think all of us would be sleeping better if we could get our closer situation settled and sign Drew to that contract. Right now it seems everything for the coming season is up in the air. I just wonder if Theo is just going to say screw it to Boras and move on. Epstein plays things pretty close to his vest so no one knows what he has up his sleeve. This waiting on J.D. is getting a little old from where I'm stting and I'm also begining to believe the closer situation will not be resolved until ST, if even then.

[riverside sluggers]

Damn I love this kid!!

 

Matsuzaka is either working on a new pitch or modifying one of his current pitches

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2007/02/01/getting_down_to_business/

 

EDIT: Im very much loving the ad Matsuzaka filmed in Japan for this type of beer. The flowing Sox jersey as he is putting it on gives me goosebumps... even more so at the end where they photoshop him in a Red Sox uni pitching with a roaring crowd behind him

http://www.boston.com/sports/nesn/wilbur/sports_blog/blog/2007/02/01/daisukes_ad_debuts/index.html

[jacksonianmarch]

and if he has a bad april, he'll be turned on by the masses. Granted, not you guys, the smart sox fans, but the pink hats in Boston who can now afford season tix.

[Fried Neckbones]

EDIT: Im very much loving the ad Matsuzaka filmed in Japan for this type of beer. The flowing Sox jersey as he is putting it on gives me goosebulps... even more so at the end where they photoshop him in a Red Sox uni pitching with a roaring crowd behind him

http://www.boston.com/sports/nesn/wilbur/sports_blog/blog/2007/02/01/daisukes_ad_debuts/index.html

 

That's pretty freaking cool. :thumbsup: A sight I could get used to.

[Cocos Disciples]

and if he has a bad april' date=' he'll be turned on by the masses. Granted, not you guys, the smart sox fans, but the pink hats in Boston who can now afford season tix.[/quote']

 

God, I hope not.

[riverside sluggers]

and if he has a bad april' date=' he'll be turned on by the masses. Granted, not you guys, the smart sox fans, but the pink hats in Boston who can now afford season tix.[/quote']

 

Matsuzaka's **projected** April

April 4- @ Kansas City

April 10- Seattle (Fenway Park debut, first pitch to Ichiro)

April 15- Anaheim

April 20- New York (1st matchup between the 2 teams)

April 25- @ Baltimore

[example1]

I think KC is the perfect place for him to get his feet under himself in his first start. Are plane tickets to KC expensive?

 

This kid has got some f***ing moxie. He's just so damn cocky and seems to have a good sense of humor and a bit of humility too (paradoxical, yes, but I think its true). He seems genuine, thoughtful and well-spoken (or at least his Harvard graduate translator was all of those things). But you can see from his ability to make eye-contact, his head nodding when listening to questions, etc., that this guy is pretty bright and self-assured.

 

Anyone read the report on him by Callis in Baseball America's Prospect Guide? All three of the reviewers rank him as their #1 prospect (in all of baseball) and the page-long write-up is nothing but positive projections. While calling him a prospect is 'marginal' at best, I think its safe to say that if jacksonian can be so certain that Phillip Hughes is going to be worth something then Sox fans have absolutely every right to believe with confidence that Matsuzaka is a tremendous addition to this team. Anyway, a little taste from the piece (for copyright reasons I shouldn't put the whole thing):

 

About the worst thing any scout will say about Matsuzaka is tha the might be a No.2 starter rather than a No. 1. There's disagreement about whether the number of quality pitches he possesses is five or six or seven. His best is a forkball that dives at the plate. he usually pitches in the low 90s with his two-seam fastball, and he can dial up the velocity with a four-seamer. He finished an 11-inning win last season with a 97 mph heater. Matsuzaka also can make hitters look silly with a 12-to-6 curveball, a hard slider and a changeup that has screwball action. All six of those pitches grade as plus pitches at times, and some as plus-plus... Matsuzaka also has command and control of his pitches, as well as a feel for setting up hitters. There are no doubts about his mental toughness, as he has been in the spotlight since he was in high school and has pitched well on big stage after big stage.

 

Personally I think he'll be a #1 by the end of the year. His stuff, his control, he poise, his history of success under pressure, his age, his work ethic, everything just screams "best Japanese pitcher yet". He's a tremendous addition to this team. Think about how much the Tigers benefited from adding a Justin Verlander to their rotation... it can be huge to add a big-time starting pitcher.

[Cityofchampions33]

With all those plus pitches to choose from, it'll be hard not for him to succeed. Lets just hope he doens't go Josh Beckett and try to overpower everyone.

[example1]

With all those plus pitches to choose from' date=' it'll be hard not for him to succeed. Lets just hope he doens't go Josh Beckett and try to overpower everyone.[/quote']

 

He won't. He doesn't have Becketts fastball. More like Papelbon I'd say. Late life and pretty deceptive.

 

Shoot me for the comparison, but his stuff reminds me most of Pedro in that it seems that each and every one of his pitches is thrown to the exact same spot about 10 feet in front of the mound. It's what they do after that that makes them so hard to hit. The fastball stays up at 94 or has 2-seam movement late; the curveball breaks straight down; the slider breaks away from righties and down, the change breaks Pedro-like down and in and the forkball just looks like a high-to-low fastball that always ends up in the dirt right behind the plate. He can throw all of those pitches for called-strikes as well as use the hitters aggressiveness against him to have the pitch end up in an unhittable location (on the ground) when the guy is swinging. He should be very fun to watch and f*** those who say it is sacreligous or too-early to compare them. You can compare anyone you want to and Pedro was the rolls royce of pitchers.

[example1]

Damn I love this kid!!

 

Matsuzaka is either working on a new pitch or modifying one of his current pitches

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2007/02/01/getting_down_to_business/

 

EDIT: Im very much loving the ad Matsuzaka filmed in Japan for this type of beer. The flowing Sox jersey as he is putting it on gives me goosebumps... even more so at the end where they photoshop him in a Red Sox uni pitching with a roaring crowd behind him

http://www.boston.com/sports/nesn/wilbur/sports_blog/blog/2007/02/01/daisukes_ad_debuts/index.html

 

I love how he looks at the glass of beer after he finishes it. He's got a firm grip on that glass but looks VERY satisfied. Like striking out a little child. It's like he's saying "that all you got? I guess so." Good acting. I'm thirsty...

[TheKilo]

and if he has a bad april' date=' he'll be turned on by the masses. Granted, not you guys, the smart sox fans, but the pink hats in Boston who can now afford season tix.[/quote']

 

And if Pettite bombs...?

 

Stop being a pinstriped dicklicker and raining on people's parades.

[mar_022]

And if Pettite bombs...?

 

Stop being a pinstriped dicklicker and raining on people's parades.

 

i dont think jackson was trying to antagonize at all here...chill out kilo. In fact, he's right...if daisuke struggles at first, the fairweather sox fans (not us, as Jackson credited us) will get down on him immediately

[a700hitter]

And if Pettite bombs...?

If he bombs? He wasn't that great when he was in his prime with the Yankee Dynasty team. He's not going to be any better three years after leaving with more wear and tear on his arm. Mr. (I want to play closer to home) Pettitte came back for one final big pay day to the only team that would cough up $34 million to him for 2 years. This will make Unit's contract look like a bargain.

[jacksonianmarch]

thanks mar. That was the point.

[ksushi]

He has too many good pitches to "bomb" he might not be the second coming of koufax, but he isn't going to bomb.

[jacksonianmarch]

I doubt that he will bomb either. As you said, he is too polished to just flat out flame out. I just think his expectations are way too high for a guy who hasnt pitched in the bigs yet. He will have his ups and his downs and eventually we will see where he stands. Thing is, if he has a s***** april, sox fans at the stadium need to lay off him and let him feel his way through. Cause you know that Shaughnessy will be writing bad s*** about this guy from day 1, no matter how well he performs. If the guy throws a 2 hit shutout, it will be why didnt he get a no-no. That type of crap that boston newspapers are famous for (and what NY newspapers are starting to emulate with Lupica's s***** style). If the papers feed the minions and this kid struggles early, he could really implode. Remember, this guy has found an insane amount of love at his home stadium for 8 yrs now. How will he deal with 36K breathing down his neck if he loses to the yankees in his first start in NY.

[ksushi]

Not speaking english will be a blessing.

[riverside sluggers]

If he is having a good season at point of "if he loses 1st start in New York", ah I really dont think the entire stadium is gonna get ready to throw sushi at him

[example1]

I doubt that he will bomb either. As you said' date=' he is too polished to just flat out flame out. I just think his expectations are way too high for a guy who hasnt pitched in the bigs yet. He will have his ups and his downs and eventually we will see where he stands. Thing is, if he has a s***** april, sox fans at the stadium need to lay off him and let him feel his way through. Cause you know that Shaughnessy will be writing bad s*** about this guy from day 1, no matter how well he performs. If the guy throws a 2 hit shutout, it will be why didnt he get a no-no. That type of crap that boston newspapers are famous for (and what NY newspapers are starting to emulate with Lupica's s***** style). If the papers feed the minions and this kid struggles early, he could really implode. Remember, this guy has found an insane amount of love at his home stadium for 8 yrs now. How will he deal with 36K breathing down his neck if he loses to the yankees in his first start in NY.[/quote']

 

This is crazy. He's not some idiot kid who hasn't played big time baseball before. He's not going to suddenly not be able to find the strikezone or suddenly lose one or all of his pitches. He's a guy who threw 10 innings against the US in the 2000 olympics against another young gun Ben Sheets. He was 3-0 with a 1.38 ERA in the WBC. He dominated a team of MLB all stars in 2004. He struck out Ichiro 3 times in a game as a rookie.

 

Barring injury I think this guy is so good that Shaugnasey won't have anything to say. My guess is that if the Sox are losing it won't be because of Matsuzaka, a guy who has an uncanny ability to make people swing and miss and not give up lots of runs. The Sox faithful didn't give Josh Beckett as much s*** as they have other players despite his suckitude. We recognize talent when we see it and everyone knows that this boat is goign to sink or swim based in large part on how matsuzaka does. My guess is that he will dominate against the mediocre teams in the league and fare pretty well the first few times through against the better teams. After that he will be like any other good pitcher, needing to adjust his game and pitch sequences based on extensive video study and whatnot. You can't face the Yankees 5 times a season and not get a loss or two, no matter how good you are. Everyone saw Pedro go through the same s***, despite dominating the Yanks a few times early in his sox career.

[jacksonianmarch]

This is crazy. He's not some idiot kid who hasn't played big time baseball before. He's not going to suddenly not be able to find the strikezone or suddenly lose one or all of his pitches. He's a guy who threw 10 innings against the US in the 2000 olympics against another young gun Ben Sheets. He was 3-0 with a 1.38 ERA in the WBC. He dominated a team of MLB all stars in 2004. He struck out Ichiro 3 times in a game as a rookie.

 

Barring injury I think this guy is so good that Shaugnasey won't have anything to say. My guess is that if the Sox are losing it won't be because of Matsuzaka, a guy who has an uncanny ability to make people swing and miss and not give up lots of runs. The Sox faithful didn't give Josh Beckett as much s*** as they have other players despite his suckitude. We recognize talent when we see it and everyone knows that this boat is goign to sink or swim based in large part on how matsuzaka does. My guess is that he will dominate against the mediocre teams in the league and fare pretty well the first few times through against the better teams. After that he will be like any other good pitcher, needing to adjust his game and pitch sequences based on extensive video study and whatnot. You can't face the Yankees 5 times a season and not get a loss or two, no matter how good you are. Everyone saw Pedro go through the same s***, despite dominating the Yanks a few times early in his sox career.

 

 

even the best of them have rough stretches and even the best have trouble with adjustments. Dont put out a statement about this kid that makes him sound inhuman. He is human, he will have his down games and he will be flappable at times, just like every player is. Hell, RJ fell apart in NY and he is headed to the HOF. It isnt crazy, it is a fact of life.