Drew on board

[seabeachfred]

Coco has a puss arm and is ill suited to right field. We would be weakening two positions with that move. Coco can play a decent CF. The problem is Pena. I know many of you said my previous post was extreme, but I have seen Pena play the outfield in THREE games. One, he misplayed four balls and cost us the game, another he misjudged a fly ball off his glove for a homer in the Red Sox home opener, and the third cost the team two runs on a botched fly ball and almost cost us the game. Friends, the guy is terrible in either left field or right field and in a close game he would be frightening for us to have him playing out there.

[kreinbihl34]

and we will still not have a # 5 hitter.

 

This is the only reason I hate being on this board. Some here believe in taking risks on players, others like you 700 simply do not. I believe in giving WMP his chance to shine, do not put pressure on him every fifth day. What I mean is because he sees little playing time he thinks he needs to hit homers every at bat to see another day. Let him have playing time and we'll see the next great hitter for Boston.

 

Btw if memory serves me well WMP had exactly zero errors last year in center.

[jacksonianmarch]

wait, you hate the fact that people have differing opinions? Isnt that what a board like this is all about? If everyone had the exact same thing to say, it would be boring.

[BoSox21]

the only thing that worries me about WMP as the everyday 5th batter in the lineup is that this is a year where the Sox are going for broke and relying on unproven players to play key roles is a bit unnerving to a lot of people

[a700hitter]

This is the only reason I hate being on this board. Some here believe in taking risks on players' date=' others like you 700 simply do not. I believe in giving WMP his chance to shine, do not put pressure on him every fifth day. What I mean is because he sees little playing time he thinks he needs to hit homers every at bat to see another day. Let him have playing time and we'll see the next great hitter for Boston.[/quote']Theo expects that as the 4th OF, WMP will get 300+ ABs. That's playing more than once every 5th day. I am not against giving a guy a chance, but I am not for giving a starting job to a total unproven unaccomplished quantity like Pedroia without making him win the job. As far as WMP goes, I am comfortable with him getting a shot as a starter, but not as a #5 hitter. If he 's the #5 hitter, he'll strike out 200 times and Manny and Ortiz will be LOB all year long.

 

BTW If you hate a difference of opinion than this is probably no the board for you.

[seabeachfred]

This is the only reason I hate being on this board. Some here believe in taking risks on players, others like you 700 simply do not. I believe in giving WMP his chance to shine, do not put pressure on him every fifth day. What I mean is because he sees little playing time he thinks he needs to hit homers every at bat to see another day. Let him have playing time and we'll see the next great hitter for Boston.

 

Btw if memory serves me well WMP had exactly zero errors last year in center.

 

He had zero errors because the score keeper was kind enough to give hits on balls that should have been caught by any decent outfielder, and if you hate being on this board because people have differing opinions on everything from soup to nuts, let me suggest to get on Uponthemonster. They only allow Red Sox fans on that board and seldom is heard a discouraging word. They think lockstep on everything and good or bad, the FO always knows best. Here my friend we have fans of different teams and we revel in speaking our mind. I have no gripe with you playing up Wily Mo Pena; in fact I encourage you to do so with my blessing and that of the other posters, but I expect the same treatment from you, especially since I have very little use or confidence in your WMP. Variety is what makes this board great and it would be dull as dull can be if we didn't have a few Jacksons to keep us on our toes and raise some hell along the way. :D :D

[Vinny]

We have good arms in our system Vinny but most are not ready yet--unless' date=' that is, someone blows us away in Spring Training, guys like Bard, Bowden, Bucholz, the "B" Boys if you will. I'll be looking for it when I watch them in Spring Training the last week in March down in Florida. The fact, is , however, most of us Red Sox fans do not want to risk the front office being tempted to make Papelbon the closer again because it would be a risk to his career. He is a starting pitcher who was forced into it this past season, and though he did very well, his shoulder gave out. So as of right now we don't have a closer. The Dodgers hit gold last year, too, with Takashi Saito, but teams usually don't find clovers like that two years in a row. Gonzales??? Class act, class guy and he will do well for the Dodgers, but he is no Drew. I'm surprised you also like the Red Sox. A lot of your friends on that other shitboard think it impossible to root for teams in different leagues. Have they gotten on your case for that yet? Anyway, all we can do is wait until the season and see how this plays out. Maybe I'll even see you at a Giants-Dodgers game next season. I sure as hell know I won't see you at a Red Sox game. Have a nice day Vinny. I'll give you this. You seem to know your baseball, which is more than I can say for some of your lodge brothers.[/quote']

I don't like the Red Sox. Actually I find the AL almost unwatchable. Having a DH really changes the game. No double switches, no leaving pitchers in till the end of the inning, you just plug relievers into the game without worrying about anything. I find the NL game to be much better. But I will say that eventhough I don't care for the Red Sox one way or the other, I really hate the Yankees. So I was happy when you guys beat them, especially coming back from 3-0. I will also say that I was impressed with how many fans came to L.A. for the Dodgers/Red Sox series. But no I only like the Dodgers, but occasionally I will root against other teams.

[Vinny]

You guys lucked out. Take this time to either put some very restrictive clauses in his contract or drop him altogethor and look to spend your money in other ways.

[jacksonianmarch]

I don't like the Red Sox. Actually I find the AL almost unwatchable. Having a DH really changes the game. No double switches' date=' no leaving pitchers in till the end of the inning, you just plug relievers into the game without worrying about anything. I find the NL game to be much better. But I will say that eventhough I don't care for the Red Sox one way or the other, I really hate the Yankees. So I was happy when you guys beat them, especially coming back from 3-0. I will also say that I was impressed with how many fans came to L.A. for the Dodgers/Red Sox series. But no I only like the Dodgers, but occasionally I will root against other teams.[/quote']

 

So you are telling me that watching a totally overmatched pitcher hit is fun?

[seabeachfred]

I don't like the Red Sox. Actually I find the AL almost unwatchable. Having a DH really changes the game. No double switches' date=' no leaving pitchers in till the end of the inning, you just plug relievers into the game without worrying about anything. I find the NL game to be much better. But I will say that eventhough I don't care for the Red Sox one way or the other, I really hate the Yankees. So I was happy when you guys beat them, especially coming back from 3-0. I will also say that I was impressed with how many fans came to L.A. for the Dodgers/Red Sox series. But no I only like the Dodgers, but occasionally I will root against other teams.[/quote']

 

You don't like the Red Sox but you're on this board. That tells me Red Sox boards are a helluva lot more interesting and insightful than other ones because we get a boatload of other fans on this and other RS websites which is fine with me. As far as hating the Yankees I might have a few decades head start on you in that direction, almost 60 years of loathing that team. As for the DH, I don't go to games to watch managers in action; I go to watch the players, and one thing I learned in my years of coaching, the DH allows you to put another person in the lineup and one less benchwarmer to bitch and complain about playing time. And, yes, that comeback by my team was the greatest ever in baseball history.

[seabeachfred]

So you are telling me that watching a totally overmatched pitcher hit is fun?

 

Jackson, maybe Vinny should have explained to you that he doesn't see it that way since Dodger pitchers over the years have had this nerve-wracking proclivity to give up hits to opposing pitchers and that hasn't changed much over the years. On the other hand, Dodger pitchers have always been pretty good hitters for their position---Newcombe, Drysdale, Sutcliffe, Valenzuela, Hershiser, etc,. So on both ends I really can see some of Vinny's points, but I think it was the DH that eventually turned the leagues around and gave ours the edge.

[Vinny]

So you are telling me that watching a totally overmatched pitcher hit is fun?

You do realise that you can pinch hit for them? It totally changes the strategy of the game. Giving the pitcher an extra inning because he's gonna be up to bat in the next one, walking the #8 hitter to get to the pitcher and see him burn you, taking out the wrong bat in a double switch, there is just so much more strategy. It's a better game and a more exciting one. Plugging in relievers and not having to worry about any lineup changes is not what I consider an exciting game.

[Vinny]

You don't like the Red Sox but you're on this board. That tells me Red Sox boards are a helluva lot more interesting and insightful than other ones because we get a boatload of other fans on this and other RS websites which is fine with me. As far as hating the Yankees I might have a few decades head start on you in that direction' date=' almost 60 years of loathing that team. As for the DH, I don't go to games to watch managers in action; I go to watch the players, and one thing I learned in my years of coaching, the DH allows you to put another person in the lineup and one less benchwarmer to bitch and complain about playing time. And, yes, that comeback by my team was the greatest ever in baseball history.[/quote']

I'm only here because of the whole Manny Ramirez/J.D. Drew fiasco. And yes this site has been very interesting and enjoyable I wouldn't say insightful, just more confrontational And honestly do you think having the DH makes for a better game than the NL one?

[EvilDonut]

I'm only here because of the whole Manny Ramirez/J.D. Drew fiasco. And yes this site has been very interesting and enjoyable I wouldn't say insightful' date=' just more confrontational And honestly do you think having the DH makes for a better game than the NL one?[/quote']

 

Its more exciting in its own "action packed" way. Its tougher on Pitchers to have to face a solid lineup through and through. They don't get easy innings every three or so. Why is it most pitchers do significantly worse or better when the change leagues? It does take a bit from the strategy though, ill give you that. And i enjoy interleague away games too.

[Mr Crunchy]

I like watching nl baseball as well

despite the talent level being about the same as american legion baseball i find it fascinating to watch the pirates play the rockies in september in front of 1400 people who were given tickets.

 

seriously

the national league is a f***ing joke,dh or no dh

the dodgers would be battling the drays if they were in the al east

[He Hate Me]

I'm only here because of the whole Manny Ramirez/J.D. Drew fiasco. And yes this site has been very interesting and enjoyable I wouldn't say insightful' date=' just more confrontational [b']And honestly do you think having the DH makes for a better game than the NL one?[/b]

 

No, having better players makes for the better game.

[BSN07]

With the JD debacle at hand, I agree with all who say lessen the years or make it incentive ladden.

 

Just some food for thought, but Alex Rios is said to be on the market, He wouldn't be a bad choice, young, good hitter, good D. Might take a third team tho, I don't see Toronto wanting to trade within the division.

[seabeachfred]

I'm only here because of the whole Manny Ramirez/J.D. Drew fiasco. And yes this site has been very interesting and enjoyable I wouldn't say insightful' date=' just more confrontational And honestly do you think having the DH makes for a better game than the NL one?[/quote']

 

Vinny, I don't know who you were on the DB Board and frankly I don't give a damn. You have contributed your share of good posts and info and hope you stay. Maybe, you can grab a few vibes and see your team and mine square off in the WS in 2007. As far as confrontational, the DB Board is in a class by itself with all the nasty and personal diatribes being hurled around with some of the filthiest language I've ever heard. If we are confrontational it is because we have guys here with strong opinions who aren't afraid to weigh in and let you know you're full of it if they think you're off your chair. At least, though these guys know their baseball and bring a refreshing breath of air to this board. As for the DH, as I said, I came to appreciate it when it enabled me to keep my pitchers off the bases and added another bat to the lineup. It worked fine for me and I became a fan of the position.

[seabeachfred]

I like watching nl baseball as well

despite the talent level being about the same as american legion baseball i find it fascinating to watch the pirates play the rockies in september in front of 1400 people who were given tickets.

 

seriously

the national league is a f***ing joke,dh or no dh

the dodgers would be battling the drays if they were in the al east

 

Crunch, about 20 years ago they were saying the same thing about the American League and since 1950 the NL had really taken it to the AL because they got the early jump on the top notch Black players starting with Jackie Robinson. With the advent of some of the great Latin ballplayers the AL starting fielding in the Mid 80's this has changed the picture completely. Now it is the NL that plays like a pack of rummies. We have the Dodgers out here in So.Cal and while they are a decent team they would get hammered all to hell if they played in the AL East. Times have sure changed and for us the better.

[Gom]

The DH sucks. Baseball should be the nine guys who are on the field. The DH takes away from the strategy of the game. I love the double switches, whether or not you keep your pitcher in the game or let him hit, etc.

 

Although the Yankees have Giambi as the DH, and he is one of the best in the league, I think that the game is more enjoyable to watch without a DH.

[redsoxrules]

The DH sucks. Baseball should be the nine guys who are on the field. The DH takes away from the strategy of the game. I love the double switches, whether or not you keep your pitcher in the game or let him hit, etc.

 

Although the Yankees have Giambi as the DH, and he is one of the best in the league, I think that the game is more enjoyable to watch without a DH.

 

so you like seeing a pitcher strike out all night long and bunting all time , not to mention over half the pitchers cant even friggin bunt , wich makes it even worse

[jacksonianmarch]

The DH has changed the game dramatically. Only good pitchers can succeed in the AL as the hitting is 9 deep rather than 8 and an easy out (or in the NL it is mosty 7 and 2 easy outs). That means the AL is drawing the better pitchers to them and allowing the crappy ones to wander. Any wonder why Jeff Suppan is an ace in the NL? How bout Weaver? Then, the teams needed to get hitting to battle the better pitching, so now the best hitting and pitching is in the AL.

[schillingouttheks]

He just wants Papi's defense to hurt us more than his offense helps us

[seabeachfred]

You know, as a man who managed baseball teams for close to 30 years I always tried to consider myself a purist and appreciated the finer points of the game---being able to take the exta base, giving yourself up to advance a runner, laying down a bunt, and then I read Red Sox Rules and knew a lot of this purist stuff has turned into a barrel of poo. Pitchers today cannot bunt worth a damn, and that goes for more position players and that makes the NL game less than it is cracked up to be. Then I see managers make these double switches and find themselves out of players except pitchers when the game goes into extra innings because they over managed during regulation time. No my friends, give me the DH, let the pitchers work for their outs and let the managers only manage when they have to. I'll now take the AL game over the NL any time.

[HeadOfSoxNation]

give me the DH' date=' let the pitchers work for their outs and let the managers only manage when they have to. I'll now take the AL game over the NL any time.[/quote']

 

I've gotta disagree on this point...sure, I love the fact that we have the best DH in the game...but if I had my say, I'd do away with the DH all together. My main reasoning for this is that I feel that it would GREATLY cut down on the number of brawls in the big leagues. Not that this has been a huuuuuuuuge problem...but do you think a guy would be as willing to throw 95 MPH up and in at a guy's head if he KNOWS that he's gotta get up that following inning and stand in the box himself? I don't think so. I'd love to see pitchers have to pay the piper.

[Vinny]

I like watching nl baseball as well

despite the talent level being about the same as american legion baseball i find it fascinating to watch the pirates play the rockies in september in front of 1400 people who were given tickets.

 

seriously

the national league is a f***ing joke,dh or no dh

the dodgers would be battling the drays if they were in the al east

Is the Devil Rays against the Royals any better? Everything runs in cycles and sooner or later the NL will catch up. No the Dodgers would be fighting the Red Sox and the Yankees. Everybody else is weak in the AL East.

[Vinny]

The DH has changed the game dramatically. Only good pitchers can succeed in the AL as the hitting is 9 deep rather than 8 and an easy out (or in the NL it is mosty 7 and 2 easy outs). That means the AL is drawing the better pitchers to them and allowing the crappy ones to wander. Any wonder why Jeff Suppan is an ace in the NL? How bout Weaver? Then' date=' the teams needed to get hitting to battle the better pitching, so now the best hitting and pitching is in the AL.[/quote']

No what it makes you have is a better complete pitching staff. You can't get away with having a weak bullpen. It makes your pitching top to bottom better. In the AL starting pitchers, a set up man, and closers are more important. Since you can't have 5 aces eventually it's gonna bite you.

[jacksonianmarch]

No what it makes you have is a better complete pitching staff. You can't get away with having a weak bullpen. It makes your pitching top to bottom better. In the AL starting pitchers' date=' a set up man, and closers are more important. Since you can't have 5 aces eventually it's gonna bite you.[/quote']

 

I think that the DH (and having the 2 richest teams in baseball) has completely shifted the balance of power vinny, and it wont be coming back.

[seabeachfred]

Well all of us can agree to just disagree on this topic and lay it to rest. I'm not going to convince anyone that the DH is a great move to those who don't think so and no one is going to move the pro-DH camp either. You guys can keep harping on the pros and cons; I am moving on to other topics. Keep at it if you wish.

[Mr Crunchy]

im not a fan of the dh either

but i'd rather watch the reggie jacksons and david ortiz's of the world than watch jeff weaver attempt to sacrifice a guy on 1st over to 2nd with 1 out in the 7th of a tied game

 

as far as the nl coming back to compete with the al??

i doubt it very very much due to the simple fact that more high profile large market teams lie in the al with the exceptions of the mets and dodgers and to a lower extent the stros cards phillies and cubs

the rest of the nl from dc to miami to cinci and pittsburg is just a barren wasteland of revenue

this isnt good for the game either

unless major league bball sets a salary cap in place you will have 75% of the teams knowing they have no shot at winning it all in march

sure

colorado san diego and san fran will be competetive till the end but thats due to the mediocrity of the league theyre in as opposed to how good they are